Fireside Chat Ep. 188 — The Churches That Refused to Kneel | Fireside Chat

Hi everybody and welcome to fireside chat number 188 Each week I marvel at how many we've done And I love them to be honest. It's my chance to talk to you completely spontaneously About whatever is on my mind and take questions from you about whatever is on your mind on rare occasions I have a guest And I emphasize the word rare because I really do like to have this time alone with you But I also emphasize it for another reason There's something special about the person if they are a guest on the fireside chat and I Can now say in this case actually love the person that I Will be uh dialoguing with This is let me tell you this is a very uh from my heart statement When I was a kid a lot of I realized a lot of things about life and about myself Already in high school And in high school and college, I I realized I had a very good geiger detector for goodness I had a very dear friend still do And he had a geiger detector for intelligence his first reaction When we would meet the same person for the first time he would go god that guy was bright or you know Say nothing And my I never cared how bright people were I I have a whole I should do a fireside chat on intelligence It just occurred to me. That would be a very important thing. It's wildly overrated in any event I did though and i've been right. That's the amazing thing. I've never actually really been hurt by a friend I I know a good person Pretty quickly. This is a good person He is pastor rob mccoy christian pastor of the Cavalry, no calvary, you know, I practiced that four times before the show and I got it wrong now And i'm not going to even have this edited out. I am okay with that boo-boo Anyway, the calvary, uh baptist. No not baptist. Just calvary church. I can be whatever you want. Yes, you could that is true Uh, he is one of the america's best known pastors because he is a fighter There aren't many fighters whether in religion or outside of religion is one of the subjects we're going to talk about He was also believe it or not the mayor of the city in which his church is located Uh, and that is mayor of thousand oaks. He was in the city council And he has achieved a great deal of fame or if you will notoriety for having opened up during The lockdowns and defied the authorities we're going to talk about that issue can a religious person specifically a christian Defy the authorities when the new testament seems to suggest that god has placed the authorities where they are So how does he justify such a thing? So there's a lot to talk to you about And I wanted to call him pastor or mayor and he insisted on rob and i'm totally okay with that Because we know each other for a while. I might add one more thing Let's give you an idea what a special man he is he comes in And look at what he brought me These are not only a this is not only a large quantity of cigars. I know cigars. They are expensive cigars And i'm mentioning this to give you an idea of the type of man He is but also to suggest that all guests emulate him in the future This is a beautiful precedent that you have set, uh for me, by the way, you don't know this My first what about 20? 30 fireside chats. I smoked a cigar and and then was it uh Facebook said you can't do that You can't smoke. So I said well if it's a joint, won't that be fine? I'm sure if it was a joint that would that there'd be not an issue That's the only reason that I don't anyway rob it is great great to see you and thank you for coming uh to uh fireside chat So let's begin with the some of the heavy stuff you did in fact Open against the authorities, especially in california And certainly local authorities where you did when did you open up your church? wide open was may 31st where we did no social distancing no mass, but Defying the may 31st remember of last year of last year. I just want to make that clear Thank you and and but defying the governor was april 4th of that of 2020 because that was our holy week And it was palm sunday where we take communion and and they said the church was non-essential and you can't celebrate communion Even if we followed cdc standards, which we did Uh, but we defied that wait, in other words, you mean you mean that people sitting in their cars? No, uh, so our sanctuary holds 400 seats We had 10 chairs And it took three and a half hours to do communion and we would clean it up after it wouldn't leave each of the elements Were separated We just followed cdc standards, but they said you still can't practice communion Costco everything else is open abortion clinics cannabis distributors liquor stores, but a church can't practice A sacrament and and all those other organizations aren't covered by the first amendment We are and it was our sacrament and it was it was our holy week so we did communion because If the governor wants to say that the church is non-essential christianity says That the church is the bride of christ and i've been married to michelle for 31 years You come to me and tell me my wife's non-essential. You'll be picking up your teeth with your broken arm that pastors should defend The the sanctity of the church and defend it its validity and it is essential and it's critical in community I'm going to return to the first amendment and and to my total agreement with you. Uh, as you know what what I uh I just was disappointed in how few uh pastors priests and rabbis Did what you did? so Before we go back to you. Do you have a thought on why so few did what you did? The the reason why other pastors didn't open up and love hopes all things pastors, uh By nature try to avoid conflict in their peacemakers, but they don't understand that peace isn't the absence of conflict It's the presence of god in the midst of the conflict Because you're going to have competing ideologies and there will be conflict But you're to stand your ground and you're going to have a personal peace in the midst of that battle They think peace is the absence of conflict so they avoid it at all costs if the governor says you're not essential you can't open They don't want to cause waves, but they need to understand They are the ones who who put forward to society what liberty is Liberty is not man's idea. It's god's idea the entirety of the scriptures both the jewish scriptures and The christian scriptures which also include the jewish scriptures 66 books of the bible