Moments That Make Us: Billie Jean King on Blazing a Trail for Future Generations

I want girls to get into sports because we know 94% of women in C-suites identify as being an athlete. It's more comfortable and also we learn how to lead. Girls that learn sports learn how to lead. To celebrate turning 60 this year, I chatted with women of all ages about their biggest life transitions. I'm Melinda French Gates and these are the moments that make us. Billie Jean, I'm so glad we get to have this conversation. You are the first person that taught me actually the difference that sports makes for women's equality. I want to talk to you about a lot of things today, but let's start with transitions because I know you and I both believe in teaching generations behind us. Definitely. You've had so many transitions in your life, but what's one of the biggest transitions you've gone through, would you say? Biggest transitions? Mm-hmm. I've been through a few. I think probably the most difficult when I was outed in 1981, not by choice. I had been told we wouldn't have a women's tour if I said something, so that made it really simple. I'm not going to say anything. I was trying to figure out who I am, what my sexuality was and all that. Because I was outed, I had to deal with it and my lawyer and my publicist kept saying, deny, deny, deny. You cannot. This is 81. It's not like it is now. Oh, yeah. It's definitely different. No. I said, no, I'm going to tell the truth. They said, no, it'll ruin your career. I said, I don't care. My parents, especially my mother, always used to say to thine own self, be true. That kept pounding on my head. I came out and I lost millions of dollars overnight because I was getting near retirement and I had all these lifelines. I was finally going to make some money because my generation, we didn't make a lot of money. I had these lifetime contracts in place when I was at this time, it was in my late thirties. Those just went away overnight and I had to start over. But it was also a very honest moment for me. So I think that was really important. So you have this juxtaposition, which is you didn't have the choice. Somebody outed you. So you're losing a lot, losing a lot of money and future opportunities, and you've decided to be honest and tell your truth. How did that feel? Like, how did it feel like the next day or the next week? Oh, it was terrible because of the publicity and all the things I had to go through. But I'm like, just stay true to myself. I'll figure this out. It was really tumultuous. So it was really difficult. And people still don't, some people still are homophobic. My parents were. That was another challenge because your family's everything. And that was a difficult time. But I also realized I need to give them time to deal with this pain, emotional pain, because it took me a long time. So I thought to myself, just calm down, Billy, give them time. And then they were, my dad was great. My mother's, I don't know, mom was trying to figure it out up to the end of her life really at 91. So she knew I was happier though. She says, I can tell you're happier. And that's, parents always want their children to be happy. Parents always. Right? You're a parent. I'm not. So I'll defer to you. I always want our children to be happy. But we do. We wrestle with things inside. Like, ooh, is that right? Okay. What do I think? You know, I interviewed recently Megan Rapinoe, and I think about how much she chose to make that decision to come out, how she's got a partner, Sue Bird. I mean, you blazed a trail that you didn't even know you were going to blaze at the time. Actually, I did know at that time. You did. Okay. I was very clear on that. Say more about that. Well, I think I'm one of the first, if not the first athlete to address it, come out and tell my truth. But I also knew I was hoping at that time that I'd make it easier on the future generations, on my generation as well. So you knew you were blazing a trail. You knew that, okay, this is going to help generations behind me. I'm a huge believer in history. The more you know about history, the more you know about yourself. Well, it really goes back to my epiphany at 12. Yeah. Say more about that. Well, I played tennis one year. The first time I went to the parks, because of access, which is really important, I had coaching, free coaching and free court. So I go. It's my second time I've picked up a racket. And I knew I had found what I was going to do with the rest of my life. I wanted to be the number one tennis player in the world. So we'll fast forward to 12 years old, and I'm sitting at the Los Angeles Tennis Club where they play a lot of big tournaments. And I started to think about my sport. And I thought, hmm, everybody plays with white clothes, and everybody who plays is white. And I go, where's everybody else? For the rest of my life, I would champion equality. So 1968, tennis finally went pro, where you got to check. But Rod Laver got 2,000 pounds. I got 750 pounds. And I went, right away, I go. It was hard enough to get this from amateur to pro, and now women are going to get a bad deal. That's what, 37.5% of what Rod Laver got. I'm like. And it's going to be another challenge. So there's nine of us, called the Original Nine, that signed a $1 contract with Gladys Hellman, who is publisher