Infrarotsauna - Die heftige Wirkung! (kaum bekannt)

Above all, there was a very exciting study in 2014 that simply compared it. How does the detoxification of heavy metals, but also of softeners, and how does the toxin load behave? It showed that it was sometimes separated up to 25 times as high over the sweat as over the urine. One of the reasons for seeing that cancer in firemen in America has increased exponentially, especially lung cancer, and then you have built into this fire station central infrared sauna, because you have seen more and more that regular sweating via infrared can really lower the toxin load. Welcome to today's interview. My name is Sören Schumann and I am interviewing Johannes Kettelhort today. And we are talking about the topic of sauna. What are the possibilities? What are the differences between different types of sauna? What effects are there? How can you use them? What are the pros and cons? I invited Johannes. Johannes is the managing director of Clearlight and a passionate biohacker. So he deals intensively with the topic of health and how to optimize it on various levels. Johannes, before we get started, what should the listener or viewer know about you? I'll start with moin moin. I think you can already tell that I'm from the north, so I'm here in Hamburg. I am the managing director of Clearlight, although I would like to add a little star to that. Clearlight Saunas International, that is, Clearlight itself has been around for 25 years, it's actually an American company, and nine and a half years ago we said, hey, we have to bring that to Europe, Australia, New Zealand. We also have two other small projects, products, brands, we also do a podcast ourselves. We just talked a little bit about the ice bath, so I have my fingers in there a little bit. Exactly, and I'm actually an engineer by background. So I actually did an engineering degree, that's why I feel very comfortable in the wavelengths, in the frequencies, in the different sauna specifications. And I am happy today that we can illuminate the topic together. Okay, illuminating also fits well with the topic of infrared, for example. Where we are already at the keyword, there are different types of saunas. There is the Finnish sauna, there is an infrared sauna, there are probably other types of saunas. Maybe you can explain a little bit about what there is and what the differences are. Well, I think the sauna, that's the nice thing, we grew up in northern Germany or in northern Europe, Germany, Austria, Switzerland, and the sauna simply has a high cultural value. I think each of us, or many of us, were probably at the sauna as children, at least when I was a child, when I visited the swimming pool. And the sauna is quite classic, first of all a room to sweat in. Somehow there are also the old high cultures, that is, the Indians already had it in China, there were first ideas of a sauna in Russia, there are the banyas. So I think no matter where you look in the world, this ritual of warming up your body, sweating over it and seeing it as cleaning, that has been around for centuries, if not for thousands of years. And over time, of course, it has developed a little further, that is, we have different types of saunas today. I think you know the classic Finnish sauna, as it is also very popularly referred to, where you have rather high temperatures, that is up to 90-100 degrees. There is the banya, which is also a rather hotter sauna from Russia. Then there is the bio sauna, where you have lower temperatures, and there is also an infrared sauna. And they all differ in terms of temperature, as well as in the way in which the heat is generated. And we mainly do infrared saunas, or infrared heating cabins, or infrared cabins. It's funny, there are actually three terms for it, which all mean the same thing. And as the name suggests, it's not even about generating a room with hot air, as is more the case with the classic saunas, but it's about using infrared, so light, de facto, to warm up the human body. That is, it's more about warming up the body from the inside and not generating 70, 80, 90 degrees of air temperature. And this actually reveals a variety of differences, both in the operation, in the design, as well as in the health effects. And yet, the goal remains to sweat properly in a good infrared sauna, to stimulate the cardiovascular system, and to do something good about your health, so to speak. So we have different technologies behind it, and accordingly also different ways of working. You said, with the normal ones, what is the majority, saunas, or? Yes, I think so. In English it's saunas, but in German it's saunen, exactly. Okay, I'm probably going to slip out of both in this conversation. I think so too, it's okay. So the ambient temperature is rather increased, so you said 70, 80, 90 degrees, so to speak, and thereby warming up the body. And with the infrared sauna, it's more like this, the infrared radiation penetrates the body, and thereby heat is generated in the body. Exactly, that's right. You said that absolutely correctly. And I think we'll dive a little deeper into this whole infrared topic. But de facto, if you look at it from the outside, then we have a hot air in a classic sauna, 70, 80, 90, 100 degrees. We go in there, 10 minutes, 15 minutes, do two to three sauna courses, and then cool off or take a break. With an infrared sauna, we tend to have air temperatures of 40 to 65 degrees, maybe even 70 degrees, if it's a particularly hot infrared sauna. And we don't do two or three runs, but we wait, so to speak, you are also longer in this infrared sauna, because this infrared light warms the body from the inside. That means it takes a little longer for the body to start sweating, but then, when it starts sweating, the core body temperature goes up even further. We have a heart-circulation stimulus, and that can take 20 to 45 minutes, if necessary. I don't know about you, you also have a sauna, an infrared sauna, I don't know how you use it, but I definitely sweat