cover to cover. It's all about freedom Setting the captives free in exodus Uh in in our what we call the new testament second corinthians 3 I think 17 where the spirit of the lord is there's liberty the apostle paul says Stand faster for in the liberty for which christ has set you free. He wrote that in prison It's all about it's a verse from the bible on the liberty bell from the hebrew bible Exactly that it'll ring throughout the land. Yeah, so If the churches aren't educating their people on liberty Right, so they'll answer Uh, and they do answer. I I know I know it they'll say. Oh, no, the issue is is Caring for others. I want you to answer that because you get that a lot so my argument on the radio was If you are Afraid of going to a church or anywhere else don't go don't go Or wear a mask or or and I didn't mean it to be cute I didn't mean it to be even confrontational But but if i'm willing to take that risk Why on what grounds can you stop me from praying? For a year and a half with fellow with with my fellow parishioners so so When I was brought up for contempt charges the judge at the time said to my counselor, uh, my attorney Instruct your client on the second great commandment and what he's referring to is where Jesus says love the lord your what is the greatest commandment? And he says love the lord your god with all your heart soul strength and mind And love your neighbors yourself on these two commandments hang all the law the prophets And the judge was referring to you're not loving your neighbor because you are exposing them to this virus, right? Right. That's what they say and and so I answered the judge and I said judge I do love my neighbor and it's coming at a great cost of three thousand dollars a fine per service by the government to defend uh To defend the abuse that are being quarantined with their abusers To defend the elderly that die alone to defend the children whose schools have been shuttered to defend the business owners It's estimated 60 of the restaurants in our county will never reopen There's no voice for them for a virus that has over a 99 survival rate depending on the county you're in And they're going to give you grief on that and probably take you out of the air but the bottom line is This does not merit the tyranny and the draconian measures and it's coming at a cost to us and then I I tell churches that say We love our community. That's why we haven't opened and we're not political. I go. You're political. You just choose to think you're not Because by yielding to tyranny you may have your homeless shelters open and you may have your food banks open And you're counseling, but you don't have your church service And you're yielding to tyranny which has caused california to have the highest homelessness the highest poverty the highest debt I mean we can go down the list of the miseries in california and I said You've helped create the problem and then you fish downstream To fish out the human heartache you help create by by bowing to tyranny your job is to defend the freedom of man God came to set the captives free That's our responsibility well, I would have kissed you at the time the uh In the name of safety you mentioned one thing. I didn't want to interrupt you I have real anger at the medical profession At the state at the at the governments of this country All the people who died alone My anger I i'm telling you it's lucky for them and I guess for me That I didn't have a loved one dying during this period. I would have walked into the the hotel and awaited arrest My father will not die alone. My wife will not die alone. My friend will not die alone dying alone Is slightly more cruel than the the miniscule risk of dying from exposure given exactly the rate you said of of survival uh in this case, uh We have become a meaner society because of safetyism and we have become uh Of course far less free and and and that americans have accepted it This was not the america that that I I was raised to believe exist so Your your arguments in my opinion Were telling so what did happen? Were you can can did they continue to to find you? Yeah, so so the first judge was political and predictable and he honored their emergency temporary restraining order which We violated and then we were brought into contempt charges We papered the first judge got a second judge who was more reasonable But he was he was getting ready to retire And he didn't want to rule in our favor because he'd make national news All he wanted was a drink with an umbrella on a beach somewhere Right. And so what he did is he reduced the fines And he didn't permit the supervisors and their attorney to demand that the sheriffs Lock our building and arrest us because they named me in a thousand congregants or visitors for citations Which if you have a concealed weapons permit you lose it If you have an nrtc scholarship and you get one of these citations you lose your scholarship if you're a government employee employee I mean these are they're serious Charges that they're going to bring on people coming to worship god And and they have to prove that they're justified in doing what they're doing that this this merits the emergency And at the time we did a freedom of information act and at the time of a little over 100 deaths in a county of 758 000 A little over 100 deaths attributed to covid only two Died from covid the rest died with the youngest victim Died of a fentanyl overdose But had covid so they called it a covid death death So only two one was a man in his 90s and a woman in her 80s And and that's justification to violate the first amendment 15th amendment I mean, it's endless what they've done to the small businesses to the churches the faith community It's unconscionable more kids have drowned in bathtubs in california that have died of covid And they have shuttered their schools taken away their livelihood their friendships We're watching child abuse is now estimated over 300 increase In our county because they and they've shuttered the two institutions that are mandated reporters churches and schools And there's still an increase in child abuse and they they don't even want to talk about it We the highest number of opioid deaths ever recorded in american history in the last 12 months That they they have blood on their hands This is unconscionable what they did and the churches should have been the first to stand and say no But they think