One of the most common questions the guys is also one of the simplest: what program should I run next? It matters more than most people think. Stack the wrong two programs back to back and you leave gains on the table. Stack the right two and you buy yourself six months of near zero plateaus, real strength PRs, and a body that keeps changing every week. In this episode, Sal, Adam, and Justin stop making you guess and lay out the definitive MAPS program pairings for every major goal.
They cover advanced muscle gain, pure strength, fat loss for both women and men (and why the programming is different), total beginners and postpartum lifters, athletic performance, and the people who barely have time to breathe, let alone train five days a week. For every goal you get the exact two program combo, why that order works, what each program sets up for the next, and the most common mistake people make by skipping steps. If you have ever jumped straight into a high volume program and wondered why you burned out, this is the explanation you needed.
There is a real buy one get one free deal running right now at mapsbogo.com, and you pick the combo. $157 gets you two full programs. The guys walk through every recommendation, so by the end of the episode you will know exactly which two to grab.
In this episode: MAPS Anabolic anchors almost every combo: it builds the strength and training frequency foundation that makes every follow up program far more effective, whether the goal is muscle, strength, or fat loss. The single biggest mistake the guys see from customers: jumping straight into MAPS Aesthetic without running Anabolic first. Aesthetic's volume is genuinely high, and the body is not ready to absorb it without that base.
Fat loss for women is MAPS PowerLift, then MAPS Muscle Mommy. PowerLift builds the metabolic base and preserves muscle in a deficit, while Muscle Mommy targets the glutes, delts, and lower body that women most want to keep while getting lean. MAPS 40+ trades traditional back squats for box squats and straight bar deadlifts for trap bar deadlifts, cutting joint stress while hitting the identical movement patterns, and adds specific lifestyle recommendations for the higher stress loads that come with being over 40.
For beginners and postpartum women alike, the prescription is MAPS Starter, then MAPS Anywhere. Treat yourself as a total beginner no matter your training history, because the body control and positional strength you build here pay enormous dividends on every loaded program that follows.
The athletic performance combo is MAPS Symmetry first, then MAPS Performance. Symmetry's isometric and unilateral work corrects left to right imbalances and builds the ability to contract and control the body that sports demand, before performance specific training gets layered on.
In a fat loss phase, the real success metric is maintaining strength on the key lifts, not the mirror. Holding strength in a deficit proves muscle is being preserved even when the scale or the reflection does not show obvious change.
MAPS 15 paired with MAPS Anywhere is not just for the time crunched: the guys explicitly recommend it for anyone who is overworked, stressed, or grinding five to six day splits with diminishing returns, because scaling back volume often produces better results.
Chapters: 0:29 MAPS BOGO Deal Intro 0:44 Sponsor: Vuori 1:28 Episode Overview: Best Program Combos 3:11 Advanced Muscle Gain Combo 5:49 Why MAPS Aesthetic Follows Anabolic 7:43 Strength Goal Combo 9:10 Fat Loss Combos: Women and Men 9:37 Fat Loss for Women: PowerLift + Muscle Mommy 12:05 Fat Loss for Men: 40+ and Anabolic 15:59 Beginners and Postpartum: Starter + Anywhere 19:42 Athletic Performance Combo 21:03 Time-Restricted Combo: MAPS 15 + Anywhere
Mind Pump explains how to strategically stack MAPS programs over 3-6 month periods to optimize fitness results. By transitioning from foundational strength to specialized volume or sculpting, users can avoid plateaus and injuries. The approach is tailored to individual goals, age, experience, and lifestyle stress to ensure sustainable progress.
All right, here at Mind Pump,
one of the most common questions we get
is which program should I follow next?
Is there a better program to follow next
for my specific goal?
So here's what we did.
We broke down the MAPS programs
and put them together by goal.
What are the best combos of two programs
for each common goal?
Muscle gain, fat loss, strength.
But if you're a beginner,
what about athletic performance?
We put them together.
We're gonna talk about them today.
These are the best workout combos for you.
Let's get to it.
This is how we do workout partners.
Yes.
I feel like this is overdue.
This is probably one of the number one questions
that we get is what program to do next
or somebody who's never done a program
and is like, here's my goal.