of World Tennis Magazine. And that is the birth of women's professional tennis. That's 1970. And the three things, here are the three things that really matter to us. That any girl born in this world, if she were good enough, would have a place to compete. Number two, that she'd be appreciated for her accomplishments, not only her looks. And number three, that she'd be able to make a living in tennis, the sport we love so much. And those three things still hold true today. You were an individual player on the court, and yet it took this team effort to say, these are the three things we are going to stand for. How did you build a team? I mean, there's nothing you can move forward in equality for people. You can use your voice, you can use your platform, you can invest. But it takes thousands of people to move gender and values forward in a society and change norms. Absolutely. Talk about how you thought about that individual versus team. First of all, I come from team sports. I played softball, baseball, basketball was my favorite. My dad was a basketball player. My mom was a really good swimmer. So I grew up in team. And tennis, people think of it as an individual sport, but really, you'll hear kids, oh, I'm on my high school team, I'm on my college team. I've always liked the team aspect best. I love doubles better than singles. But the one thing you find out is that followers choose leaders, leaders do not choose followers. And all the players kept always pushing me to be the leader. And I kept saying, no, no, no, no, it's all right. And then I started thinking about my past. And I was pushed all the time to lead, even on the bicycle committee, glee club, by far the worst singer. But they made me president. I didn't ask for it. They wanted me to be president. Oh, you lead, you should be our president. What? So finally, I embraced it. I go, okay, I've been asked to be the leader. I'm going to go full throttle and do this the rest of my life because I keep being put in that position. People see something in you. So I have to pay attention. Well, they know I care about them, I think. I like team. I like, I've always thought team my whole life. In our family, we were a team, played team sports. I just, I understood teamwork. But you also have immense courage, Billie Jean. I mean, courage to, I mean, come on. When you played the battle of the sexes to get out there, tell that story for people who don't know. I watched that at nine years old and it had an effect on me. You were nine? I was nine. And I thought, my gosh, a woman is an amazing tennis player. But I knew even at nine, you were standing up for something. Talk about courage. You have so much courage. Well, Bobby Riggs, who I adored, and he was one of my heroes, and he was a hall of famer and number one in the world. Much older, obviously. He was as old as my dad. But he kept saying, you know, he could beat us. Title IX had just been passed in 1972. We couldn't get a credit card on our own in 1973. We needed a mail to co-sign. It was very different than it is now. And that's what people have to understand, why it's important to know history, how we evolve and how we change things. So anyway, all these things are on my head. We started the Women's Tennis Association four days before Wimbledon. We announced after Wimbledon about the match in September. Ninety million people saw it throughout the world. What I don't think realized, the Super Bowl had 53 million that year. So that'll put it in perspective for people. Yeah. Because they're used to Super Bowl, it's 117 million now. But it was at that time, we had 90 million. So I knew this was the one time in my life I'd have an audience and a worldwide audience and also to help change things. And I knew it was about social change. And my job was to change the hearts and minds of people. That was my job in that match to me. And to help both genders, of course, now we have more than two genders, but at that time it was men and women thinking in our society. And when I beat him, it's amazing, since that day, I think there hasn't been a day that doesn't go by that someone brings it up. And that women got more self-confidence from it. They'd come up to me, hey, Billy, you know, I was afraid to ask for a raise and I asked for a raise. And I go, no, more importantly, did you get the raise? They said, yes. And they said, yes, right away. I said, yes, that's what I want to hear. And they said, you know, I'd given up on life. Some women would say, you know, I didn't know what I was going to do with my life and I'd kind of given up on myself. And I saw that match and I said, I can do anything if she can win that match. And then men usually are more reflective, sometimes have tears in their eyes, actually. And they said, you know, I never thought about my daughter or my niece until I saw that match. And I started thinking, am I really paying enough attention to her? Am I encouraging her? President Obama, when I met him for the first time, told me he saw that match when he was 12. You were nine. And he said how it affected him. And now he's had two daughters that helped raise his daughters. It did affect people. And it did affect the hearts and minds of people. It absolutely did. It really accomplished at that time what I was trying to do. And of course, once you do this, you want it to