that peace is the absence of conflict and that's their biggest mistake And then if you want to cover because I know one of your listeners Asked the question I was moved by it because it is the question that paralyzed nazi Germany and silenced the church and allowed This tyrant to devastate humanity And it's the same thing that's causing us As benjamin franklin said he who gives up his freedom for for for safety Deserves neither So go on the answer. So again, what we're answering is the christian Specifically christian argument that the new testament says that god Has established the authorities romans 13 that romans 13 that you have And by the way, I get this a lot from christians Even though they know i'm jewish, but they they know my respect for for christianity and you know, how do they answer it? so I I Forgive me for saying what I tell them and I say forgive me because I want you to answer it but but I I I said It is inconceivable to me That the god that I worship and you as a christian worship the god of the bible wants a christian To obey evil authorities and i'm not saying these people are evil But but at least let's establish that there is a level of immorality and tyranny does god so Does god really want a christian to listen to a hitler or a stalin? I I mean so I assume okay, so you give scriptural Basis for what I just said. Yep Uh, you're I think it was a 21 year old young lady, uh who asked the question. I thought it was great Uh, what's her name? Oh, okay, that's fine. Yeah, so this is I just want to give her credit because I thought it was such a great question Oh, well, we get great questions. I have to say. Okay. So here we go Hi, my name is amanda. I am 21 years old and i'm from greenville, south carolina So when the lockdown first started I was okay, you know with staying home we were trying to figure out this virus thing um but then as the week started going on things seemed a little bit more sinister and I started wondering if This would be one of the times that we should obey god rather than man when it came to going to church So, you know personally i'm just a very quiet person I'm not loud and I don't like to you know cause trouble but i've been trying to figure out as a christian When do we stand up against the government when do we say no and maybe what were some of your thoughts when you decided to not obey lockdown orders I I loved every Aspect of that question the tenderness of her heart. Yeah, she's great the sincerity of wanting to know what the scriptures say And and and the desire of obedience, but also not wanting to lose liberty Amanda correct. Yeah, so for amanda There was a minister he died in 1766 and john adams said this minister was responsible for launching the revolution All of the clergy on the eastern seaboard at that time looked at romans 13 Which says god appoints all positions of authority were to submit to them Because he appoints them and were to submit to them, but it also goes on to say and they're appointed for our good jonathan mayhew Said if they're not doing good, they're no longer the authority Right, and that's where they get the idea in the declaration of independence not for light and transient causes But when you're saying that the church is non-essential You got a problem and and jonathan mayhew When he's when he wrote that and did that exegetical study of romans 13 that inspired the revolution He said disobedience to tyrants is obedience to god and that was the moniker that carried the revolution Was it from him from him? Oh, what a great And now That was back when they were dealing with king george and they were dealing with violations And now we have a constitutional republic And these folks governed by our consent And one of the reasons why I stepped down from the city council Is because I knew i'd be violating the governor's order. I knew that the council would hold me they would censure me And I knew that they'd be violating their oath of office because when I took that oath of office I swore to defend the constitution against all enemies foreign and domestic all elected officials don't Are all elected officials governed by our consent? The sovereign in america is the first three words of the preamble of the constitution We the people So romans 13 says god appoints all positions of authority the authority in america now in a constitutional republic is we the people? Elected officials governed by our consent and they're constrained by the seven articles of the u.s constitution and they must honor the 27 amendments When they fail to do that It is our right and our duty in our birth certificate to push back And say no And they violated that constitution the 15th amendment the first amendment and many others and and everyone was silent because Rights are like muscles if you don't exercise them you lose them and if you don't understand the constitutional we're losing them Dennis, I that's clear. Can I run this by you? The fascinating concept to me that inspired me to be both political And to be in the pastorate came out of the book of exodus You see three to five million jews who are enslaved in egypt crying out to god for deliverance. They're in slavery God sends moses From 80 to 120. He led them He sends moses And moses confronts pharaoh pharaoh's response is who is god that I should obey him And then he he doubles the brick output and reduces the materials And all of the slaves complain to moses and want to kill him because people want freedom. They just don't want to fight for it But god still does what he set out to do because the cries of the people he came to set him free 10 plagues miraculous Parts the red sea drowns pharaoh's army manna every morning water where there wasn't quail blown Of course their shoes don't wear out their clothes don't wear out but the greatest miracle of all Moses goes up on mount sinai gets a downloaded moral app Comes down and the nations in debauchery golden calf rave party happening And he instructs the children and places the moral law in the center of the community So from the moral law comes civil law That's where you get all the other books of of of the pentitude But moral law was right there. You don't covet. You don't steal all that laid out. You don't murder And here's the greatest miracle Three to five million people lived together for 40 years without a police force or a standing army in the stairwell of of the law school of harvard