LBC callers face off with Reform politician over small boats policy

After watching LBC's investigation into Bulgaria, I'm even more worried than before. And there's one thing I really want to know. Does the government's response come anywhere close to matching the scale of the problem? We've just seen the size of the operation behind these crossings. I mean, we're talking about vast criminal networks operating across Europe, making enormous amounts of money, bringing people illegally into this country. I mean, this isn't a few blokes standing on a beach in Calais. This is an international organised crime syndicate. It's a business and a very lucrative one. Some boats are capable of carrying up to 100 people. Now, if each person, let's say, carries, you know, pays £5,000, is that right, the calculation? That's half a million pounds for one boat. Half a million. These gangs aren't going to stop because Andy Burnham offers us some hope. So who's going to stop them? Hope certainly won't. Because what do we do keep hearing from the government? The numbers are down. Well, excuse me, but is that the ambition now? I thought the ambition was to stop the boats. But now it's, oh, we have fewer boats. Because stopping the boats and fewer boats, they're very two different things. And personally, I want them stopped and I want them stopped now. Do you? But here's what really bothers me. The government actually does have the power to stop it. They really do. They can detain those that arrive and deport them to third countries instead of doing everything they can, right? What are they doing? They're giving them leaflets telling them it's illegal to have sex with children. By their own admission, by the way, of giving those leaflets, they recognise that the men arriving are a danger to women and girls. They know that some are IRGC operatives. They know that some are convicted Muslim Brotherhood bomb makers have made it through. You'd think, right? You'd think that them sitting in their fancy office, they'd be saying to themselves, oh, God, we'd better stop this now. But instead, instead, they've decided to spread the illegal migrants accommodation across towns and villages like Pidington and tell us, suck it up and we have to take our fair share. As if it's as if it's some kind of, I don't know, war effort for the greater good. Is that what you want? And if it is what you want, I really do want to hear from you. And if you don't want that, I want to know whether you think that the government is pulling all the levers they can, is putting all the levels of resources and determination that is necessary to stop it. Because these aren't abstract questions, by the way. No, no, no. We're talking about the safety of the people living in this country. And I don't think that's an extraordinary demand. Do you? It's the most basic responsibility of the state. I mean, they have the monopoly of violence, right? I don't have the capability of going and stopping an illegal migrant and detaining and deporting him. And I don't know about you, but I do think, I do really think, and perhaps it's because I'm a woman, that protecting women and children should be right at the top of the government's priorities. Is it? And this brings me back to the scale of the problem, right? We have international gangs moving boats and equipment across Europe. We've got people paying thousands of pounds to reach Britain, people making a hefty profit out of it. And we've got a government that keeps talking about reducing crossings. But is it using every tool it has to actually stop the crossings? And if not, why not? That's the question. Because if the government says it needs more power, tell us what they are. If it needs detention capacity, explain what they're doing to provide it. If it needs agreements with other countries, tell us which agreements are missing and how they're pursuing it? Because a reduction in crossing is a measurable result, and I salute the government, but it isn't quite the same thing as bringing it to an end, is it? And I think the public is entitled to know what the government's actual objective is. Is it reducing or is it stopping? So here's what I want to discuss this evening. Is the government matching the scale of the small boat crisis? Is the government action? And if you believe the government is doing enough, I particularly want to hear from you. Tell me what you think is working, because after seeing that investigation by LBC into Bulgaria, I think we need a serious conversation about the gap between the size of the criminal operation and the government's response. And one question just keeps coming back to me. If the government knows the scale of the problem, why isn't it doing more to stop it? And honestly, it beggars belief. You know, LBC has been given exclusive access to border access to border force in Bulgaria, who have seized hundreds of small boats bound for crossing the channel in the UK. The Kapitan Andreevo checkpoint with Turkey is one of the world's busiest land borders and is the front line of Europe's migration crisis. Criminals here are now being supported by the British National Crime Agency to thwart the criminal gangs trafficking migrants. and stop the equipment for small boats crossing, getting