What next program or series of programs should I follow?
And so what's cool is this kind of lays the plan out
for somebody for the next six months
or for the next three months if you already have one.
That's right.
And it does make a difference.
Because people will say, well, what's the difference?
What if I just follow one program after another?
What if they're both muscle building?
What if they're both athletic performance?
Is that the best combination for my goal?
Sometimes yes, sometimes no.
It really depends on how the programs stack together
and how they address each other's strengths and weaknesses.
So most MAPS programs are about three months long.
Some of them are shorter.
Some of them are shorter,
maybe five weeks or six weeks long.
But nonetheless, this is how we design our programs
is for them to be able to be followed one after another
to produce great results with minimal plateaus,
of course, minimal risk of injury.
But at the end of the day,
to maximize the goals a person's looking for.
What avatar do you want to start with first?
You know, let's start with muscle gain.
That's a real common one.
Yeah, very popular.
Yeah, and we'll say it's advanced muscle gain.
And I say that because this is somebody,
if you're listening and you're like,
I just want to build muscle for whatever reason,
either because you want to look a particular way
or because let's say you're trying
to boost your metabolic rate
and you have good experience in the gym,
you've been working out for a little while.
So you're not a total beginner.
You're not a beginner.
You've been doing it for a little while.
Like what are the two programs I could follow
to give me phenomenal results,
let's say over a six month period?
Yeah.
And what are the things
that you're taking into consideration
when you think of the two programs?
Like one, so it's not a starter type program
because they have some sort of experience.
So we want to get them into what we would consider
one of our best muscle building, metabolic programs.
And then also considering,
because we're pairing programs,
like the progressive overload,
the scaling of that,
and what that looks like over the course of two programs.
And so those are the kind of the considerations, right?
Yes, yes.
So to start with would be MAPS Anabolic.
So MAPS Anabolic is a great overall muscle
and strength building program.
It's also a great switch up from whatever you're doing now.
So oftentimes we have callers call in
who have been working out,
who have some experience,
whose goal is to build muscle.
I'd say probably eight out of 10 times,
this is the program we point them in the direction.
Yeah, and I think a lot of times too,
people are familiar with split type programs
and this introduces them to total body workouts.
And also that first phase is really shocking
and very effective for people to experience.
So I think that's why people really like
see the benefit of anabolic right away.
I'd say this is why, to your point,
I'd say well over more than half,
I think probably 75, 80% of people
that are interested in building muscle
tend to gravitate towards a split
and have never really ran a full body routine
or don't normally do that.
And so they get hit with a couple of things.
One, if they're doing some sort of an upper-lower split
or a traditional bodybuilder split
where it's one body part a day,
they're training four to six days in the week
and they're splitting at the body part.
Transitioning that person to a three-day week
full body type routine is such a curve ball.
The hardest thing is convincing that person
that's what they need.
But once they do that,
the increased frequency on the big lifts,
the strength gains that they see from that,
a lot of times too, less days in the gym
because this person's trying to gain and build muscle
or build a metabolism, huge benefits from this.
And one of my favorite things to introduce somebody to.
Yeah, so MAPS Anabolic would be the start.
The follow-up would be MAPS Aesthetic.
Now Aesthetic is also a full body strength training routine
but the volume is higher.
You are now progressively overloading your body.
So three months of MAPS Anabolic,
if you're feeding yourself right, getting good sleep,
and you're ready to take it to the next level,
then you follow that up with MAPS Aesthetic
which is also a full body routine.
But MAPS Aesthetic, you can spend more time in the gym
because of the focus sessions
where you could target a body part that is lagging
and add extra work on those body parts
on those days off in between.
Well, I think that's what it makes sense to now
when you're building muscle
to also emphasize parts of your body
where you really want to show off that definition.
I think this is a great follow-up to that
after you build that huge base of strength and muscle
and now we can kind of sculpt it a bit.
The biggest mistake that I've seen with our customers
that have followed MAPS Aesthetic
was not following Anabolic first.
And it's so good-
You jump right into it.
Yeah, it's so good that we're doing this in pairs
and explaining why I'll do this
is because the amount of volume in Aesthetic is really high.
