WHATS WRONG WITH THESE TWO HONDA GCV 160/190 ENGINES? FORENSIC AUTOPSY TEARDOWN DISASSEMBLY VERDICT

hey guys how you doing it's Henry and mowers and blowers welcome to another episode this episode is a continuation of my last episode is where I uh attempted to take this uh Honda engine and mount it onto this uh deck that I had that I found a little while back uh turns out that I got a flywheel that I needed to complete this engine so I can see if it runs from a subscriber thank you Angel and also we realized that once I put it on there there was a tremendous not a tremendous amount but there's quite a lot of play of the flywheel on the crank shaft and because of that play the air gap is compromised to the Magneto so the distance between the Magneto and the flywheel is compromised you can move it you can move the flywheel left and right it it that's a tremendous amount of play um what I kind of remember is that uh with Honda engines the GCV 160 the crankshaft actually has a ball bearing in it you know uh real balls in a bearing right that holds the top part to the top cover of the engine block so maybe the ball bearings are bad which is why we have so much play there's no way you can start this engine because when you pull the recoil starter pull rope it grinds on the Magneto so there's no air gap at all you know which is why we're not getting in spark which is why this engine we we weren't able to even turn it over from testing so today I mean I think there's definitely something badly wrong internally in the engine right and uh because of how curious I always am I always need to forensically dissect exactly why it doesn't run you know and usually I tear apart all the engines and we discover whether it's a compressed piston ring or really bad scoring to cause no compression or whatever reason uh broken connecting rod which is what's wrong with the GCV 190 engine that I have over here we'll we'll take that one apart too just to see the Carnage inside but right now we do want to figure out why there's so much play from the flywheel to the Magneto which is causing no spark which means we can't run the engine here as you saw from time lapse I removed the engine along with the gas tank and the top covers and all that here this is what I was talking about um so [Music] look it's harder for me to show you this but look there's like a millimeter of play all around and this is the reason why um because of this loose play the flywheel was hitting the Magneto can't have play like that and initially I thought it was the seals but the seal is not leing anything then again this is the top right and bottom if you move it around there's it's okay there's a little bit of play but that's that's from the front the top movement that's causing the play as you can see the seal is good there's no evidence of any kind of oil leakage coming from here so I mean I think definitely there's some there's something defective about this engine in internally and my problem is that this has play crankshaft moves like that therefore it hits the Magneto and you can't start it you know even rotating and stuff with this play you'll probably not click crazy so uh I mean this is what I believe we can't get this started because you can't get any uh spark because the Magneto hits the flywheel so I have no other choice but to remove we're going to split this engine in half as you know the Honda GCV engines they're split diagonally see that line there that is the this is the bottom sump block this is the top you have to split it in half in a sandwich I don't know why they designed it this way but I have to drain the oil and then we'll we'll split it in half I going have to take some of this linkage off and all that other stuff I just don't think we're going to be able to U use this engine unfortunately and uh it's a shame because like I said I got the flywheel from a subscriber hope hoping that we would able to use this to get this engine started and use it on that that lawnmower deck that I have there but anyway uh this video is all about tear down taking this apart and taking that engine apart over there too a dissection video some people like to watch stuff being taken apart you know uh it's fun so I'm not going to time-lapse it cuz you wouldn't see you wouldn't be able to see everything I'm doing so like I said the oil in here I checked was really trashy super dark super black and as you can see there I mean I mean it's going to look black but I could see it it's it almost looks gray which tells you what the gray is usually aluminum shards grinded Material off of something so we definitely have some kind of I mean I think because it's not super dark black it's almost gray which would explain you know you have some kind of trauma or defect internally that would have a mixture of you know metal shavings and stuff minute very microscopic shavings that cause the oil to not be completely black but rather gray it's still going to be kind of uh messy but majority of the oil is out I'm going to flip this upside down cuz that's how you can uh access the sump bolts I might have to remove the linkage here so I'll remove the carburetor first 10 mm sandwich I say sandwich because once you remove these bolts this this this I'll show you it's really quite difficult to get it back on here again once you take these bolts out so first part of the sandwich is the slice of bread right connected to the vent that's the um air cleaner air filter base so this wasn't connected onto the carburetor at all so we would have found out that uh it wasn't going to run on its own here you have the tensioner spring that's not connected to the throttle lever I'm going remove this linkage all by itself because this is actually a useful part that you would need to rebuild a Honda engine that's the carburetor with the gasket this is the throttle this is the throttle lever this is the choke and as you see it you move this and it opens up the choke if it's not under there it's at full choke flap opens and closes that way this is one of the many gaskets that go on this there's also a spacer too seems to move okay uh looks like this thing has that wax thermal thermal wax insert over here where uh heat in the engine block once