It's a plaque that is used every year and commemorates. I think a 1911 commencement speech And it says the law Is the wise restraints that make men free? And you think how do restraints make you free? You apply restraints or towards evil in order to pursue excellence So patrick mahomes when he won the super bowl a few years back I was sitting in a chair like this with a big bowl of potato chips and a large coke with the belly getting bigger I would never enjoy football at the level of excellence that patrick mahomes was enjoying it Because he applied restraints. He didn't eat the big bowl of potato chips. He was out practicing And that's the imago day. We've been creating the image of god And and we're to excel and we apply restraints towards those things that enslave us in order to pursue freedom to become magnificent creatures designed for flourishing right life Well as as as you will see in my commentary on exodus. Did I get that wrong? No, you got every word right the i'm just doubling your point Uh in in judaism you go from passover to pentecost Or shavuot in hebrew, which just means weeks you count seven weeks. You actually it is a law in the torah The pentateuch, uh to uh to make a blessing every day for seven weeks. This is the fifth day This is the 27th day and so on Why are they so organically connected? Because there are two aspects to liberty Liberty from external bondage and liberty from internal bondage Sinai is the liberty from internal bondage exodus is from external bondage You if you can't discipline yourself, you're a slave to to your nature Which is by the way completely lost in secular society completely and it is the essence of our problem That people blame america not their own natures for their problems in a nutshell that that to me is everything So that's why I my my hope is that that christianity have have a a revival I mean, I hope judaism does too obviously, but there are far more christians than jews in this country And there are far fewer of both As you know nuns n-o-n-e-s is is what uh, what more and more young people identify as And that to me is is the root of the issue But I want to say another thing about the liberty as something that I I have come to realize uh Liberty is a value not an instinct People rather be taken care of than be free. That's right I I remember the first time you said that it just blew my mind because I saw that in exodus They wanted someone to take care of them. They didn't want to contend for freedom. Let me go back to egypt The food was better. Yeah, they actually said that we had garlic and leaves. Yeah, so i'll you know slaves have uh, You know 24 7 care That's what basically that they were saying Yeah, if you if you want to if you want free housing and a bed and three meals and go to prison, right? That's that's yeah, which some do. Yep I'm going to tell you something now that you don't expect Uh, it's it's sort of going to come out of left field But I think I need to tell it to you So there was something about jews that non-jews don't know And certainly jews of of my generation and maybe you know, 20 30 years younger the holocaust had a a very uh, Traumatic it's uh, I in some sense a lot of jews have ptsd in a certain sense when when you know that the most civilized place on earth europe Exterminated two out of every three jews living there including babies That's pretty traumatic. It's awful and so At the same time there were a handful of people who did rescue jews who risked their lives to save a jew cory tenboom So right right passed an email or didn't specific but but he he did his he opposed the nazis So here's my point. That is not known jews instinctively many jews Think when they meet a non-jew Would they rescue me? I still think that way believe it or not under under terrible conditions So this is my belief you christians who defied the authorities on covet Are the people I would ask first? to Violate evil laws and rescue me. I trust you more than I do others jew or christian If people are going to bend On safety, they'll certainly bend when there's a gestapo Nobody was being sent to gulag. Nobody was sent to auschwitz Nobody was knocking on their door and murdering them and they still bent to the irrationality Of the of a minuscule percentage of people under the age of 80 dying Of this and they still bent And that is why it is frightening to me if they are scared of the authorities on this They'll certainly be scared of the authorities if it ever became a nazi or a soviet type authority I would knock on your door Because you prove to me you listen to god and not the state you're absolutely right and You know greater love has no man than this in the lay down his life for a friend When michelle and I talked about defying the governor's order or I should say the the restraining order And being brought in for contempt The friday or the saturday before that I talked to michelle and her comment was basically similar to victor marx's wife I would rather Be a widow than be married to a coward And we had counted the cost we're going to lose our house. We'll lose our church. We'll get audited Uh, they're gonna make issue of our kids They're gonna I mean death threats going out to your car and seeing a note in your windshield. Good luck starting your car all of those things Were you had that oh, absolutely so you get you get for having church services You have no idea the stupidity What are they going to do threaten me with heaven? I mean really that's just so stupid But I asked the attorney Tell me everything That that we're going to lose And I was in the airport in sacramento and he went down the list and I had this massive pain in my shoulder I tried to get away to to a lake for a day or two And he goes down the list and then I stopped and he stops I said is there any more and he goes well And he he listed more three or four times. He went back and forth. He goes. I can't think of anything else and and michelle and I At that point we just said all right. I know you can't counsel me to break the law But i'm going to tell you right now i'm going to break the law And and i'll face whatever caesar wants to give me But will you be there to defend me and he said absolutely And and the pain lifted and this is the most amazing thing to us I wasn't afraid Because once you've surrendered it, there's nothing they can take. That's right Oh, uh, you're talking to the converted on that