like crazy after 20 minutes. Yes, I definitely sweat a lot and like it very much in there. I always let it preheat a bit first and then go in, sometimes I only go in at 50 degrees, so to speak, and then I don't look at the clock that often, I say I rely more on my body feeling, up to a certain point where I say, okay, now it's more like, it's exhausting, and then I go out, but I would guess 25, 30, 45, 40 minutes or so. Or if I go in earlier, at a slightly lower temperature, for example 40, 45 degrees, then I stay in there a little longer, because the temperature is lower at the beginning. Yes, that also makes sense, and I think it's always a funny question, because 45 or 50 degrees is actually not hot, if you think about a classic sauna. And yet, or just because it's not so hot, this infrared light can be absorbed well and over time this body warms up. And in my head I still think it's crazy that you can sweat so intensely at 45 or 50 degrees, because the way I was raised, it was always 80, 90 degrees, then I really start sweating. And that was such an aha moment for me at the time, where I somehow understood how this infrared light works, or how light generally works, and that it doesn't have to have these high temperature ranges. And I can only say from my own experience, I find infrared much more tolerable. Because I think partly with the other saunas, so with the classic ones, it's very much about the circulation and also partly about the mucous membranes. I noticed that with me, back when I was still very sick, I did that once, and that also partly knocked me over, that after a few days I also had the feeling that I had some kind of infection or something. That probably also had a lot to do with my constitution. But how would you rate it, the tolerability for normal people? Yes, I think what you said makes a lot of sense. On the one hand, of course, you have to say very clearly that every person is different, and everyone has a different threshold of tolerance. But I hear it from some friends who say, I can't go to the classic sauna because I'll get sick afterwards, or I can't go to the classic sauna because I'll get a headache afterwards. And that's usually an overreaction of the body. Insofar as, while we go to this sauna to sweat and relax, and that, of course, is also good, it is pure stress for the body. You also like to say positive stress. That's ultimately everything where you send a stimulus or a stress signal to this body. It is also called hormetic or homesis from the Greek. So, ultimately, to give the body a small dose of poison so that it gets stronger. That's also a thousand-year-old principle. And that's what all these cold showers, infrared sauna, sports do. It's always actually stress for the body. And when the body, so to speak, reacts negatively to it, when you get sick, when you get a circulation, when you get a headache, then the tendency is always the reaction of the body to say, hey, that was too much for me. And that is, of course, tendentially more difficult to control. Because if this sauna has a temperature of 70, 80 degrees, then you can't say, I want to have 60 degrees now. But if you're in it, then you stay in it. And most of the time you do that in a group. You don't want to go out again so quickly because you just went in there. And all of a sudden, zack, you're practically over your cervical threshold. And then you can, when it comes down to it, just pay this price. We hear it a lot, because in the end, initially, at least, we got a lot of approval, especially from women, who say something like, I can't stand this hot sauna, I'm getting dizzy, it's too hot for me. But now, in fact, more and more men say that this classic sauna is just too hot. And that the infrared sauna is actually a similar, good cardiovascular impulse or can reduce stress, but is, so to speak, gentler and more continuous and therefore easier to control. For myself, and then I'll keep my mouth shut, it's not just an either-or question, but I have an infrared sauna standing next to me, which I use three or four times a week. But I'm also doing a fitness study, where I also like to do a hot sauna once a week. But I do notice that my body gets more used to this infrared sauna. I find it much easier to integrate in everyday life, and we can talk about that a little bit. Why that is. And I hardly ever have any detoxification, body aches or, you know, so it's difficult, I think, to get this negative impulse from the body, because it was just too much. And yes, a normal sauna, so to speak, you can't put yourself into your own four walls. Or it's more difficult than an infrared sauna, isn't it? Yes, exactly. So I think that's, for me that's why, so to speak, that's actually one of the main reasons why I'm such a fan of the infrared sauna. Of course, I also know the health effects, but above all, I just find it much easier to integrate in everyday life. And yes, one of the essential points is the one you just mentioned. Most of the time it's, so to speak, such an assembly or a connection, a plug-in principle, which you can basically simply build up and down again. We have 230 volts, that means we don't have a strong current. It doesn't have to be installed somewhere firmly in a room. And most of the time it's basically cabins with which you can move around again. So I think I moved around three times with mine, for example, and if I should move around again, then it comes with me, then I build them together, take them with me and that's it. And it's just here in my apartment, in an extra room. I have no problem with mold, because, so to speak, there is no moisture. It's a 100% dry heat development. So the only moisture is sweat? The sweat, exactly, the human sweat. And I think that's very pleasant, also, so to speak, for the apartment. I can put it in the basement, the attic, the bathroom. I can also put it on the terrace, theoretically, if I have a cover for it at some point. I can put it in the bedroom. And that makes this sauna very usable, or very versatile. And