King Charles will confront 'shameful aspects' of Britain's role in slavery

The Prime Minister of the United Kingdom says he's open to calls for an apology for Britain's role in the transatlantic slave trade. Annie Burnham is in the Caribbean this week for a meeting of Commonwealth leaders and will join King Charles, who is in the region, on a nine-day tour. The CBC's Julia Chapman is following this story from London this morning. So, Julia, what is Burnham saying about this? Well, Marianne, Andy Burnham wrote an article in The Guardian newspaper acknowledging the wrongs of slavery. He says that enslaved people were denied humanity and their rights were brutally and barbarically violated. He recognises as well that the pain and suffering that was caused during that period still shapes the world today. But the headline is really that the Prime Minister is open to hearing calls for the British state to formally apologise for its role in the transatlantic... Slave trade. He's stopped short of actually apologising, but the language is really the furthest a British leader has ever gone. Burnham does say, though, that he doesn't agree that financial reparations would be fair. He says that people today can't be held liable for historical wrongs, however heinous. But he does propose new efforts to restructure the debts of poorer Commonwealth countries. Interestingly, the leader of the Conservative Opposition Party says today that she doesn't believe the UK should make an apology over slavery. But some Caribbean leaders have welcomed Burnham's comments, including those from Jamaica, Barbados and the Bahamas. And this is expected to be a topic on the agenda at the Commonwealth Heads of Government meeting this week. So what does this development with Burnham and his comments mean for King Charles as he continues his tour in the Caribbean? Well, the king always has to walk a diplomatic tightrope when he goes on these visits. Of course, he's part of the Part of the UK's soft power arm. He's in the Caribbean right now to promote British partnerships. But, of course, it can be seen by some as distasteful if he doesn't mention at all the more difficult subjects on the minds of many people in these countries. He has only given one speech so far on this tour, but he did allude to the legacy of slavery while he was speaking in the Bahamas. Take a listen. It is only right that we should acknowledge The great suffering and injustices of the past in these islands and beyond, even as we rejoice in the successes of the present and build new opportunities for the future. Most of the King's visit to the Caribbean has focused on developing commercial links with these countries and championing environmental causes, as he so often does. And there have been a lot of lighter moments as well. He was seen dancing in a parade in the Bahamas and drinking rum in Guyana. The King will make another speech at the Commonwealth meeting on Tuesday. Buckingham Palace says he will speak with unflinching honesty, sincere sorrow and respect for the wider discussions. Julia Chapman in London. Thanks, Julia. You're welcome. And for a closer look at Britain's history with the slave trade and calls for reparations, we're now joined by Michael Charles Banner. He is the Dean of Trinity College in Cambridge, as well as the author of Britain's Slavery Debt, Reparations Now. He says it's time for the UK to acknowledge its history with the slave trade. Thank you so much for joining us this morning, Michael. Good to be with you. So as we heard Julia just mentioned in her report, Buckingham Palace says King Charles will confront what it calls the shameful aspects of British history with unflinching honesty when he addresses the Commonwealth leaders. We're looking ahead to that on Tuesday. What do you make of that development? Well, it's a great first step, I think. I mean, you will know and your listeners probably know that British prime ministers have been playing what you'd call in cricket a straight bat. They've been standing at the wicket saying, we're not going to talk about this, we're not going to pay reparations. You know, they're very defensive, ridiculously defensive. This is a big first step to say, look, Britain needs to admit, and formally, this can't be a throwaway remark over dinner, it has to be a formal apology from the nation to the nations who are affected. But I think very much it is a first step Reparations follow naturally from that admission. And that's where we're going to go next. And I guess the King's in a difficult position. He can't say that for now. The Prime Minister's opened a discussion. Let's see where it goes. But no one's said that yet. But that's where the logic takes us. So specifically, what will you be listening for on Tuesday when King Charles addresses the Commonwealth leaders? Well, I guess he'll open up the topic of apology. I mean, he said that we want to, Prime Minister Burnham has said that we need to have a conversation with the Caribbean nations about what an apology would look like. What do they expect from Britain? I think that is a good first step. He'll say that. He won't say any more, I guess, at the moment, because Prime Minister Burnham is being a little bit defensive about reparations. But as I say, you can't open up this topic without facing the central fact that Britain extracted vast amounts of value What do you think about Prime Minister Burnham saying, OK, yes, there could be an apology, but no to reparations for now. Are you surprised? No, because it's difficult territory. No prime minister wants to say, look, we're going to have to face up to this. But it doesn't make sense as a logical position. The argument it's been using and the opposition have been using Britain is saying, well, Britain can't be held responsible for the crimes of the past. And it is true that enslaved people, sorry to put it crudely, but enslaved people we know were raped on a regular basis on the plantations. There's no suggestion that British people now, someone should stand up in court and take the rap for that. But that's not the issue. The issue is that Britain now possesses and is wealthy because of the value that was extracted from the Caribbean. And the Caribbean is poor because of the value that was taken out of the Caribbean. So that's what we need to address. And that's more like restitution. So the analogy is not... You know, my grandfather might have been a big Nazi, let's say. No one says I should be held responsible for that. But on the other hand, if I now have the pictures that that Nazi general, whatever, you know, took off Jewish refugees in the 30s, I now have those pictures, I should return them. So no one's saying anyone should stand up and take responsibility for the crimes, but we are in possession of goods and financial benefits that really belong to the Caribbean. So what do you think is the right resolution here? Because there are people there in Guyana, for instance, yesterday in welcoming the king, saying they don't want an apology. They want those reparations. And how important is that? Let's have that conversation. Let's have that conversation. That's what we need to do. We need to behave like grown-ups, which Britain hasn't behaved like a grown-up for a long while on this. It is now. I think this is the first step. We need to say, look, let's talk about apology and let's talk about what a reparations package would look like. It is such a deep issue and we could talk about this for so much longer than the few minutes we have together this morning because of the history and the pain and the generational pain that families have been dealing with and looking at their own history and then looking at the situation now, as you say, between the Commonwealth countries and the situation financially in so many Caribbean nations. What do you think will be satisfactory for those watching the King's speech on Tuesday? Well, I doubt if he'll be able to go far enough. I mean, as I think your commentator said previously, kings do what they're told in Britain, to put it directly. He won't be able to go further, but I suspect his heart is in something further. He's a reflective man. He studied at my college in Cambridge. He's a reflective man. He's a thoughtful man. And I think he will realise that the present position, although it's a step forward, is not a stable place to be. Once we've admitted that this was a terrible crime and a crime which has extracted value from the Caribbean, which has ended up in Britain, then the logic, the logic, the overwhelming logic, moral logic is we've got to find a way of making it good financially. Dean of Trinity College in Cambridge and author of Britain's Slavery Debt, Michael Charles Banner, thank you so much for your thoughts this morning. Thank you.