one and and and with you you you Bet your your life I would be there. Well, I know it it's it's I I have no doubt And not only for you who I love right? No, but for a stranger. No, no, not because i'm your friend But because you know what god wants you to do that's all that matters My point was my friend and a man. I adore I was doing it for the protesters that sunday Who were yelling at me and I said i'm doing it for your freedom of speech. Yeah, no kidding I love my enemy. They're not the enemy. They're the opportunity I I I I want them to know this this is so you can do what you're doing disagree with me, but i'm doing this You're a better man than me. I don't love gavin newsom Just for the record, I I don't hate him. I don't hate him. Okay. Well, I got you to move a little bit I don't have overwhelming feelings of joy. Let me tell you another thing that I think when as I talk to you uh christians and jews who are religious Obviously are worried about the the decline in religion in america. So let me just say this If if synagogues and churches had said we are open You don't want to come we are not telling anybody to come we are not telling any of you It's a religious obligation to come but we are open Because here is the data here are the data on who is dying And we think the risk is minimal and the loss to your life of not having a religious service in a religious community For a year and a half is much greater than the loss to your life of this minuscule risk Of dying from covid if you are at all healthy, even if you're 80 and healthy so that would have ultimately Said to people who are alienated from religion Religion matters. Yeah If religion is sheep and most rabbis priests and ministers are sheep uh, then Why be religious? Yeah, you're worried about your social media following you're worried about all these other things and the I i'll give you an example of the group of churches I belong to it's called calvary chapel and they started in 1968 in california with chuck smith He pulled away from the four square church And he looked out at a sea of humanity of all the hippies that had checked into eastern religions and started, you know drug use And they were burned out And and 68 was an interesting year reagan was governor in california I think we had the fourth or fifth largest gdp. We just completed the california aqueduct of marvel and engineering Produced more cotton than the entire south combined Uh, I mean this was the state of the future But in 68 bobby kennedy was shot 68 reverend king was shot He had the milai massacre the ted offensive the following year you'd have the kent state shooting and a few short years earlier Jfk was shot. So all these young people who had promised hope and change all their heroes were dead and they were burned out on politics and and You're watching communism and socialism infused in the country and it's being torn apart And chuck looks out at all these burned out people and he deliberately avoids politics because they're burned out But he goes back to a simplistic teaching of the scriptures and that's what calvary chapels are known for verse by verse chapter by chapter Book by book teaching everything the whole council of god cover to cover And he experiences ten thousand percent growth. There's now 1800 calvary chapels around the world south of van nuys There's more calvary chapels than duncan donuts And it started here Ten thousand percent growth and that's conversion growth not transfer growth These are all people first time come into a faith of any sort harvest crusades with greg lorry 52 years into this How's california benefited from this massively growing church Well, we no longer have the fourth largest gdp. We have the fifth or the sixth We have the highest gas tax sales tax income tax corporate tax We lead the nation in debt you combine the next four largest states debt doesn't equal the debt of california We we lead the nation in homelessness and in poverty And we lead the nation in abortion transgender bathroom bills. No fault divorce It's awful and I look at churches and I go where's the power of the gospel you've abdicated Matthew 16 18 When jesus says upon this rock i'll build my and everyone says church when he's talking to peter The word is in church that didn't come till hundreds of years later And it was tyndale who was hung and burned at the stake for translating it properly He said assembly because in the greek the word is ecclesia or ecclesia And and jesus co-opted a secular term. He didn't say synagogue. He didn't say temple He used a secular term that had been in greek culture for hundreds of years And it was literally the city council In greece where the citizens would gather they would fast They would offer fire or some sort of sacrifice They'd spend time in prayer and above the door before the citizens would gather for the welfare of the city and the laws that they would establish The the two words isonomia and eleutheria liberty and justice or liberty and equality And he says to him upon this rock I will build my ecclesia and the gates of hell gates Enslaved people the gates of hell will not prevail. I've come to set the captives free And when you start to see when people start to see that there is the ability To to have freedom like america 244 years unprecedented In the 6 000 years of recorded history. Everything's been an oligarchy We have more patents more nobel peace prize winners more symphonies you go on an elevator An american invented it and if that building's air-conditioned an american invented it And if you fly to a country where that skyscraper is that plane was built by an american invented by an american freedom Is having choices thomas jefferson said But liberty is doing what's right Until you do what's right You'll never have choices But those choices can enslave you And and so i'll leave you with this last thought If your child comes home from school And this is a difference between morality and character or liberty and freedom Your child comes home from school and says mommy daddy all the kids in the school called susie fat But I didn't You would say that child that's That's a very moral thing to do But where's your character? The child will say what do you mean? Why didn't you tell the other children to stop it? Character is doing what's right Morality is not doing what's wrong all that's necessary for evil to prosper for good people to do nothing character