across. Where is the PM's sense of urgency here? Do you think he really understands the scale of the problem? We're going to take a quick call before the break from Jim in Dumfries and Galloway. Hello, Jim. Hi there, Leila. Go on. What do you think? I think he could stop the boats and the people if he wanted. Why do you think he doesn't want to? Well, I don't know why he doesn't want to, I'm sure. I'm sure a lot of people would like to know why he doesn't stop them. Do you think people actually don't want him to? Do you think there is an electorate out there that he's trying to appease by not stopping the boats? Is there anyone in the country who wants thousands of illegal men arriving on our shores? Oh, there are. I mean, the people that chant refugees are welcome here. They don't want them living near them, of course. They just want them somewhere in the country for some unknown reason. So the Greens, I presume, most of Labour, Lib Dems, they all seem to want them, even maybe some Tories. What is the benefit? Why would anyone want that? I don't think anybody knows the answer to that, apart from maybe Andy Burnham and a few of his pals. Yeah, I mean, that is the question, right? Yeah, but the fact that he could stop them, that's the thing. Of course, he could stop them, he could stop them. There are so many levers he could pull that he's not pulling. Absolutely there are, and he's not doing it. And this little thing that he's talking, the clip he paid where he's saying thank you to LBC for shining lights on this, they're doing everything they can. They really are not. No, they're not. Yep. His nose is getting longer and longer. Leila, we can stop the votes tomorrow if we wish. The only reason I believe we're letting them in is for votes. For votes. Well, they can't vote for a long time. But once they're in, it only takes a matter of time for them to vote. Now, that is a sinister point of view, Peter, but I've heard it before. It could be. It could be, but I've been around since Margaret Thatcher, so I've seen them all come and go. I am a reformer, and i will be a reformer going forward good man peter but i i do believe the other parties brand you as a one-trick pony all we talk about is votes i think we before it all kicks off for the election start looking at other things where people are going to say actually yeah i want to go with reform i don't know get rid of the bbc license well i mean to be fair with taiwan to be fair peter we have said that we're going to increase the threshold to 15 000 pounds saving you know couples a lot of money we do talk about other things but i think the problem is is that the small boats keep coming into people's minds because you hear of you know another man who's come over illegally who sexually assaulted someone who's an irgc operative and and and it's so pertinent because really it's the duty it's the duty of the government to stop it and everyone's asking why are you not stopping it if we're not being told we can only assume yeah that's true No, that is a good point. And by staying silent on why they won't stop it, that's when, you know, you can say things like you did. Are they doing it for the votes? And that's, yeah, that's when the mind wanders. I must admit, though, I do think Russell needs to slightly move away from the votes. Only slightly, because it is the biggest problem. But, Peter, we're the only party who's really talking about it and we're the only party putting pressure to stop it. If we stop talking about it, I'm afraid no one else will. Next is Paul from Twickenham. Hi, Paul. Hi, Leila. I think a wise, humane and compassionate government would start dealing with this issue by negotiating with the French to have an application asylum centre in Calais where people can have their asylum applications dealt with there. And if they're successful, they can come across in a big boat. What would success look like? Who would you want to pass through that test? Anyone who's fleeing from persecution and has a legitimate claim for asylum, it wouldn't entirely, in my view, stop the small boats. I think we're running into danger here. Is there a limit to how many people you'd like to... You said anyone. Is there a limit to how many? Anyone who's entitled to a claim to asylum is welcome, in my opinion. That's a wide ranging reason. I mean, is there a limit to the numbers you want to see here, Paul? And are you willing to pay that extra money in tax to support them once they do come here? Well, I think once they do come, Leila, they should be allowed to work. There should be sponsorship from people and churches and organisations. What if they don't work? Sorry? If they come here and they don't work, and we do have a lot of people that come here and don't work, are you willing to pay for their upkeep for the rest of their lives? I'm willing to pay for, well, I'm willing to pay for those who genuinely can't work. Those who can work, I would like to encourage to work, to integrate, to be sponsored. Integrate? Layla, we're getting away from my main point in ringing, which is to say we're in danger here of branding a whole group of people. Let's asylum seekers. I don't want criminals here. But how do you know they're not criminals, Paul? I think their application asylum