the second point is that because such a cabin is a maximum of, I'll say, 1,800, 2,000, 2,500 watts, that is, of course, dependent on the size, consumes, and only has a preheating time of 15, 20, maybe 30 minutes, depending on how hot you have it, Mark, so to speak, is this cabin very easy to integrate in everyday life. That means, I come home, put the thing on for 20 minutes, and then I go in for 40 minutes, and in less than an hour, and, so to speak, with a low power consumption, I somehow sauneered. And that is, of course, phenomenal, because classic saunas tend to take one to one and a half hours, usually have a strong power connection. It's also great if you do it as a ritual, but I don't think it's really practicable in everyday life, because it just has this considerable effort, this cabin, or the sauna itself. You just said you need a little less than an hour, or let's say an hour. What are the electricity costs there? If you now say you have a two-person cabin, then you are at 2,000 watts. I think if you just say that one kilowatt hour costs 30 cents, and then we have, so to speak, one hour times 2,000 watts times 30 cents, that's 60 cents. So we have, so to speak, 60 cents per hour of use, and I would say that you have 20 to 25 minutes preheating time, and then you use the cabin 30 to 35 minutes. Then I get exactly to my one hour and have, so to speak, 60 cents per day. If I do that three times a week, then I'm at 1.80 euros, or let's say 2 euros. If I do that four times a month, so four weeks, then I'm at 8 euros additional costs per month. That is of course simply unbeatable. If I go to the public sauna now, then I pay quickly, I think I like 20, 25 euros, depending of course on the city and where you live. Okay, then I would like to talk to you about the effects of the sauna, or especially the infrared sauna. We have already indicated some things, for example, that certain detoxification functions are stimulated, that it can have a relaxing effect, cardiovascular systems, but maybe we can go through it a bit more systematically, what are the most valuable effects for you in your opinion? Exactly, I think I would like to pick it up once and so to speak explain how this infrared light actually works. Infrared always sounds very fast, very negative. There are also some sauna providers who somehow like to say, infrared has cancer, you have to somehow take more sunscreen, and unfortunately there is also a huge lobby, which, I think, associates this topic a bit negatively. So maybe for comparison, the sunlight consists of about 49 to 50 percent of infrared. That means, or even if we sit in front of a campfire and we have this pleasant warmth, that's infrared. If we are in front of a heater, that's infrared. That means, we actually have infrared everywhere in our environment, even here as humans. So if you rub these hands against each other and you hold them against each other, then you actually notice that we as humans also emit heat ourselves, and the heat we emit is also infrared. That means, it's something that's natural or in nature, actually de facto, occurs everywhere, has occurred for thousands of years, and that can be artificially generated by building infrared radiators or infrared heaters. There are different materials, carbon, ceramic, magnesium. That differs a bit from manufacturer to manufacturer, and these heaters are now being acquired, and they come to a certain surface temperature, I'll just say 100 degrees, and then this material starts to emit the infrared. It emits a heat, and that's the infrared. That means, it's a very pleasant heat radiation, it's invisible, even if it's de facto light, it's invisible light, and ideally, if you're naked or dressed as lightly as possible in our infrared heaters, it hits our skin, and the skin is the largest human organ that we have, and the skin can also produce vitamin D, it can also absorb various other light effects and light frequencies, and it can also absorb this infrared light de facto. And that then penetrates into this skin, and there are three different areas of the infrared. There is the so-called near-infrared, infrared A, it penetrates the deepest, then there is the middle infrared, the infrared B, it doesn't penetrate quite as deep, so a maximum of, so to speak, two to three millimeters into the skin, and then there is the far-infrared, it's the softest infrared, and that works, so to speak, above all on the surface, so on a superficial level, the skin doesn't penetrate particularly deep, but it also clearly leads to the fact that certain molecules and also certain cells are activated in our skin. And that is first of all the effect mechanism in infrared itself, that is, if we then give an infrared sun, we just sit down, we have this infrared radiation that is absorbed by our skin, and over time we warm ourselves up from the inside out, and I already explained that earlier, so the cabin doesn't have to be 60, 70 degrees, maybe it's only 45 or 50 degrees, but because this infrared is almost continuously absorbed by our skin, our body warms up slowly but steadily from the inside out, and that is also a significant difference. In a classic sauna I have hot air and I surround myself in this room with hot air, and so to speak, we actually have more of a heat, an external heat effect, that is, hot air also sits in the skin, the infrared heat penetrates the body and warms the body from the inside out. And with the time that I am in this infrared cabin, my body temperature also warms up, that is, we have a gentle fever there, that is, our body temperature goes from, let's say, 36.9, which is probably the body temperature, to 38.6 degrees Celsius. That's a real fever, that's in a period of about 40 minutes, and our body starts to cool down, of course. So fever is a built-in immune mechanism that says, so to speak, hey, I now have to drive up the immune defense of the human body, and as a result, white blood cells are formed, and our whole organism runs faster, our heart has to work more and pump