and is coincides with liberty Do what's right then people have freedom that's How many how many churches how many of the pastors? I mean, can you count them on one hand is Can you count them on 50 hands? How many others opened up like you did in the country I don't know the answer. It's not a rhetorical question I'm, well in california when we had pentecost sunday and may 31st and jack hibbs kind of led the charge and I'd say a thousand churches opened but then when they came down hard those churches went back and kind of closed up and did their social distancing Uh charlie kirk and I worked together and that that's one of the reasons why I adore this guy He navigates in the world of the political arena in a pluralistic society. He's got Homosexuals in his in his organization churches You know don't want him because of that And the reality is do we relegate people? That don't hold to these aspects of our life to a secular progressive mindset or can as it says in galatians 3 The law is a school teacher and a guardian to point us to christ until faith comes And our founder said the laws of nature nature's god that if they want to row In the stream of liberty And they want to defend the unborn We'll deal with the faith side later I'm i'm with you This is war to set people free And and they're gonna they're gonna be You know, whatever sexual preference or the struggles in those areas when they come into the church. We'll deal with that But it's the laws of nature nature's god and the concept of freedom that's intrinsic to every human heart That awakens people so you have an awakening before a revival And what I love about what charlie's doing we started this thing called turning point faith Churches are awakening to their responsibility in the ecclesia or the ecclesia the public square That for moral law comes civil law And we have a responsibility to the entirety of the community and not making the gospel the good news the salvation principle of christianity myopic or truncated That you raise your hand you're like god bless you I see your hand and you check off the box and you get their tithe money Jesus didn't say make this make converts. He said make disciples. He didn't just say make disciples. He said make disciples of all nations That's constitutions boundaries ideologies And and so we're instructing pastors with turning point usa faith. Okay. What does the scripture say about immigration? Because everyone seems to say that the church is supposed to open the borders But anywhere in the scripture where the word immigration is used or foreigner foreigner or stranger it's always for the point of assimilation Right. That's certainly true. The the you want to come to america? There's there's seven articles of constitution become an american, right? The left is is telling americans not to be american. Yeah, you're black You're gay You're you're hispanic You're white The in fact if you say we're all american, you're called a fascist And a racist of course, well, you're a racist just by being white you don't have to do anything. Yeah, i'm apparently systemically That's an achievement by birth And so I had this is the idiocy. This is the idiocy. We're supposed to believe as if of course if you had any control of my of an immutable trait see I just want to get back to the point, which is of course While you're here Because and by the way hundreds of churches are are seeing this and joining us. Is that right? Yeah, it's exciting By the way, just a word about charlie kirk. I adore the guy me too. And uh He he puts it very beautifully. He said turning point usa is the army and prager you is the air force That's right, and we both we both are organizations. We we feed each other. We we love each other. I speak at his conventions uh, we have him on uh on prager you uh, it's our our introduction to each other charlie and I Serendipitous. I I call it a god thing My very first significant conversation with charlie was all about you You're his hero how much you've meant to him how you mentored him He he just could not stop seeing and that we'd had a friendship endeared us to each other that I had a friendship with you is Seriously, dennis you you're the glue in this whole thing. Well, you bless me more than you know Very touched if I do that means a lot to me People like you and charlie that's that's a very big, uh Compliment to say the least We need uh, we need people like you so I have an interesting question that That I don't know the answer to and i'm not sure that the answer is knowable So when I meet people like you and I have or I have people like you on the radio Like I had I today I had I had a doctor on she's a uh She's at sloan-kettering cancer center in in in new new york. She's a big doctor and she she's simply, uh descents from the This Blanket of nonsense that the medical establishment has told us about covet So i'm thinking it's a courageous woman. Yeah, and you're a courageous Don't deny it. I know christians have a problem with pride I'm jewish. I don't have nearly the problem that you do on that But uh, so the question I have is Were you born this way? I'm, serious. Were you simply born with a courageous nature? You were you you were prepared to give up everything I mean, that's a fact and you could have they could have really ruined your life the authorities in in in the draconian state of california So what do you think when you look at yourself in other words? Were you like this at 12? Did you have a revelation at 22? How do you explain you? uh I was very self-centered and selfish young I was committed shocking. Yeah, none of us start that way. Yeah I was I was an athlete so I knew discipline But I grew up in coronado, california Which is a navy town. My dad was a navy captain two or three tours of vietnam We're in church, we weren't a church-going family, but they were my dad ran for city council My mom was president republican women. My dad was president rotary We walked precincts. We participated in campaigns. I grew up with that. I was a republican longer than I before I was a christian And and I watched their involvement in the community and I was touched by it and my mom was patriotic and it touched her life And then I would meet guys At our christmas party every year. I remember admiral stockdale With with his his leg that was broken Sticking straight out and and the party was so crowded, but we'd have to have a walkway for