continue to improve, though. You don't want to just have it stop there. Of course. It's only a match, really. But you cannot get on a tennis court the next day. Oh, because everybody wanted to go out and play? Go out and play. So tennis exploded. Tennis exploded. That was our moment where our huge growth spurt went. And because of that match was huge. Plus women's and men's tennis was professional for the first time for only third year, fourth year. It took courage, though, Billie Jean, to play in that match. I mean, we were all on the edge of our seats for you. I mean, and you say Bobby was a friend. See, I didn't know that as a young girl. No, he wasn't a friend. I admired him. He didn't know anything about me. Good distinction. Yeah. Really important distinction. Women usually know a lot more about the other person more than men usually do. Oh, that's a really good distinction. Girls are taught to be perfect. And boys are taught to be brave. And it's ridiculous. That's why I love sports, because the one thing sports do for girls, it gives them confidence. They learn to trust their bodies, because we're taught not to trust our bodies. They do very little research on us for our health compared to men. The money spent is just outrageous. It's always about the guys. We know very little about ourselves. People don't know about women very much, internally or externally, OK? The reason I want girls to go into sports at all, and they don't have to be good. Everybody goes, well, I can't be the best. No, no, no. It's not about being the best. It's about the culture. I want girls to get into sports, because we know 94 percent of women in C-suites identify as being an athlete. It's more comfortable, and also we learn how to lead. Girls that learn sports learn how to lead, make decisions, live with it, and move on. And I think that's one of the greatest things you can learn in life. OK, so what do you do to renew yourself? Like, what do you do now, and what did you learn back then that, OK, I need to renew myself, like, as a leader, because you are. You're advocating for generations. Well, my wife, Ilana, got me playing, not playing. I don't call it playing. I call it hitting tennis balls again during COVID. That's right. You gave up tennis completely. I was just working. I was just doing business. I was doing team tennis. Now we're investing a lot in women's sports. I've always invested in women's sports and my sport, men and women. But so being back on the court, if you knew it was you. Oh, God, it's magic. Really? Why? Oh, God. First of all, to hit the ball on the strings of a tennis racket, it's magical. For me. I mean, everybody else goes, really? No, it's magical, because I like the sound. I like the way it feels. We have different spins. I have to make a decision whether I'm going to top spin, side spin, slice. There's all kinds of decision making, which I like, and it's quick. As you said earlier, I think you were talking about in sports, you make decisions quickly and you have to bounce back and all that. The feel of the ball striking the strings and the feeling I get is just the best. I don't know. There's something. It's almost spiritual. I don't know. Well, it's in you. But it's exercise. So I'm getting the physicality that I wasn't getting. And for someone at my age, I'm 80 now. How old do you feel when you're on the court? Oh, I feel old. I know I'm older because I can't run like I did. I love to run. Feel the wind in my hair. I love that feeling. That's gone. But just to feel the ball hit the racket and the swinging and the balance and just all of it. I have to use all of myself. That's what's great about sports. Your breath. Yeah. I go out and run. And I can't run very far these days or very fast. That's something women always do. Oh. There we go. You just did it. I just did it? I know. We do it. We are so socialized. We are so. We're not good enough. Not ever. We're not only good enough. We're more than good enough. We're remarkable. Yeah. But the younger ones are teaching us. That's right. I always feel it's my job as an older person now to help the younger ones. I think every generation should think about that. As you get older and older. For sure. Come on. We have perspective. Okay. But you have, you just, maybe it was from the beginning, but at least from my vantage point, it just looks like you have absolutely broadened your lens and opened your aperture to not just be about gender, but to be about everybody. I'm inclusive. Mm-hmm. Where does that come from? Every human being deserves to have the best that life has to offer. They deserve it. And every human being. I think it's really important that we are inclusive, that we help each person and that's it. The young people have a chance to change things and make it better and be a positive part of history. That's why I love sports. I love sports because kids learn how to lead. Also you learn how to be a good teammate. Sometimes you don't lead. And like I'll be in, when I was playing team sports or if I play, or tennis, sometimes my job is not to lead. That's what a good leader does as well, is my job is just to be one of the team, help whoever is leading, help the goal, whatever the goal is. And that's another thing. You learn how to make goals. Sometimes you reach them, sometimes you don't, just like in business