Mahmoud Khalil discusses lawsuit against Trump administration, legal battle

We had a busy morning so far. We talked to Governor Kathy Hochul. We were checking in on the city council hearing about the horse carriages. We just had that breaking news there. But we want to talk about something that is a very important issue for so many people, and it has been something that we've been tracking for more than a year now. We're talking about Mahmoud Khalil. He became one of the most recognizable faces of the pro-Palestinian and also one of the Trump administration's highest profile immigration targets. Now he's filed a federal lawsuit accusing Trump officials, the Heritage Foundation, and pro-Israel advocacy groups of conspiring to violate his constitutional rights in an effort to silence his activism and deport him. So he's saying that this was all a conspiracy against him and he's taken that part of his case to court while he still deals with his own court case. Khalil, who denies those allegations of anti-Semitism and immigration fraud, is actually joining us now to discuss the lawsuit and what's next in his own legal battle. Mahmoud, thank you so much for joining us this morning. Thank you, Dan, for having me. I guess first, your lawsuit accuses the Trump administration officials, the Heritage Foundation, pro-Israel groups targeting you, conspiring against you. What do you feel like is your strongest piece of evidence when it comes to that? No, that's a great question, actually. You know, when I got detained over a year ago, me and my lawyers were sort of surprised looking for answers about how this can happen. And we thought it could be, you know, like an agency acting on its own. But after revealing some documents in court, actually, a judge, a Reagan appointee judge in Massachusetts, found that government officials conspired together to deprive me of my freedom of speech. So that was already litigated in Massachusetts. And that judge, through the positions, through the government's own records, he found that he was actually surprised that top officials would conspire to deprive someone of their freedom of speech for one simple reason, which is to chill speech across the country. And our case is very, very simple, that the federal government should not be colluding with private groups to target and prosecute people for their First Amendment protected support of Palestinian rights. But for so many years, these shadowy and accountable groups like Canary Mission, Bitar and the Heritage Foundation, they have created these blueprints, they've created these plans, these plans to go after people who they don't like. In my case, it happened to be that I am a Palestinian student in this country. And in other cases, it could be someone else, a journalist, as we're now witnessing around us. So our hope is that this case will shine a light on who these groups are, and how they are working together with the federal government to shut down a growing, powerful movement for Palestinian rights. And Mahmoud, you mentioned it more than a year and a half ago, that you were taken into custody. And I just wanted to ask you, when you were first taken in, can you describe that feeling of what happened? I mean, when you came home, obviously, you weren't expecting this. And then you were in custody for a long time down in Louisiana. What were those conditions like? What was what was sort of going through your mind during that time? At first, to be honest, I was shocked that ICE was coming for me as someone who never committed a crime. I was really looking for answers at that point about like, what did I do wrong, especially that they said, the first thing they told me that my visa was revoked, and I did not have visa at that time. I was a permanent resident. So that was very reminiscent for me, to the days when I left Syria, Assad Syria, because I left Syria because of arbitrary detention, because the rule of law is not existent. That's why I fled the country to come here, looking for these principles. And to see that happening, to be honest, was shocking for me, even after the government brought their charges against me. They were baseless. We were like, just like, what's happening? What's really happening here? In terms of conditions in Louisiana, you know, the government wanted to get me out of New York as soon as possible, because in New York, there is a more fair judicial system, while in Louisiana, they mostly favor government positions, especially when it comes to immigration law. So that's why the next 24 hours of my detention, I was really on the road. They were just trying to get me out of New York as soon as possible before I challenge my detention. So when I got to Louisiana, over 1000 miles away from my home, inside the conditions were dire. I was put in a room of over 70 people. It was no one told me what my charges were at that point. But you can see around me like just the cruelty of the system that the vast majority of them were not criminals. They had no criminal records, just like me, yet they were called names by the administration that they're criminals that they deserve to be deported. Of course, the food was bad. All the conditions were bad. But like in principle, this detention itself is cruel in these cases, because these individuals were not criminals, yet the administration wanted to detain them in order for them to give up their fights in courts and with the immigration authorities, so that they can leave earlier. So they just wanted them to sign their deportation orders, so they can leave earlier than actually go and have their due process rights. And I want to talk a little bit, I know, obviously, your case is still pending, very high profile case itself about the allegations. But the White House says your immigration status was obtained through fraud and that it has the authority to deport you. Broadly speaking, what's your response? These accusations are baseless. The reality is that the Trump administration has never produced a shred of evidence that supports their allegations. And now we're talking about over 15 months since my detention. They never broke any shred of evidence that I misrepresented my application or any of that. And in fact, Dan, it seems that the White House can't even get this right, because these baseless allegations are related to my green card application, not my visa. They're talking about my visa. And I had my first visa to the U.S. back in 2018. And that was renewed multiple times since then, like I