more, and then actually the immune system is de facto activated and our heart has to pump more. And that's where this cardiovascular approach or the cardiovascular approach, while we're actually sitting in this sauna and relaxing, our body is actually busy working with this artificial fever. That's the mechanism for now, and we can go a little deeper into the health effects in a moment, but it was very important to me that, so to speak, a lot of these health effects always come from a cardiovascular stimulation, and it always comes from an increase of the core body temperature, and de facto seen from a gentle fever. And you said that the body temperature can be increased to about 38 or 38.6. Exactly. At what time, approximately? About 40 minutes. So we tested it and took 100 people and looked at it, if they go into this sauna for 40 minutes, how does the core body temperature develop? And that was on average 38.5, 38.6. Of course, it depends on your own constitution. If the sauna, for example, is in Madrid in the summer, where it is tending to be hotter than in Stockholm, then of course that also has a difference, because the pre-heating time of the sauna is influenced. I thought it was very good that you said that you don't really look at the time, but you listen to your body. Of course, every human being is different, and every human being reacts differently. It also takes a lot longer for the body temperature to go up. I sweat super fast, which means that for me it happens very quickly, that the core body temperature goes up. Body temperature is also an important topic, one could also briefly say that many people who are not doing so well, who may have chronic diseases, who do not feel fit, that they also have a too low body temperature and then just different processes cannot run optimally. For example, enzymes are drained from the activity, and then different processes cannot run as efficiently or as quickly, and everything falls asleep a bit, so to speak. And that means I have a cool effect through the infrared sauna, when this temperature rises, that all these processes are stimulated, which you have already said. Yes, exactly. In chemistry, there is the RGT rule, that is, it says that the higher the temperature in an organism, the faster metabolic or metabolic-specific activities happen. And that also makes sense. I think the higher the temperature, the more active the whole organism is, the more blood is pumped over the heart and so on. Of course, if the temperature is chronically too low, I find the thought very exciting to say, or in other words, in the ideal case, we move once a day. And I think in the ideal case, we certainly do sports two or three times a week and lift our weights and do a long run or so on. And of course, we automatically have a body temperature rise, because the energy that is consumed by our body temperature rises. In fact, we do it, but we don't do it. I think we as a society move too little, be it mental stress, I think a lot of people are sick, have pain, autoimmune disease, or, or, or. And then you're in a vicious circle. You would have to move, you would have to be active in order to do something good I think it's a good idea that you can go to a gentle infrared sauna and lift the body temperature a little bit. I find that very, very pleasant. And there are many studies that clearly show a anti-inflammatory effect, that show a detoxifying effect. And I think that's very exciting, because if someone is really sick, you're lucky to get people on the mat or do a 60-minute exercise, but I think you would have to start there beforehand. And for me, this infrared sauna represents an exciting medium to ultimately lead to positive stress in the body, to regulate the circulation upwards, to generate a real fever, to work on anti-inflammatory, to work detoxifying. And few products or few technologies can do that. And for me, the infrared sauna is clearly one of the leading media. So it's a bit of a movement replacement or a sport replacement for people who may not be able to do that due to their constitution or may not always be able to do it for temporary reasons. So it's best, of course, to combine both, but you definitely have certain effects that you have achieved with movement, including infrared saunas. For me it is so. I mean, the sauna is of course good to sleep in and a good sleep is essential. The infrared sauna can certainly help to reduce stress in the evening. But if I don't sleep well, then this infrared sauna can only seem limited. I think it's the same, so to speak, if you move too little or don't eat well, then I can't push myself to health with this infrared sauna. That doesn't work. But if someone really suffers from stress, we're talking about heavy metals, we're talking about certain PCAs, PCBs, and it's no longer hocus-pocus. We are in an environment or in a society where there are toxins everywhere. And the question is, how high are these toxins and can I somehow alleviate them? Because it's just inevitable. And for me, this infrared sauna is a means to an end. The means to an end, to tackle some of these topics proactively, but without being able to do 10,000, 15,000, 20,000 steps a day. So even if I can't do them, then I think it's exciting to go to a sauna or maybe a cold shower or an infrared sauna, because ultimately it also has an impact on our metabolism, but it's not the holy answer to everything. But it can be a good means to an end, especially if someone has chronic diseases and also suffers from detoxification symptoms. Yes, I find the topic of detoxification very exciting. If you do a little research, you can also find statements like that in the, so from the infrared sauna compared to a normal sauna, that the amount of poison that is excreted through the sweat is significantly higher. I have found numbers like 5 to 6 or more toxins and that also fat-soluble toxins are in there, because they can be better excreted by the infrared radiation over the skin. Maybe you can say something about that. For a long