it's started builds up and this actually pushes this which pushes that which I guess opens the you know choke flap that's how it works but I can tell that this is very old and maybe that wax thing doesn't work looks very clean inside here I can see the valve looks very clean it's 10 mm it only four on the bottom I don't see any others let's go on the side now you got one here these are outers are the outers shorter longer than the inners slightly so we'll separate them case we have to put this back CU watch if I open this up and nothing's wrong with it I guess I would uh try to put it back together again maybe not maybe so I think that might be it eight it might have been taken apart already unless this is the stock gasket does that make sense to you guys with Honda the amount of quality they have would they silicone it with RTV silicone to make the sump gasket I doubt it I think this has been taken apart before and now I'm just going to pry the two pieces apart [Music] there we go uhuh all right okay upon further inspection found something so remember I told you that um this is the governor lever and it's not connected to anything it doesn't connect to this Governor gear at all and right around here I found this just floating around sitting there it broke this is the governor shaft it broke this is supposed to be touching the governor gear and it broke snapped right [Music] off see busted so I actually have another one of these this uh bottom part the bottom sub I have another one of these not sure if it has this intact I'm not sure but uh I decid I I decided that this has definitely been opened before see there's no way Honda would silicone the gasket like that so somebody has been in here for sure but I decided I wasn't going to do that because look there's a lot of wear on this you still have this tremendous amount of play look at that play that's a ton of play right loose and sloppy and then if you look at here here's the damaged end of the connecting rod because it's missing the Slinger right look at the play here the play on the Journal of the crankshaft it's tremendous play this would knock like crazy see that so so I'm not going to try to put another sump on here with the governor lever because this is this is this is trashed okay whatever happened to this slung around here and damaged some stuff I don't really see the damage right now other than the obvious wear that you have here between between the top uh cover the connection to the crankshaft and also the connecting rod to the bearing Journal crank Journal there's tremendous amount of play here so if you tried to use these same Parts again it it wouldn't work because um let's take this off the end off and look at the condition of the bearing between the end of the connecting rod and the journal bearing to the crankshaft because we're definitely not going to use uh not going to put this together again I just wanted to see what was wrong with it you know and guess we found [Music] out [Music] [Music] I [Music] all right well my forensic autopsy is complete we now know why there was so much play so um when I think the oil Slinger spike broke off of here got in the way of all the moving Parts knocked off the lever to the governor which made this engine spin out of control and cause it to wobble causing this crankshaft top journal to be damaged you see all that scoring around that top shaft there that's what was causing the play too much material it's grinded off of that that's supposed to be super smooth as you can see there's tons of grooves on there because of the wobble it caused scoring onto the crankshaft bearing Journal as you can see that there's wear there which would definitely cause a knock which in turn would damage the inner bearing of the connecting rod also causing the Piston to move in directions other than in and out as you can see the bore of the engine block is badly scored all around as you can see where the housing of the top crankshaft Journal goes you can see that all that material has been worn away also it's no longer smooth there's tons of deep grooves in there which causes the play because of the play the flywheel moves therefore hitting the Magneto causing it to touch and scrape when you pull the recoil starter and then because it's touching it doesn't get any air gap therefore no magnetic field therefore no spark which means it won't turn over so this engine is duny that's right this engine's dun ski I feel a whole lot better now cuz I probably would have spent another couple of hours trying to figure out why it wouldn't turn over if it doesn't turn over with in a significant amount of time with the knowledge that you know of how to turn it over probably won't turn over so the only way you're going to have to figure it out is to do a forensic autopsy on this engine tear down disassembly just to see what's going on inside my first indication that it wasn't going to be a good engine was because this the SP Spike on the oil Slinger gone so if this is gone somebody's been in here the evidence was there because of the silicone around it somebody was in here before whether it had the spike on here or not uh it had some damage to it which caused somebody to go in there and you know Hondas you got to be a basically a PhD in Honda technology for you to work on Honda engines they're so hard to work on if you have a problem and that's that's why I had very low confidence that I would ever get this engine running given the um you know the suspected stuff of what was going on like this Governor lever being so stiff and hard that's what she said well it's probably not screwed on too tight but I think the trauma of the lever being broken off I mean this went through a lot of uh trauma to break to break this thing off I mean something would have hit it really hard for it to break off cuz it's designed to be pretty strong so it broke off snapped in half like that you know and because of the trauma to it the shaft that goes inside this block is now bent or curved or not straight therefore making this lever hard to move you know what I mean completely makes sense so while this is a okay sump I have one already and it has a broken lever so I'm going to chop this carburetor with the