And I would never want to take a client,
this is your first program is going to Aesthetic right away.
I'd much rather build them up from Anabolic.
I think they'll see far more benefits from that.
And so this really truly is the ideal progression.
Now, if you've been listening to the podcast for 10 years,
then you've heard us talk about the original three
was Anabolic Performance and Aesthetic.
And so we would talk about
how you're supposed to progress your way
up to that much volume.
But we haven't talked a lot about those three programs
in a row in a long time.
And that was like for general health and strength, right?
When you think of like the ideal pathway
for if I was training somebody for a bodybuilding show,
I would follow Anabolic first
and then progress them into Aesthetic
to reap the most benefits from building the muscle.
Totally.
Next, we'll say Strength.
So this is for somebody who,
they like building muscle,
but they really want to get strong.
They want to be able to lift as much weight as possible.
The starting program is also going to be
MAPS Anabolic for this
because Anabolic is this great
both strength building and muscle building program.
And then you're going to progress to our Powerlift program,
MAPS Powerlift.
This one-two combo, this is PR City.
This is PR City.
You're going to hit PRs in your Bench Press,
your Squat, and your Deadlift.
First off, you're probably going to hit PRs in Anabolic.
Then you move to Powerlift
and the PRs are really going to get crazy.
And it's just this perfect follow-up from Anabolic.
Well, I love this is the simplicity of it
and the hyper-focus of just pure strength output.
And so, yeah, you're going to get that good base
like from Anabolic in the beginning,
but yeah, you're really simplifying
and focusing all that on these big compound lifts
that are going to get you real strong.
Well, this is the pathway I would prepare someone to
who's even wanting to maybe even dabble
in the Powerlifting world and start.
That's right.
You're going to compete in the strength.
Yeah, you're interested in competing in that.
And even if you're not, this is the pathway,
but even somebody who's wanting to take it to the next level
and actually go compete,
I still would want to lay the foundation
with Anabolic first, then progress them into Powerlift.
And it's such a great segue from that program.
Anabolic does such a good job of laying that foundation.
And then the skill practice and performance
of just the main lifts in Powerlift,
like the combo of them together is like a great six months.
Totally.
Then we have fat loss.
And we broke this up into women and men.
And mainly because programming-wise,
women tend to want to develop different areas of the body
from men.
So that's really the main difference here.
And with fat loss, the goal is to keep muscle.
The number one goal with your strength training program
is to not lose muscle when you're in a calorie deficit.
And so we'll start with women.
Now, with women, I started them out with Powerlift.
Why?
Women don't train this way.
They often don't train like Powerlifters.
They're trying to lose body fat.
And MAP's Powerlift is going to keep them strong
and do a damn good job of maintaining muscle.
Well, and one of the best ways to build them metabolically
would be to get really good at these big compound lifts.
That's the metric that I love.
And this is why this is so great.
I love this combo too, of setting them up
for the next program where we can get more and more refined
in sculpting and like that.
It's like, let's build an incredible metabolism
and a strong base.
And then where we go from there,
opens the door for so many different things.
Which takes us to Muscle Mommy,
which is a very popular MAP's program for women.
MAP's Muscle Mommy, traditional muscle building program,
but there's more of an emphasis on building the glutes,
building the delts, lower body,
just kind of that focus that women are looking for.
And areas that they don't want to lose muscle
when they get leaner.
Like if you ask a woman, hey, when you get leaner,
what areas you really want to keep the muscle on the most?
A lot of them will say,
well, I'll sacrifice muscle here and there to get leaner,
but I want my butt and my legs to keep that muscle.
And Muscle Mommy's volume is geared towards that.
So, of course-
Yeah, what I love about these recommendations
is like somebody that probably hasn't listened to us enough
would assume immediately we'd be like MAP's Hit
or MAP's Cardio.
When in fact, the muscle preserving element to this
is so important in building up that metabolism.
So, these are great.
Well, and I would say Muscle Mommy was the first program
that we really started to reorganize
and change the order of the exercises
to fit a specific female demographic, right?
Like we took into consideration the feedback
from all the people that have gone through MAP's programs.