time it was a bit of a myth. I think this word detox or this word detoxification has also become very widespread and I think it is still very widespread, because there are detox teas, there are detox teas, there are fasting cures but of course everything has some kind of effect. But the disadvantage is of course that many should say, yes, the sauna will not detoxify at all. It doesn't work at all. And that's the nice thing, that there are some studies now, especially in 2014 there was a very exciting study that just compared it. It looked at how the detoxification of heavy metals, so to speak, but also of PCAs, i.e. these are polychlorinated biphenyls and of BPA, so bisphenol A, so softeners, but also leave. And how does the toxin load in the sweat compare to the urine or the excretion, so to speak, over the excretions? And it showed that, so to speak, not every detoxification is equally effective. For example, it was shown that heavy metals and above all aluminum, cadmium, cobalt and nickel were sometimes separated up to 25 times higher over the sweat, in this case aluminum, than over the urine. And that has long been considered impossible. For a long time it was said, well, the human body has its own detoxification, we have our own organs, and they are actually responsible for it. That means we as humans don't have to do anything, we detoxify anyway. That was this stereotype that was out there for a long time. And we still see comments that claim that. But the studies actually indicate that the skin, which is also an organ, the skin is basically a sponge, so it's not a sponge, it's what I put on the skin, can be absorbed, but also what's in the body, it can also be separated. It's a membrane that works in both directions, so to speak, that there is a lot of detoxification about it. This study came out in 2014 and, of course, a lot has also been clarified in this case, because, so to speak, with these stereotypes or with these denials of detoxification about sweat or the infrared spray, it was just, I don't know how to say it, but in the end it was just a positive outcome for this whole topic. And beyond that, there were already different detoxification programs in the 50s and 60s. We're still talking a little bit about this B3 detoxification protocol, which is also a special detoxification protocol. But de facto, detoxification works in such a way that we humans, especially toxins, have stored in the human fat tissue. That means, especially around the belly fat, where most people always have their fat tissue, we just have an increased storage of toxins. You can test that pretty well by now. I don't think it's a good idea to just detox like that, because it doesn't always make sense to do a short lab analysis to see which brand I have. And then I can clearly derive such toxins with a sweat therapy or with infrared spray. It makes a lot of sense to supplement that as well. There are different binding agents that can also prevent a reabsorption of toxins in the intestine. We're talking about tone, but also about chlorella Chlorella is a mechanism, as you said, that infrared can penetrate into the skin layers, fight this oxidative stress proactively, but also the far-infrared, which does not penetrate so deeply, but acts from the wavelength so that it attacks these fat cells and also releases the toxins. Detoxification can be achieved through that. There are always customers who say, my towel was really black afterwards or was really dark afterwards. I think you said it too, it wasn't like that with me. But you have to say that there is still research to be done in this area. There are many very good studies, there is sweat analysis, there are more and more detoxification protocols in America for professional firefighters who are exposed to extreme temperatures, and that was one of the reasons that you saw that cancer in American firefighters has increased exponentially, especially lung cancer. And then you built into this fire station an infrared fence, because you have seen more and more that regular sweating can really reduce the toxin load. But unfortunately studies are still rare, but the mechanism is now very well understood, very well recognized, whether the infrared sauna really detoxifies 4 to 5 times as effectively as a classic sauna. I haven't seen a study on that. I know this number, Dr. Brian Clement from America says so too, and they have the Hippocrates Institute in Florida, where they work a lot with detoxification, but in my opinion the Hippocrates Institute has had this sauna for 9 or 10 years. There is now also a German publisher of the Hippocrates Institute, Martin and Christian, they also have a clayline sauna, because they simply have the most successes with it. Before our conversation, Christian wrote to me, I should still say hello, I'll do it right now. It's a very nice reference, but there is still work to be done. There simply needs to be more studies in this area. You mentioned this study, where it was analyzed how much sweat was released, how much urine was released. Was that sweating in general, or was sweating also looked at in infrared saunas? No, it was sweating in general. First they looked at how sweating behaves as a mechanism compared to normal detoxification. That's what I wanted to point out beforehand. If someone has chronic fatigue and if you somehow manage to reduce the increased heavy metal load, then it is excluded that a sick person sweats four or three times a week intensively. You would have to go jogging three or four times an hour. Even then, I think it is excluded that you sweat as much as in an infrared sauna. I think that's a great approach, that you can trigger the body through artificial sweating in an infrared sauna in such a way that you can already address some of these health issues. After that, I can still do sports three times a week and exercise, which should be the goal. But de facto it is difficult to implement when you are sick. I have noted a few other things, which effects the increased body temperature