people to get around my godfather Who i'm named after rear admiral robert broussard early was at the time. He died at 100, but at the time He was the highest ranking survivor of the attack on pearl harbor. He was lieutenant on the uss casson december 7 1941 and and I had I had gone for a run for the assembly just following in my parents footsteps after I realized I have a responsibility when I became a man And that was a conversion to christ. I I had an awakening So i'm running for the assembly and I don't know my elbow from my earlobe when it comes to politics But I couldn't take people where I wasn't willing to go myself And my own party is carpet bombing me in the primary The party I I had been a part of my entire life And and I I was going to miss my my godfather's 100th birthday He was living in coronado in the house He lived in for 50 years and my mother had died of lung cancer. My father was in a home with alzheimer's He was the patriarch of the family for all intents and purposes so I don't have any money left to contend. I don't want to go out to my mailbox and see another vicious mailer And I drive down to coronado And i'm discouraged And I sit down with him and he was still driving at 99 not well, but he was driving And he'd do 100 sit-ups through the through the entire day because he said movement was life And he looked at me with his booming voice and he said how's it going? And I said uncle bob I'm out of money. I'm getting carpet bombed by my own party I feel like i've led these folks on a rosy road to nowhere and i'm complaining And he puts his hand up and it's shaking with age and I never heard him angry in 50 years And i'm named after him. He puts his hand up while i'm whining and he goes stop it It paralyzed me There's nothing like being spanked by a 99 year old man And he looks at me. He says you don't know tough I was 16 years old in the great depression. We didn't know where our next meal was going to come from And had it not been an appointment to the naval academy. I would have never received a college degree And you rob being a history major don't realize this But we had I think he said the 17th largest military on the face of the earth because we were in isolationist mode And he said that day december 7 1941. They sank half our pacific fleet and they sank my ship The harbor was on fire and I was pulling my shipmates out of the harbor dead And the next day we took on a two-fronted war against two fascist nations Brought them to their knees He said they lifted that pacific fleet from the bottom of the ocean and floated into tokyo harbor for the surrender And then he said this i'll never forget it we were Liberators not occupiers We asked for only enough ground to bury our dead and we came home We cut federal spending we started the greatest industrial revolution in your lifetime He said so quit whining and go finish what you started We've had 244 years of unprecedented freedom Why am I going to deny my children and my grandchildren Our cowardice is selfish Because a nation grows great whose citizens plant trees of the shade. They'll never know It's not about you and me It's about the ones behind us And I saw that in that man And in my dad Memorial day 19. I want to say 74 75 My dad says get in the car And I was 9 10 years old And he had been in vietnam And I was the youngest of four kids by seven years. I didn't know this man He was always gone in my formative years We're driving in the car and I wanted to hang out with my friends for the three-day weekend And we drive from coronado north on the on the On the five freeway and we get to pendleton. I don't know where we're going We we go through the gate. They get a crisp salute from the marine At the guard gate because my dad's a navy captain. They see the the bird And we drive into the bowels of pendleton and we come to this sea of tents as far as i've ever seen My dad says get out and we walk down and there's a table with a bunch of card files and more marines They salute my father And he gives them a piece of paper. They look through the files and they said Tent whatever and we walk through A sea of vietnamese as far as the eye can see Smells and sounds i've never known We get to the tent And major nguyen comes out He salutes my father. He says major. There's there's no place for that. Now your family we're going home He says captain i've married since we talked. He says get your wife. Let's go and out comes mrs. Nguyen She was from a rural village didn't speak any english major nguyen did because he had dealings with my father in vietnam You get in the car my father and the major in the front i'm in the back with mrs Nguyen, and i'm just trying to make her smile and joke and she's scared and nervous We get home I'm, sorry We get home And mrs. Nguyen is a newlywed She wants to please her husband. She's in a new home and my parents had just remodeled The kitchen and my mother Was meticulous she would vacuum and you'd have to fly from one room to the next not to make footsteps in the lines on the carpet and my mom Would not permit fried food or the smell of it in the house and mrs. Nguyen is frying fish And it catches fire And she does what She does what any woman in a rural village would do she kicks it into the ground catches fire on the carpet She's panicking She's embarrassed. My mom puts a fire out and i'm thinking you are gonna die And my mother does nothing And i'm confused And I turned to her later and said mom. Why didn't you get angry? She said rob, they lost their country We can replace the carpet That's america That's what I am who I am i've had heroes History has inspired me lives have touched me. That's why I love you I'm glad I asked I have nothing to say. I can't talk much anymore either I can I can only uh Thank you for that answer and What they what is lack lacking Is perspective that's what you were given. Yeah I mean when people to tell me, you know kovid You're gonna you're gonna give everything up. You're gonna let people die alone You're gonna give up liberty. You're gonna believe drivel like masks outside And be a sheep when when guys died on normandy beach having nazi bullets tear them in half and And and shoot their testicles off. Yeah And and this is what you're bugging me with kovid well Maybe there's maybe it's almost inevitable That if a society gets too free and too secular and uh too rich That that that that people are preoccupied with