And a vast majority of women that talked about
building and sculpting their body,
focus points were like the backside
was the hamstrings, the glutes, the shoulders.
And so, even though exercises affect men and women
the same way as far as building muscle on their body,
the sexes tend to have different goals.
Men tend to want chest and quads
and that way women cared more about glutes and shoulders.
And so, we redesigned the way the programming is laid out.
And so, laying a solid foundation with Powerlift,
then transitioning them into this more sculpting
like program, such a great combo right here.
Now for men, now for Fat Loss for Men,
the beginning program can be one of two.
But I'm gonna take into consideration that
you're a guy interested in fat loss
and let's say you're over the age of 40, okay?
We have a program that's perfect
which is called MAP's 40 Plus.
And that would be the starting program
for Fat Loss for Men in that age demographic.
If you're younger, you could start with MAP's Anabolic.
Now, what's the difference between 40 Plus
and MAP's Anabolic?
Not much, not much.
The difference really is exercise selection.
When we took certain exercises and made,
for lack of a better term, safer or less risky.
Lowered the risk a little bit.
Yeah, so instead of a traditional squat, it's a box squat.
Very similar, same movement pattern, same thing.
The difference is with the box squat,
you're breaking up the negative portion of the rep
from the positive, breaking up that momentum.
Easier on the joints.
We're trading out straight bar deadlift
for things like a trap bar deadlift.
Still a hip hinging movement,
just less risk for the low back.
So again, if you're a dude that's over the age of 40,
the program you start with for fat loss, MAP's 40 Plus.
If you're a younger guy, you're okay with the other lifts,
start with MAP's Anabolic.
The other consideration that I think we did in 40
that's a little unique in comparison to Anabolic
was the lifestyle recommendations too.
That's right, that's right.
And the reason why I think your advice is great
is because when you're young,
you tend to get away with a lot.
Not the greatest night of sleep.
You can recover a lot easier.
Yeah, stress doesn't seem to affect you the same way
as it affects-
Or you just have less stress.
Yeah, or you just have less of it, right?
That's a better way to say it.
You probably have less or less high levels of it
in comparison to probably the 40 year old
who's got the family, maybe the career or business
and kids and all the things, right?
And so in 40 Plus, we put a lot of effort
and emphasis around lifestyle to help balance that out
and mitigate that.
And so I think that makes that such a,
which I can't tell you how many times
I trained somebody 40 Plus that the first thing that,
and let's take a example of a guy trying to lose weight
that understood working out, lifting weights
and had a pretty good idea of diet,
but really struggled with losing weight.
Many times it was the lifestyle changes
that we had to address first before their body would shift.
And so that part, I think,
is when it comes to fat loss for men,
I think the nice part about the 40 Plus
that's unique to being 40 Plus versus anabolic.
I think if I had a 20 to 30 year old person
that wanted to do fat loss,
I think anabolic is probably where I'd start them.
40 Plus with other considerations.
It's just geared towards that demographic much better.
Yes, yes.
And then the follow-up program, Mass Power Lift.
Very similar to the fat loss for women,
Power Lift is so focused on strength,
strength is a great metric to focus on
and pay attention to when you're in a cut, okay?
The mirror isn't so great because the mirror can lie to you,
but if you can maintain strength
or even get stronger in certain key lifts
while you're in a calorie deficit,
you are preserving muscle.
And that's why it's such a good metric.
And that's why I like Power Lift for fat loss,
both for men and women.
So that would be the program that you would have.
I love this here.
The one thing that is common sometimes though
is to not see gains because you're cutting for fat loss.
And so I think the one thing that I would communicate
to somebody is that,
listen, if you could maintain lifts through a cut
and doing Power Lift.
You're killing it.
And that's really the goal there.
Now, you occasionally see somebody,
and this typically is in the more novice lifter
who hasn't maybe gotten proficient.
Or maybe they're new at the exercises themselves.
Right, right.
And so, yes, it might be still novel to them.
And so you see them sometimes gain
even in the deficit,
which that is just literally them getting better
at the movement, which is awesome and amazing.
But I always like to set the expectations of,
listen, our goal is to just keep as much of your strength
that you've built in MAPS Anabolic or 40 Plus
through Power Lift.