can have. For example, as we said, increasing enzyme activity and stimulating metabolism, but also increasing the immune function. So that our immune system can work more effectively, that pathogens can be killed better or that due to the higher temperature no longer feel so comfortable and are weakened. If you think about it, it is an artificial fever and this clearly regulates the immune system. Absolutely. Then the promotion of blood circulation and microcirculation. This is also an issue for many people, which has to do with, for example, a lack of movement. Not all areas of our body are sufficiently supplied with oxygen and nutrients, or the waste materials are transported. This could be very helpful for a sauna. We haven't talked about the lymph system yet. Super exciting. Especially if you combine it with a trampoline. A trampoline is great for the lymph system. If you combine this with an infrared sauna, you get great results. The lymph system is also of central importance for detoxification. It is an ultra-complex system, which I still don't fully understand but absolutely. What would you recommend for practice, if someone has a trampoline or wants to lie down? We are still talking about protocols, but any form of physical activity before the infrared sauna is a very exciting experiment, because I stimulate the cardiovascular system beforehand. I create a slight increase in body temperature. I can do rope jumping, I can go jogging for 20 minutes, I can do whatever I want. People who can't do this, go to the block, try to move a little. But the non-plus-ultra is to go to the trampoline, jump 10-15 minutes and then go to the sauna. You will notice that you sweat a lot better and faster immediately. You probably won't be able to stay in the sauna longer. One cool effect is that it activates the parasympathetic nervous system, the calming nerve of our nervous system, which brings us more into relaxation. When the tendency is already so cold, I know it from my past, it is more like a stress factor. I am under tension because I am cold. If the body temperature is low, this can also be the case. If I increase it, it can have a relaxing effect. I think it's always exciting when people are chronically cold. I know that's the most difficult thing ever, but starting with a cold shower sounds paradoxical. I think that simply changes the temperature level. If I get used to it, even if it's colder than what I'm feeling right now, the tolerance threshold changes. But still, if you are chronically cold, it can also be related to low blood pressure. It is highly complex what the reasons are. It could also be a lack of salt. Then it makes sense to go to the sauna and ideally to shower cold. Because these two effects have an influence on my temperature threshold. It can be slightly higher or slightly lower, but my physical feeling changes. Are there any other effects that you think should be included? I think we already talked about the fever. But one of the most important things is the heart rate. I just heard Peter Attia talk about it. He looked at the factors that are related to longevity and the quality of life of us humans. Good sleep, good nutrition, micro-nutrients, movement, sport. Muscle is a central topic or sport in general. When we get older, the muscle mass decreases. But the heart rate also decreases. That's the positive thing. If I manage to stimulate my heart rate system regularly, it has an effect on the overall heart rate health. Conversely, we currently know that heart rate diseases are the biggest cause of death worldwide. Heart attacks, strokes, diabetes, especially if you correlate it passively. That means, heart attack is one of the central topics. Of course, it is also due to stress. When I have chronic stress, chronic high blood pressure, it has something to do with the heart rate system. A lot has been researched in this area. It is now known that regular soundness of the same heart rate or a very similar heart rate effect as endurance running. This was mainly done for classic soundness. But ultimately, I stay in an infrared but also longer. I reach a similar body temperature. That means, I have a similar effect, only that it just takes longer until I can use it. This heart rate is really special. I can only do that in everyday life when I really go to cardio training. I can't do that with weightlifting. Maybe I can do it with CrossFit to a certain degree. But above all, I have to get into Zone 2 cardio. This is defined by saying, if you go jogging with a partner, then you jog at a pace at which you can still have a pleasant conversation. I tried it with myself. Then I am at a pulse or in the heart. I have 120 to 130 beats per minute that my heart gives out. I measured that over the oral ring. That's actually pretty good. At that pace, I can still have a conversation. I did the same experiment by going to an infrared sauna for 40-45 minutes. I wrote an article about it on the blog. I showed exactly how my beats per minute change depending on the sauna use. In the end, after 30-40 minutes, my heart gave out 120-130 beats per minute. It's the same as Zone 2 cardio. I have the same effect as when I go jogging at a pace at which I can still have a conversation. It's exhausting when I have to breathe and I have to make sure that I don't overdo it. It's very difficult in everyday life because we don't have time for it anymore. I don't want to do cardio anyway. It's no fun. I don't want to move at all. It's just gigantic when you realize that an hour in such a stupid infrared sauna has a similar effect as when I go jogging 2-3 times a week. There are other factors that cannot be compared. I don't want to maximize my cardiovascular health because stress and high blood pressure drive it up. Things like sports, saunas and colds can reduce it. We all get older. I don't think we can get past this topic. That's why I wish that we would think about it earlier. How can I have this incentive for my cardiovascular system? For me, it's the infrared sauna. I've measured