SFOD-D [Delta Force] Carbine "Gordon Carbine" to 500yds: Practical Accuracy

This episode was brought to you by Slate Black Industries. For M-Lok grips and accessories, visit slateblackindustries.com. Tango Romeo 6, this is Rooftop Actual, thanks for the lead in, we are on objective, over. Roger, good hunting, Tango Romeo 6 out. Alright, ready? Fire and ready. Impact. Single shot to the engine block. 200. Impact. Okay. 250. I may have to hold off to the left a little bit. Just start to, yeah. Yeah. Impact, dead center. Impact. Alright. On a 300. Impact. I am feeling a little bit more back pressure than when we don't use a suppressor. Yeah. Alright, 350. I'm just going to maybe hover slightly over it. Okay. Just high. Okay. Left edge. Impact. Okay, those are actually dead on holds. Okay, 400. Maybe I'm going to just hover over this one because that first, that 350 when I hovered over, it was a miss over. Yeah. Okay, off the left side. High. Okay. Bump it down. Yeah. Maybe about half a target. Okay, that was high by about half a target. Right by about two-thirds of a target. Why don't I switch to iron sights? Okay. That way I can judge my elevation a little easier. Yeah, and where are you going to hold low, right? Yeah, I'm going to hold low like below the six o'clock. Alright, I'm on that 400. Okay. Just off the right edge. Impact. Okay. Yeah, so basically I'm putting a gap in between the target and the top of the iron sights and favoring left just ever so slightly. And that's because your irons are zeroed at 450 yards or 400 meters. Correct. I mean the way I zeroed iron sights sometimes, some of my rifles I like to do a six o'clock hold. Yeah. It's beneficial. It's beneficial sort of like how the Swiss do it on range targets because you can actually see your target that you're shooting at. Okay. Well, I'm on at 450. Okay, 450. Send one more without an adjustment. Impact. That was a hit. That's two. 500. Just off the left edge. I think that might have been just under, but use the same hold. Yeah, low. Impact. Good hit. All right. Twelve and a half inch barrel. Let's go. Irene, baby, cleared the course. That was for a 12 and a half. I mean, that was a clean run, but at the same time, that's kind of a misnomer saying for a 12 and a half. Right. I think that's a great place to kick off the conversation here because conceptually, there's definitely misnomers associated with how and what is capable with different barrel lengths. And when we talk about the difference between, say, something like this, which is a 14.5, and the 12 and a half. There's actually not a lot as far as velocity goes. In terms of velocity. So there's a misnomer that exists in terms of you lose approximately 100 feet per second per inch of barrel lost. So between the 14 and a half and the 10 and a half inch barrels, it's immense. Yeah. There's a substantial. 400, I think, was really difficult for the 10 and a half. Yeah. Once we got past 300, the 10 and a half, I mean, it wasn't awesome. We couldn't see a lot of plate movement. How were the plate movements? I could see the plate movements out of the 12 and a half. So same ammo, 55 M193s. So the difference in velocity between these two are roughly, I would say, maybe about like 50, 70 feet per second. Yep. 50 to 70, right? But then at the same time, the amount of maneuverability, being able to flush mount the suppressor, I mean, that's immense. If we got to pick kind of one barrel length that we had to do everything with, i.e. what this car being is for you, anywhere between like the lowest being 11 and a half up to the 14 and a half are kind of the range that we really gravitate towards. When I was in the military, the idea was you have to have co-witness optics. Yeah. Otherwise it was terrible. When I left the military, I've realized that's not exactly the case. Right. Because the optics, so this one being zeroed at 200 meters, I was able to effectively use it. The red dot you're referencing, right. Pretty much out to 350. You saw me still making pretty effective hits. At 400 yards, I switched to the iron sights, which were a lollipop hold, a six o'clock zero that I learned from Swiss rifles and Mike from Bloke on the Range. And that seemed to be actually quite ideal because I could engage a four, four, 15, five. You're going from a low hold to kind of a low off target to low on target to dead on target. And I was able to entirely negotiate. That's a good point for us to then talk about the aperture that you used on this because I know there was a lot of commentary on the A1 video about, well, you guys flipped to the large open night sight or low light visibility sight at distance. That was a mistake. So we've been getting a lot of feedback on our M16A1 series sights. And I wanted to take this opportunity to address some of the misconceptions that may be out there. But instead of quoting our 18 months of service in the Marine Corps as a Lance Corporal in the mid 80s, I'm going to go ahead and quote an actual M16A1 TM. Now, right here, you see