and life. You reset. Reset all the time. So talk about the fact that in women's sports, we're now finally seeing really the rise of the WNBA. What? Tennis was the first one actually. Tennis was the first. We did it in 70. And now we're finally seeing others. In 73, the US Open got equal prize money, which is amazing. But the WNBA, well, the NBA owns the WNBA. I don't know if people know that. And they're starting to do more separate situations. But without the NBA, we never would have had a WNBA. Because David Stern, I'll never forget, I was sitting next to him at the US Open, he loved tennis. And I said to him, you have to, you have to promise me one thing, and he goes, what? I said, you cannot let the WNBA fail. We've had other leagues, and every sport has other leagues that don't make it. The NBA almost went under in the late 70s. Oh, wow. And nobody knew about it. Yeah. But everyone's always putting women's sports down. Now they're not. And people have finally realized that women's sports is a great investment. And in the old days, they think of it as charity. And now, the mindset has completely changed. Finally, I'm like, yes, I waited my whole life for this. I have. I was 11, 12 years old, and I keep saying, everyone should be trying this, and the best one should have a place to play. Julie Fowdy, the Niners, the 99ers in 1999, they won the World Cup. They had over 90,000 people. Everyone said, nobody's going to show up. For a whole year, we had to hear, why are we doing that? No one's going to show up for that. They had over 90,000 in 1999. And Julie Fowdy and I had a discussion about equal money from the association, the soccer, USA Soccer and all that. I said, well, are you willing to give up something to get something? And you have to believe in your value, but you have to be realistic, too, and understand where you are at as far as the financial aspect, all that. And kids come up to me, and they go, oh, I'm in whatever sport. And they go, what should I do? I said, learn the business. Tennis. I go, who puts the tournament on? Do you know who they are? Do you know who the promoter or owner is? Did you get paid? And they go, of course I got paid. Sure. I said, well, do you know if they made money this week or lost money? They go, what do you mean? I said, have you ever asked them? No. So I, personally, because I've owned tournaments, I've been on that side, and I always wanted to know how they were doing as well as a player, because guess where my money was going to go? My prize money, if we weren't doing well, right in the old budget, I wasn't going to get to keep it. It has to go with the business. Totally. I mean, that's just, that's the, I love business. So I always did, always have, will continue until my last breath, to try to do things and help invest. We just started a women's hockey, ice hockey league, the PWHL. It's doing an unbelievable first year. They've had record, I mean, Montreal's had over 20,000. Whatever the stadium can handle, that's, it's full. That's amazing for a first year. Now, the U.S. will have, we have six teams, three in the U.S. and three in Canada, but, you know, in Canada, ice hockey's a religion. But it's always about, everything for me in business is wanting every child to have the dream. As a child, I knew I couldn't play baseball because of my gender. At nine years old, I was crushed. I'll never forget that as long as I live. And now Ilana and I are part owners of the Dodgers. Yeah. Which is really funny. It's so full circle. You know, it's like, okay, this is good. Ice hockey, don't know one thing about it. And watching it like, where is it? But we're going to do it. But we did it. And if we're going to further the world in terms of any cause, we need both women and men. Everyone. It needs, it takes everyone. And so what I just want to say to you in closing, Billie Jean, is you have been an amazing advocate, example, mentor, investor, spokesperson, team player. I mean, you've really taught generations of us what the world could look like. And for me, that's just been a huge inspiration. Well, thank you. I have one added thing. Most girls, if you listen to them, a lot of times it was their father in sports. Yes. And so the men have really made a difference, and that's where I hope dads understand how important they are. They're huge. They really are. And I can't believe how many fathers, like say in hockey or other sports, just keep listening. And so everyone's in on this, not just for girls. Everyone's in on it. Yep. It's not just girls helping girls. It's all of us. All of us. Helping girls, just like we've always tried to help the boys in sports. Totally. So we need all of us to do that. And I hope everyone kind of understands that and how important each person is. And I'm not done yet. Speaking of. Oh, I know you're not. You're not even close. This is the ending that's the beginning. You're just now back on the court as of COVID, which means even in business and in advocating investment, I kind of think you've come a long way, but you've still got a long road ahead of you. And I love that. I really want to thank you for all you do for gender equity, and you have for a long, long time. And it means so much, not only to me, but so many people throughout the world. So I just want to thank you. Thanks. Thanks for the conversation.