it several times. It works great for me. It's not the holy grail, but it's an incredibly valuable and important technology. I can't do it with the infrared mat. It doesn't have the same effect. I need this incentive for my cardiovascular system. I think we've discussed the effects and the differences between an infrared sauna and a normal sauna. It would be interesting for me and the viewers to know what makes a high-quality infrared sauna. Keywords would be the light spectrum, the full spectrum. What does it mean? The topic of electrosmog or the materials that are used? That's a huge topic. I think it's because the market is not regulated. Every Hans Franz can open a company tomorrow and import infrared saunas from a third country or overseas. I also find infrared saunas for 1,500 euros at Jibo. Or at Lidl or Aldi for 900 euros. It's a product that is offered in high availability. There are some very important features and topics that you definitely have to look at. My wish is that listeners know what questions they have to ask when they talk to a provider. Of course, point one is the infrared spectrum. It's the heart of it. I also have a room, a sauna, and I have this infrared spectrum. Unfortunately, there are many infrared saunas that are built with industrial radiators. I think everyone knows this. When you were in a restaurant in winter or autumn, there are these radiators from above that keep you warm. Such radiators are designed to get as hot as possible, but they are not designed for the body. We have actually heard from some customers that radiators are too intense for the human body. That's point one. I think we have developed our own technology for radiators. We say that a large part of it has to be infrared C, because it has a detoxifying effect. It removes toxins from the fat and expands it to the so-called full spectrum, which we just mentioned. That's the combination of infrared A, near-infrared, infrared B, and infrared C. For us, that's the don plus ultra, because we have integrated all three infrared areas in a concept that prioritizes infrared C, but expands it around these two infrared spectrum areas that work differently. There are providers that have other technologies, but we have clearly said that we want to develop the most high-quality and high-performance radiators. We work together with Dr. Simone Koch from Germany, but also with other hospitals, Dr. Michael from the UK, and so on. That's important. A huge topic is electrosmog. I think you also talk a lot about this topic, so I think there's a lot to know about it. But electrosmog is a broad spectrum. In the electrosmog field, we always talk about electromagnetic frequencies, also known as EMF, electromagnetic frequencies. Then there are electric fields or extremely low frequencies, abbreviated as EF or ELF. Then there are also high-frequency frequencies, radio, Bluetooth, WiFi, and so on. If you imagine that, there are radiators around me, ideally. These radiators always need electricity. That means I'm sitting in a box and there's electricity flowing around me. That just has to be the case, because a good infrared radiator has 360 degrees heat supply. We really have radiators around us, but that has the disadvantage that there are always currents flowing. If a manufacturer does not deal with this topic, then I sometimes have 100 times more electrosmog load than it should be. You can keep what you want from the WHO, but they speak of a standard of less than 3 milligauss, as far as EMF is concerned. With our competitors, we measured 300 milligauss. That's 100 times more electrosmog load. If you measure on the radiator itself, you are at 0.6, 0.7. If you only move one centimeter away from it, it goes to zero. That's why we say that where you sit on the bench, we have virtually no electrosmog in relation to electromagnetic fields. You measure something in electrical fields, but they are still significantly below the level of the next best competitor. Unfortunately, the problem is that many providers do not understand the topic. There are some providers who say it's not a problem. If you ask how their values are, they say they are not concerned with this topic. Then there are a few other manufacturers who say our radiators are electrosmog. That may be true, but it's not just the radiators that are in an infrared sensor. For example, there are one or two providers in Switzerland, where the control unit sits, where virtually all streams flow under the bench. I sit on it, maybe I want to have another child, and I wonder, but I don't want that. That is, I sit on an electromagnetic field, on an electrical field, have an increased electrosmog load there, and then it is propagated as a health product. I have a problem with that. The problem is either ignorance or a lack of regulation, so that everyone can say what they want. That is why we have decided that we are the world's first carbon brand with the lowest electrosmog, especially measured on electromagnetic fields. We are currently the only worldwide brand that really proactively reduces electrical fields, and that is not an easy task. This is an example of a radiator. On one side of the radiator it has a current from plus to minus, and on the back it has a converted current, a much lower current, and as a result we have two coils, electromagnetism, which reduce. And then we have carbonized nets on the beams. It looks weird, but it means that the electrical fields are reduced. The inside of the roof, where the control unit sits, we have laid out with different foils, partly aluminum foil or silver foil, so that this electrosmog does not reflect into the cabin, but ultimately is reflected back up. You don't see that from the outside, but from the outside you can see and I put my hand in the fire that there are no infrared cabins in the world that come up to this level. Maybe one or two, but you don't get them in Germany. They sit in Australia or in America. This is a huge problem, a huge topic. As I said, there is no talk about it in Germany, and