the M16A1 and you look at the rear sights. It's got a two position rear sight. One is marked L for long range. And both of the aperture diameters are in fact the same. The long range sights bump your original zero from 200 meters up to three to 400 meter engagements. Simple and effective combat rear sights. Now, the L again is not for low light. How could this have gotten confused? Some people may have been issued what you see on the Gordon carbine. One is a large 7mm sight and the other one marked L for long range. And the large diameter sight is for low light. The small diameter sight is the one marked L for long range. Some guys may have been issued these sights during the 70s or the 80s instead of the regular late 60s A1 sights. This may be a source of confusion for a lot of people. And that may be why people keep on telling me that I should not have used the L sight for long distance. However, for the Gordon carbine, I used the small diameter sight. I used that for the 400 meter engagement and the aim point at 200. And you saw that was fairly effective. Regardless, the L is always on the smaller diameter aperture. We'll cut a little bit more of a video on this topic a little later on why sometimes even though people qualified experts, memories could be hazy. But as far as right now, thanks for watching so far and we'll go back into the regular content. The M16 video, I zeroed that rifle as per military specifications. Meaning I did the 25 meter zero with the short range sight. And then I trued it at 200. And I zeroed it with the post on the target, the point of impact. Point of aim was point of impact for that, not the 6 o'clock hold. So it did not allow me the extra versatility in using those iron sights. And when you say that, when you say it didn't allow you the extra versatility, you're saying because you're not using a 6 o'clock hold, you're not able to see the target. And therefore, when you get to needing to push beyond where the sight is zeroed at, you're fully losing the target behind the sight. Your elevation is entirely off if that's the only distance you can use it at. I mean, what's the right answer? Should you use the mil-spec way or not? I mean, what distance are you using it? I mean, it's entirely up to you. For the M16, the A1 series anyways, they didn't expect for it to push past 400 meters, quite frankly. I mean, the Marines, even when they zeroed, they had DIs coming around to the recruits' front sights and use a nail to increase the elevation. Right. That's an important point as well is that, practically speaking, are you going to be trying to adjust your front sight with the tip of a round or a nail or a tool? I mean, in the middle of an engagement, I don't see how that would be possible. But again, maybe, who knows. But then at the same time, what is your engagement distance with that particular weapon system? Right. So on this particular carbine, you've got a low light setting, but you are using the smaller aperture sight. I am using the smaller aperture sight just for the longer distance engagement because I can actually get a better sight picture for longer distance engagements with iron sights as opposed to red dot sights. And that's, I mean, if we haven't crushed this by now, that iron sights are inaccurate and difficult to engage at long distance, it takes time and practice. I personally practiced a lot with it because I liked NRA matches and I didn't like spending a lot of money on gizmos when I was in college. And so that is a part of it that you can't say iron sights are inaccurate. If they were inaccurate, then people wouldn't be fighting wars with them back in the day. Yeah, I mean, there are a lot of people who have been put in the ground by guns with iron sights. So, I mean, in the long run, 12.5 inch barrel. 55 grain ammo. Dual sighting system. It's a viable platform if you put the time into it. Yes. That's a key point if you put the time into it. Yeah. And that doesn't necessarily change just because you throw an optic on either, like a magnified optic. It's certainly easier to see things. Sure. But it doesn't necessarily mean you're going to be more accurate as a shooter. You have to learn how to use whatever system you end up utilizing. And that's really what it comes down to. Yeah. I'd like to say thanks to our friend Rex, actually, for leading us in with the awesome intro. Amazing channel. If you haven't seen his channel, he talks a lot about long range shooting. Actually, the Sniper 101 is the entry course to a lot of amateur shooters, I would say, out there. And at that note, Irene? Irene! Fucking Irene. Furthermore, it's already separated into the different categories, so you can go back to your argument as quickly as possible. And whether you decide to support us via Patreon, subscription, or just a normal viewer, we thank you. Sniper 1-6, this is 0-9-6, 4-6, 8-packs, Red-Con-1, Green-Green, copy, over. 0-9-6, this is Sniper 1-6, roger, over. 0-9-6, 0-9-1, 1-packs, Green-Green, 1-Vector, 2-packs, Red-Con-1, over.