If we've done that, we've done a hell of a job.
And if we've seen any increases,
we're absolutely killing it.
By the way, we have a buy one, get one free right now, okay?
You buy one at a normal price,
you get another one for free.
So go to mapsbogo.com if you are interested.
Totally.
Next we have beginners.
So you're a total beginner,
or it's been a long time since you've done any exercise.
We have the perfect combo for you.
And we actually have the perfect starter program
called MAPS Starter for beginners.
That program is designed specifically for someone
who's being introduced to strength training.
It is easily the most commonly advised program I have
for friends and family who are getting into strength training
whether, hey, I want to start strength training.
I've heard of the benefits.
What should I do?
I've never done it before.
Starter, starter, starter every single time.
It's dumbbells, a physio ball, it trains stability.
It's traditional strength training.
You're going to get stronger.
You're going to build muscle.
It's the perfect program to start with.
You just understand how to hold these positions
with your body, really anchor yourself down.
That's why the stability ball is really great
to be able to add in there, to train that
and to have that kind of control.
So you can build upon that so much easier
and more effectively when you have really good body control
and strength in position, which then will set you up
for loading a lot more weight down the line.
I remember when we wrote this program,
if we would have wrote it in probably the correct order
of like how we use it as coaches and trainers,
this would have been the first program that we wrote.
Of course.
Yeah, retroactively we did it.
Yeah, I mean, obviously we know it's not the sexiest
for selling and stuff like that,
but the reality is when we look back
at like the clients that we train,
most all my clients started like MAPS started.
When I think about the things that we built in that,
I rarely got somebody who was already,
oh, I've been lifting for the last three years
consistently helping you.
Yeah, let me hire you.
I normally got somebody who was very deconditioned,
either have never strength trained
or they haven't in years
and they're getting back at it.
And so really the first few months of training
looked like identical to what MAPS started.
The other thing that I would add to this category,
even though we didn't do this as a specific person,
but I think we'd all agree,
we would recommend this to us too, is post-pregnancy.
Even though we're talking about beginners right now,
I would say-
I'm so glad you said that.
Postpartum, you train yourself like a beginner.
I don't care how much working out you did beforehand,
because of the time off, because of the changing body,
you treat yourself like a total beginner
when you get back into strength training.
That's going to give you the best results, hands down.
Yeah, this is just top of mind for me.
I feel like we've got a lot of callers
in the last month or two that know they're pregnant
or coming out of pregnancy
or they've been out of pregnancy for like six months,
wondering when they're going to be back
to their normal self.
And I feel like we keep having the same conversation
of like, give it at least a year or two
to even expect to be like that.
And it makes me remember when Katrina had MAPS,
how I continually had to talk her out of like,
you're not ready for MAPS, black.
This is not the right program for you.
We could totally get away with doing starter
and we could totally get away with doing these programs
that seem easy to you,
but you are still not back to your normal self.
And so I can't stress that enough,
even though we're talking about beginners right now,
that even the most advanced lifter,
a female lifter that's post-pregnancy,
this is the pathway.
You're a beginner at that point.
And then the program to follow it up with is MAPS Anywhere.
And MAPS Anywhere teaches, of all of our programs,
it's one of the best for body awareness.
So you are utilizing some weights here and there
and some bands, but some of it is tension-based
and a lot of it is body weight-based.
And body weight-based movements have a lot of value
for somebody who's getting into strength training.
It's much better to start that way than move them
to the more traditional strength training programs.
And it's a perfect program to progress to
for a MAPS starter, for somebody who's a beginner.
Then we have athletic performance.
This is fun.
I love this.
Now, we have a program that is specifically designed
for athletic performance,
but I do think starting with MAPS Symmetry
would be perfect before we move to MAPS Performance.
Oh, I agree.
Again, to your point of the order of when we wrote these,
I probably would have started with Symmetry
and then into Performance.
Oh, totally.
Because it addresses a lot of those discrepancies
left to right, and it's a cool thing to add in
where everybody has mobility and range of motion issues
that we can attack that with just going through the program
and going through these unilateral movements.
Totally, totally.