gasket I'll still keep in my parts spin this timing belt here it's hard to remove without moving everything else in here and I don't think I would ever work on a Honda engine because it's just too much trouble for what it's worth I mean it's a push mower engine for goodness sakes I find push mowers on the street multiple multiple times during the summer so it's not hard for me to find engines for my decks and I just don't want to work on Honda engines but I will strip the muffler the side stuff the throttle bracket the screws all that stuff I will keep those in case I need them in the future but I don't I'm not going to save this well why would you save this the uh the the the part where the crankshaft goes in is completely damaged and stripped along with this damaged crankshaft junk and also the piston piston has tremendous scoring as the bore reflects right so this Piston's dunky I mean it's small enough for me to keep into a bin I'll just keep this connecting rod in case I might need it the bearing in here the connecting rod doesn't seem too bad it's just missing the oil cylinder I don't know if that's all that important you know what I mean so I will keep this for the connecting rod in case I run into a Honda engine in the future has a busted connecting rod oh that's way too much trouble to put back together again uh also it may not be the same 190 and 160 may not may not be the same as the flywheel is not the same difference between the 190 and 160 could be different in that way uh or a difference between a push mower engine and a pressure washer engine is going to be different uh I might of damaged this flywheel a little bit due to the Magneto scraping it but it was damaged a little bit already uh it wasn't a perfect one but like I said I got this from uh subscriber I appreciate it from uh Angelica thank you Angelica if you want this back let me know all right I'll mail it back to you but you know I'll hold on to it if you don't want it uh for something in the future and Magneto I mean I I'm pretty sure it works still even though we didn't get any spark out out of it but we know why there's other reasons why this wasn't working properly to to let this work but I think this works that was pretty interesting I mean I've actually never seen it this way I've never seen the the amount of play here that that's pretty cool actually so let's take apart the uh 190 GCV just for shits and giggles and see the Carnage [Music] inside [Music] all righty this is what I'm keeping I pretty much stripped this I didn't take any the valves or the timing gear or anything like that cuz I I honestly would never put them back together again so garbage this is damaged right from the governor lever garbage this is a bad crankshaft I did keep the gear doesn't take up space but that's damaged I'm going to keep all these screws cuz you never know when you need Honda 10 mm screws uh bolts now I'm going to dismantle this one we already know it has a blown connecting rod but let's take it apart and make [Applause] sure [Music] all right you guys saw from time lapse that was pretty fast I've uh taken apart the one 90 GCV engine man oh man oh man check it out here's the crankshaft see all the aluminum buildup on that um journal from the crankshaft um you could actually remove it with uh muric acid and maybe wet sanding it you probably get it to work but not for me not putting together Honda engines junk look at how dirty this oil was sludgy too as you can see this lever is intact see that was the lever that was broken from the other one this one's attached and it's nice and smooth this is actually okay here is part of the end to the connecting rod uh I actually have another one of these already so I'm definitely not keeping this this one I don't even know what I'm going to do with that one there uh Honda engines are not my favorites do not like them at all here's the other half of the sandwich as you can see very dark oil I cut this uh belt just to be able to get that thing out here I'm going to I'm going to pull I'm not going to I'm going I'm going to pull this uh oh man I can't even get it out that's what she said it's stuck in there I can't even get it out [Music] man and get it out I'm not going to get it out there's the uh piston broken connecting rod stuck in there pretty bad huh garbage oh I want to show you guys something in this Carnage I actually found something that's interesting oh here we go here's the spike the um oil Slinger on the first engine 160 there's the spike that broke off oil Slinger pretty cool so while I wasn't able to use any of those two Honda engines that I had it was super interesting to see what caused them to fail uh connecting rod on the 190 and we had uh I think what stems to be um trauma to the oil Slinger which the debris caused the rest of the damage to the crankshaft wearing on the top part of the uh engine block causing the wear on the connecting rod as well as the different vibrations going into the bore and the Piston being scored and all that all contributed to possibly either the G Governor shaft breaking or the oil Slinger breaking and being sosed around a moving engine which caused all that trauma so that engine's dun ski the other engine has a blown connecting rod that's dun ski saves some parts you know just to use for the future maybe or sell it on eBay whatever and uh I wasn't able to make a lawn mower from a deck and a couple engines so um got a lot of parts and if you guys need it let me know and I'm just bringing all the excess project parts that I brought from the back into the garage to try to fix my projects including these wheels and gas tanks and stuff from the snowmobile bring it back to the shed again so I can clean out my garage finally anyway I hope you guys enjoyed my forensic dissection autopsy of those two Honda engines I hate Hondas when they work they work great but when they don't work it's a nightmare to get them working you have to be a Honda tech to understand any of that stuff so over engineered but not knocking the engines they're great engines but I wouldn't want to work on them you know hope you guys enjoyed it we'll see you guys next time on mowers and blowers see you guys next time on MERS and blowers