Russell Brand convicted: Why this case is different

Let's talk more about this Russell Brand case, the verdicts today. He's been found guilty of rape and other sexual offences, being acquitted on a number of others and now facing two more allegations of rape, which the Metropolitan Police say they are investigating and have already interviewed Russell Brand about. under caution. Andy Hughes joins me, LBC's crime correspondent and co-host of Global's podcast, The Crime Agents. The judge has made it very clear he is not minded to give him bail. He's minded to remand him in custody. What will be happening now? Well, Russell Brand will be in a holding cell. He has been refused bail. And he's waiting for a prison van to pick him up and take him to jail, his first day in jail. How the process is, I mean, it depends on which jail he's going to, but he could be sharing the van with other people who've just been convicted that day or are on remand. It will certainly be a rude awakening for Russell Brand when that prison door shuts this evening. Let's talk a bit about this trial, because the successful rape, The allegation, if that's the word for it, the one he's been found guilty of, it had some interesting characteristics, didn't it, which certainly you and I talked about. It certainly led us to think it would lead to a guilty verdict. And it did. Talk about those characteristics. Yeah, well, these historical sexual abuse or rape cases are notoriously difficult to prove in court. And really, the only way that you can do that is if the person who has been attacked. Reports it contemporaneously to people she knows. So this victim reported it to her family, her friends. Shortly after it happened. Shortly after it happened, attended a sexual health clinic. So this is all on record. So... Evidence, emotional impact, reaction, friends, parents. Exactly. And that is very powerful for prosecutors. And you've seen it in this case. The cases that didn't have that, the charges that didn't have that, were found not guilty. So that just shows how important that is for detectives and prosecutors. The guest I had just a moment ago was pointing out, and she was only pointing out what is true, is that without that, often... Cases are simply dismissed as unprosecutable, which leads us to that really hideously low prosecution rate that we do have. Oh, yeah. I mean, it's it is depressing reading, looking at the statistics around rape cases. Only 16 percent of female rape victims even reported to the police. And of those, the charge rate is only 5 percent. And of those 5% that do actually get to court, and many don't, many drop out because of the huge waiting lists, only 60% result in convictions, just below 60%. And on average, a four to six year wait for your trial can be longer. I've spoken to a woman in this very studio who dropped out of her case because it was nigh on seven by the time she decided to drop out. But you would describe this case, in terms of timescale, as an anomaly. It is, because I've spoken to several rape victims over the years who've done just that. Their lives have been put on hold for several years. I spoke to one woman who was waiting six years, and finally she just had enough. She just pulled out. The CPS and the prosecutors, they weren't moving fast enough. There is a huge backlog. And this is one of these arguments for jury-less trials, but I mean... And special rape and sexual assault courses. Listen, I've been reporting on crime and justice for 20 years. I am still, frankly, angry and astonished at the way rape victims are treated by our justice system. It needs to change. This case is an anomaly. This is fairly swift. I mean, three years is still too long for any victim. Really, this whole system needs to change. I've been talking this hour with callers about entitlement enabling people who are rapists. Would you argue that at some level, the justice system itself enables? Oh, without a doubt. Well, what it does is it evades justice because so many people are accused of these awful crimes and they never face justice. And really, the main reason is the justice system itself. I think if you are a woman who has come forward to report a rape, one of the first things they do is take your phone off you, and then they go through the phone, and then they subject you. To see whether you've been a bad girl ever in your life. Exactly. So what were the messages? So all of this goes on. So the whole system is stacked against people coming forward, and if they do, they've got to wait five, six years. And also, and again, I'm not alluding specifically to details in this trial, but we've talked about it many times on air, both you and I and with callers. The idea that because you are in a relationship with somebody or because you have gone to bed with them, that if that then, in your view, goes awry and turns into a sexual assault on you, the fact that you had already got naked and got into bed with somebody means, well, then love. You cry foul, you cry rape, but as though we don't know the difference between sex and rape. It's... This has been such a huge problem for rape prosecutions over the years because a woman has consented into a relationship but the man or whoever the perpetrator is will take it too far and they will use that initial consenting as a weapon. It means I can now do anything. As a weapon. Exactly, and another really disturbing thing about this case is that people of power and the way they are protected so many people would have had to have known about Russell Brand, in fact there were WhatsApp groups warning women on the comedy circuit about his behaviour so he's been hiding in plain sight for years and speaking in plain sight about his predilections joking about it Joking about it. Yeah, and the police in that statement that was made have urged anyone who may have been a victim, not necessarily of him, but yes, of him, if they feel they have, but a victim of rape and serious sexual assault speak to us, you'll be listened to, you'll be supported, you'll be treated with dignity and respect. And we heard from the Crown Prosecution's head of the Rape and Serious Sexual Offences Unit. Thank They're trying, but boy, do they have a mountain to climb for women to trust them, I think. Oh, 100%. I mean, we know from this case alone Senior investigating officer believes there are more victims. So this is what looks like it isn't the end for Russell Brand. Thank you very much indeed, Andy. Andy Hughes, LBC's crime correspondent, you. co-host of Global's podcast, The Crime Agents.