When you talk about sports,
all sports are done unilateral stuff, right?
And so, it makes sense that...
Also, the isometric component.
Don't sleep on that either
for laying the foundation for an athlete, too.
So, the athlete to be able to contract the entire body
like that and do isometrics.
So, the fact that we started that program with isometrics.
It's literally what I did
with the high school athletes immediately
was the same thing.
Right, isometrics.
Then, we move into unilateral.
Then, we see how we express that towards the end of it.
It just, for the athlete, it makes a lot of sense
that that would be the first thing that you did,
and then you move into a more specific performance.
And then, Mass Performance is the follow-up,
and Mass Performance is very athletic-minded.
It is designed for the athlete.
So, it would look like this.
Symmetry, then Performance, and you're ready to go.
And then, finally, we have the people
who are restricted with time
and typically also restricted just with space or gym access.
Now, this episode is brought to you
by one of our sponsors, Viori.
So, Viori makes athleisure wear.
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They're comfortable.
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I don't, but they look amazing.
You know Viori.
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go to VioriClothing.com slash Mind Pump.
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And so, we have the perfect program for this,
which is MAPS 15.
MAPS 15, there's two ways you could do it, by the way.
You could do it either A,
with your traditional strength training equipment,
or you could do it with very minimal
strength training equipment.
The program is actually designed
to be able to follow either way.
The follow-up to that, MAPS Anywhere.
This is a great follow-up, one, two,
for somebody who's like, I don't got too much time,
I'm really busy, or this is new to me,
I'm getting into it,
and I don't want to make a bunch of time.
I want to get into it.
This is a great combo.
You know, I know we geared this towards time-restricted
because, of course, it applies to that
and is ideal for, obviously, someone like that.
That's why we wrote it.
But I do want to highlight,
I mean, this program has done so well,
and we've gotten so much feedback.
For results, yeah.
Yes.
It's been incredible.
And I think there's a reason that,
there's a couple reasons,
but one of the main reasons is,
we obviously have a bit of a bias
because of who you listen to the podcast.
So we attract more people
that are into health and fitness.
If you're into listening to a fitness podcast,
you're more than the average, for the most part.
I mean, some people stumble upon us
or get recommended to us,
but most people are like,
if you're listening for hours,
it's real positive.
Your knowledge base is probably pretty decent.
Yeah, and you're interested,
and you want to learn more, and you want better.
So we tend to skew towards people that like to work out
or enjoy working out more than average.
And I think what we've found in our audience
is that less is more for a lot of people.
And a lot of people have a lot of other things on their plate
other than just working out,
and they have fallen into the same trap
that I think all of us have expressed,
even ourselves at one point in our lives,
where you literally scaling back sometimes
ends up giving you better results.
And I think a lot of people test that.
So even though this is geared towards time-restricted,
I'd even encourage the person-
You could call this the stressed combo.
This is for people who have a lot of-
Turns out most people are overworked and stressed out.
Yeah, a lot of life stress.
If you've got a lot of kids,
you run a business,
you work long hours,
you have-
This is the combo.
You check any of those boxes,
you have a good distraction.
You have a job that doesn't get-
It's off time schedule all the time.
I mean, there's a lot of things that fall in this category,
and you typically like to go to the gym
four to six days a week.
I challenge you to try and do the MAPS 15,
this protocol right here.
So good for you.
Because we've gotten so much great feedback.
Totally, and then you follow up with Anywhere,
which wears very minimal equipment,
also saves time, is a perfect follow-up.
And so what we did is-
Here's what we did.
So these are recommendations that we have,
but here's what we did for you.
If you go to mapsbogo.com,
you can buy any one of those programs
and get any other one for free.
So you can actually make whatever combo you want.
These are the recommendations we have,
but if you have different goals,
you have whatever,
you can buy one, get one free.
It's 157.
157, which would normally get you one program,
will get you two.
So your choice.
Any one that we mentioned,
plus any other one.
It's mapsbogo.com.
It's buy one, get one free.
Go there right now.
It's 157 is the price.
You buy one, you get the other one totally for free.
Go check it out.
You can also find us on Instagram.
It's My Pump Media.