got it during Trump's first administration. So they continue to make up these baseless allegations and make up reasons to deport me because they don't like what I have to say. And again, this is what we're asking the court to do, look at the evidence, look at the merits of the case. And the immigration process is fully controlled by the Trump administration. There isn't something called a judge or a real judge in immigration courts. And just on that point, they're just like rubber stamping what the administration is doing. And on that point, Mahmoud, the administration has argued that your activism and talking about things that you say, they didn't like what you were saying, but they've argued that it crossed into supporting anti-Semitism. You've consistently denied that. Where do you draw the line between protected criticism of Israel or the war and what would be considered anti-Semitism? No, absolutely. Anti-Semitism has no place in our movement, and they've always spoke out against anti-Semitism. And they draw the line, when what we're saying, what we're talking about is criticizing Israel, criticizing the policies of government, not criticizing a religion or a people. But Israel and this administration are trying so hard to conflate these two things, anti-Israel speech and anti-Semitism, because I would say there's no argument. They have no argument to challenge what we're saying about Israel conduct, Israeli crimes. So they would rather silence us than actually deal with the speech that we have. And this is what's dangerous about conflating anti-Semitism with anti-Zionism or with anti-Israel speech. And I've been very conscious about that. And I'm proud to have built this movement with so many Jewish allies in this movement who are refusing that this administration and Israel using their religion and committing genocide, committing crimes in their names. And one more question on this, and then I want to get back to just one of the, some people have described the more interesting parts of the lawsuit that you have just filed against the Trump administration and others accusing them of conspiring against you. But something you did say and the contacts and connections that you've made with some Jewish advocates, but they're also just sort of looking back on that time, certainly Jewish students who felt intimidated during that time on campus. Do you acknowledge that some of those students felt unsafe? And was that ever your intention? No, I take safety concerns very seriously. Columbia University has commissioned an anti-Semitism task force. And when you look at these reports, most of the incidents were anti-Israel incidents. They had nothing to do with anti-Semitism. The fact that something makes you uncomfortable doesn't mean that it's unsafe, makes you unsafe. I feel very uncomfortable when I see an Israel flag or when I share a classroom with an Israeli soldier who was just back in Palestine killing my own people. But I don't go and manufacture fears about that. So what's happening is we are weaponizing safety and security in order to silence people. And they would continue to take anti-Semitism claims and threats very, very, very, very seriously. Because once again, the movement I am part of and what I'm advocating for is for equality, for justice, for really our shared humanity. So I wouldn't accept any hatred, whether it is towards a Jewish person or a Muslim or a Christian or anyone really. That's the base of our movement, that our universal human rights should be all respected. Let's talk about your lawsuit here just as we wrap up. Probably got four or five minutes left here. But your legal team in this lawsuit where you've accused the administration of conspiring against you to silence you, you're using a post-civil war rights law originally aimed at combating the Ku Klux Klan. Why has your team explained that this is the appropriate legal tool in your case? Absolutely. I mean, the KKK Act was passed by Congress during reconstruction to prevent governments or local governments from conspiring with the Klan to deprive a newly freed black people of their rights. And what we're seeing today, this private public plot that seeks to make public examples of Palestinians and their supporters to send a message to others who would dare to exercise their constitutional rights. So we can see the parallel here where you have private actors working actively with local governments. It's not only about petitioning because petitioning, again, is protected by freedom, by the First Amendment. But here what we're seeing is actively working together to deprive people from their constitutional rights. And in our view, Palestine has always been the canary in the coal mine. When they come for the Palestinians, they would come for others after. So let's take my arrest as an example. They started with me back in March 2025. But after that, they went after journalists. They went after federal funding for universities. They went after newspapers, law firms. So it's all part of the same conspiracy to deprive people of their of their basic rights as long as this government does not like the speech that such individuals and institutions are part of. And certainly, you know, most legal experts will say that that conspiracy bar, reaching that bar and proving that is certainly very difficult. So no small task ahead for you. And in your case, you're still facing deportation. And it seems like or it sounds like the Supreme Court at some point will be involved. Are you ready for that? Of course, I'm ready to advocate for myself to hold these who stole the precious moments or months of my life, missing the birth of my child. I want to hold them accountable. So I'm ready for the fight. I know this is not an easy fight when you have the full weight of the government coming after you, trying to deport you to make an example out of you. So I take this as, of course, a huge challenge. And that's why I'm fighting. I'm fighting because I believe that there is an opportunity to protect the Constitution of the United States, the principles that this country was founded upon. And this is why I'm fighting. And I mean, we'll see in court. That's what we want, because the government is trying so hard to to deprive me of even that right, which is to have my own day in federal court, not an immigration court where it is fully controlled by the government. Mahmoud Khalil just filed this lawsuit against the Trump administration and others. Thank you so much for joining us here.