trivia it's what Excuse me. It's what The scottish historian robert tightler said was a tightler cycle from from bondage to freedom No from bondage to faith faith to freedom freedom to abundance abundance to apathy apathy to complacency complacency to bondage and You've got to insert as oz guinness points out and I think eric metas is the the triangle freedom faith virtue freedom to stop that cycle We we've got to awaken and and change the perspective. We're too enamored with The temporary and the baubles and the trinkets that the greater gifts of freedom for generations to come And not bondage because freedom can lead to bondage if you don't apply restraints towards those things that enslave you. Yeah the freedom to pursue excellence But and there are so many ramifications when I think of kids. I think of kids all the time I know my father Would have said you're kidding me I'm gonna suppress my life because of this And he was in the navy too in world war ii and He was on he was on a transport exactly what the kamikazes tried to destroy because they were bringing so many soldiers or marines over And I thought about this the whole time. I I am I am going to bend before this it's It's a virus And I think of the kids and I think of the kids kids who have scared parents And kids who have unscared parents? Who's the luckier kid? Just from that perspective the parents who kept their kids from playing with kids for a year Locked in a house For no reason how many as you pointed out more kids are dying in in drowning. Yeah, then then they are from covid And they did that to have a scared parent is a curse it's a curse I didn't have scared parents. I you you just made me think about that telling me your story with your parents That's exactly right. By the way, there's no question. My mother my I could match you mother for mother Your mother would have you fly over the rug that the carpet that she had just vacuumed. Okay I don't know if you had this my mother kept the The the couch in the living room in plastic You win I do win I never actually sat on that couch As long as I lived in my parents house till till uh, the till college till the end of college I never sat on I sat on the couch. But of course if you wore shorts you became attached to it in the summer Yeah, so you avoided it in the summer your skin was You you would hear yourself Getting getting off the plastic it's like it's like one of those fruit rolls you just peel it off Yes That's great. No, you win. I went on that one, but but we're tied on the on the parents who taught us What matters? And what to complain about? That's a biggie. Yep uh you know, this is another arena of uh, Of where you stand out and where uh It it should be noted uh the uh the christian support for israel Which it is Not only theologically Called for that wouldn't be enough even for me, but but morally I mean That there are christians who think hamas Is the good guy By the way, there are jews who think that No religion has a monopoly on fools I have to say that we discussed that earlier. Yes, exactly but but I I I I do want to I do want to mention that as as another source of my my admiration for for what you do Do you do you feel that that's weakening? I I think that this season has created as vody bachman's book called fault lines. It's created a chasm between churches that are pursuing uh yielding to to tyranny and fascism thinking that they're You know Submitting to romans 13 And that they're not contending and they're avoiding conflict and they think that's peace and they're surrendering truth And peace is coming at the expense of truth And then on this side of the fault line are churches that are awakening these churches their attendance is dropping Their social media presence is dropping. These churches are exploding every church that's joined us We've had 400 growth I was just talking to a pastor in in the san joaquin valley His church has doubled in growth and they were already at a thousand or two thousand And it's not just people fleeing these churches that have bowed to tyranny uh, it's it's it's Folks that are have never darkened the doors of a church like skaters and surf surfers Whose skate parks have been filled with sand and whose beaches have been closed during this and they Their streams of liberty have dried up so they go upstream and where the spirit of the lord is there's liberty And they come to the source And they go why are you open? I mean i'm not a church goer, but why are you open? One of my favorite signs the day we violated the restraining order a guy held up the sign. He says it took this shi To get this atheist to church Hmm Because liberty is intrinsic in every human heart. They just don't know the price of it and some are unwilling to pay it But when they see you standing for it and they see you appreciate it, then they're drawn. That's what i'm saying churches that stand up You can't alienate the alienated. That's an old phrase of mine. Yeah So if the people who are already alienated from churches, so that's all right that they're alienated But but there are people who'll say why you stand for something If religion doesn't if religion is the same as the state who needs religion I'll just worship the state. Yeah, it it. Yeah, it's like a ted talk with music if it's If there's no conviction, by the way You mentioned jack hibbs and I and I wanted to say for for the record that I adore that man as well as do I? He's a very very special Human being can I put a shout out to my youngest my son michael who has listened to every Single one of not only your fireside chats But all of your teachings because he had to catalog them for charlie kirk And he's the one who said you like nicaraguan cigars and that is a bag of nicaraguan. That's right I noticed that and he that i'm very I was wondering how you knew that my son michael He adores you. He is how old is your son? He's 19. Oh, then we'll have a cigar together. He would love to he said that That would be The greatest experience of his life would be to sit down with you Well, he's a smart kid too you did good my friend Well, this was as moving to me as I suspect it was to everybody watching My goodness geiger counter has been vindicated Once again God bless you, my friend. I love you very much. Thank you. See you next week everybody Thank you for watching this video to keep prager u videos free Please consider making a tax-deductible donation