if you call the providers and ask what their measurement values are, they usually say, no problem, or our radiators are electrosmog-reduced, which we consider as a whole. This is the lifetime guarantee. We give a lifetime guarantee for the entire cabin, for private use. I think that's an announcement. Sure, it's an expensive product, but it's also a service that goes with it. That means that even in 10 years I can still get this cabin maintained. The mother company of ours has been on the market for 26 years, so there is a lot of experience in this area. That's another problem. Many cabins come from poor manufacturing conditions. Cheap woods are often used. You have to calculate that. If a cabin costs 1,000 euros, it can cost a maximum of 300 euros in production. But work performance, materials, everything has to be calculated. Otherwise it's not worth it for the seller. Cheap woods are often used. In China, woods are partially sprayed, and the remaining moisture is pulled out of the wood. You don't want a damp wood. If the wood is wet, it moves and it starts to crack. You get cracks. That's one thing. Adhesives are used. The heating bodies and everything have to be assembled. It's not just screwed, it's done with adhesives. We use completely untreated woods. We only use ecologically certified materials. We use one or two adhesives, but they are on a food standard. You have to glue a lot. But we have a lot of access from people with either an electrosmog sensitivity or a chemical sensitivity. We have a few stewards who say they can't do it anymore, their immune system is overwhelmed. They can use the sauna. I think we did all the homework. It's a technical product, things can go wrong, but we always have a service because we have a lifetime guarantee. If I have a low-quality infrared cabin, it can be that I get very irradiated, maybe not the optimal infrared performance. And thirdly, that I even breathe in things that evaporate from the woods or other toxins that are toxic. Especially when it gets hot, they are released more and I absorb them. In the worst case, it's like that. That's exactly the topic. Ideally, you would have thought that this market is regulated, that there is some quality premium standards that have to be met. Because it doesn't exist, anyone can do what they want. It's a wellness product, it doesn't meet any strict requirements. We've heard a lot from customers and I've seen a few cabins where, on the one hand, the electrosmog load was exorbitantly high. It's just madness. There are people who don't care. There are people who have no problem with it or don't want to have a problem with it or are insensitive to it. I don't know. But there are people who could still go into this sauna. But if you know something about health, you don't want to sleep on the B-line route. Everyone understands that. I don't want to sleep on the B-line route either. The same goes for an infrared sauna. I don't want to go to an infrared sauna that has such a high load. And on the subject of wood and glue, under normal room temperature conditions, it might not be an issue. I'm sitting here on a chair. I'm sure it doesn't just have kosher materials built in. I'm sure it also comes from mass production. The difference is that in an infrared sauna, higher temperatures act. That means I have 50, 55, 60, 65 degrees. And there, many of these substances denature or warm up. And especially when this temperature threshold is exceeded by 63 degrees, it can lead to this outgassing. That these substances break down, which I can breathe in, if necessary. In English, there is a no VOC, a non-outgassing. Then there is a test procedure for it. This is not particularly common in Germany yet. But that would be another thing that you could ask this manufacturer. Do your saunas get tested on it? Because you can test it. If such a sauna heats up, well, we can detect any chemical residues, so to speak. And if not, then this criterion of the no VOC is met. Exactly. Maybe as a last point, it is actually very important to us that we provide added value. That means, the vision is actually that with this infrared sauna or with the Claylight sauna, we can now produce very rudimentarily. For example, you have a full-spectrum radiator that you still get retrofitted. And the philosophy is a bit closer. How can we provide one hour per day of health for someone and ideally combine various other health applications? That means, for example, we have a red light therapy, i.e. cold red light, to stimulate the mitochondria, which can be retrofitted. We also have a salt inhalation device, which can be retrofitted in this sauna. Of course, I can meditate during it. I can read my book. I can also do it on my cell phone, even if I would not recommend it, of course. And that was always the consideration, how can we integrate a higher added value or more health applications into this cabin, so that you have as much added value as possible in one hour per day, ideally. That was a bit like the thoughts or the philosophy that we just applied. And we are also working on other products, for example a vitamin D lamp, so that UVB is also integrated into this sauna, so that when I am in the dark season, I have a chronic lack of light anyway, so that I can do something for my vitamin D level. And that's the plan. That's very cool. The last thing you said. Yes, it's coming. We have been working on it for a long time, six to twelve months from today, from the 19th of September we should actually be there. Good. I will link the site to the infrared saunas that you offer in the description or in the comments. And we could also provide a voucher code for you. You will find it there too. Otherwise, I think we have discussed the most important topics in this video. We will record a second one, where it is more about the applications and the possibilities. Then I would say we are through for today. Thank you very much, Johannes. And I'm looking forward to our next conversation. Thank you, my dear. See you soon. See you. Bye.