should be tested in Calais or in other embassies. But if they don't have any form of identity and you can't exactly do criminal background checks from Afghanistan, how do you know they're not criminals? I think, Leila, there's two options here. I see a black and a white side to this because on the one hand, we're told by someone who had authority to love our neighbour. and we're also told to be wise not to allow the country How about loving the people here? They're also our neighbour How about loving British people? How about a bit of love to the women in Piddington? That would go a long way Well, I think, Leila, we're in danger here and the people who are And we are in danger rampantly anti anybody claiming asylum I think it's gravely, it's a retrograde step it's not a country i want to be part of where no one is wanted here it's not true that all people who we have a great humanitarian small boats including children and women where they are dismissed as some kind of plague i think we're going back to the 30s i think we're in danger i don't think we had this problem in the 30s actually the problem i'm talking about other countries Leila, what other countries? Germany, i'm talking about where we you're coming hang on what what what about germany are you comparing not wanting illegal migrants to what happened in germany to the jews yes i am making that sort of comparison i certainly am wow i mean honestly paul i find that quite an abhorrent view um i don't want unvetted illegal men coming into this country and being allowed to roam freely i don't want IRGC operatives or Muslim Brotherhood terrorists or potential rapists that have to be given leaflets to teach them that it's illegal to have sex with children and you think not wanting that is comparable to the Holocaust is that actually what you're saying Paul? People who come over hang on hang on is that what you're saying are you saying that is an unwarranted view and you're comparing it to the persecution of millions of Jewish people Layla what i'm saying if you let me finish the sentence is i don't want people coming over here with evil intent to we've got to deal we've got to deal with it by having a system where we treat asylum applications in Calais before people get into boats deal with them as best we can and when people do come over we're never going to completely solve the problem and i don't want these people would you like to have an asylum center next to you just right by I wouldn't mind, and if I did have, I'd want to go and meet them, invite them round for a cup of tea, and I'd want my local church, and the people I know, Leila, who live around me, would welcome the chance to try and get to know these people, to treat them as humans. I remember there was one man, Leila, who, he's died now, but he ran a boat in the Mediterranean that picked up people whose small boats had fallen to pieces and they were in danger of drowning. What would you tell the women that were sexually assaulted? What would you tell the women that were sexually assaulted by some men that arrive on boats? I'd say it's disgraceful and we want to punish the person and get rid of them and deport them if we can. But you're saying you want more of them? The man, we need to deal, this is a global problem. It's not going to go away and we can either deal with it passionately... It's actually a problem in the United... I'm worried about what's happening in the United Kingdom. I don't really... I'm not bothered about what's happening outside. I'm worried about... I speak to women who don't want a thousand men, unvetted, housed next to them. And you're saying that that concern is comparable to what happened in Nazi Germany. Thanks, Paul. I appreciate the call, but we're going to have to really, really strongly agree to disagree. To be fair with you, I do agree with Paul. we need to show a bit of compassion some people are coming because they really need to come here and you guys why do they need to come here? well why not? ok so should we just let everyone in? no no Paul never said that and I'm not saying that everybody everybody under the same brush just because one's done it that means everyone's done it but if I I'm not saying that I'm saying that for me and I think for a lot of women one person coming in if one person's a rapist, if one person's an IRGC operative out of 100, that's one too many. Wouldn't you agree, Royce? No, I absolutely agree, but what you're trying to say is because of that, stop every single boat because of that one person. Yeah, of course. I don't think illegal migration should be rewarded. I don't believe any crime should pay. No, exactly. So if people want to come here, like Paul said, vet them up at Calais, give them the chance, because we don't know what they've been through just because one person... We also don't know what they've done or their intentions are. well this is that's why we say how do you vet them when they don't how do you vet someone with no id well this is what we say we need to find out for the how how do you find out it's easy to say we need to find out as i said there's no criminal background checks that you can call the taliban and go do you think you could check if this guy's a known terrorist how do you vet them but what we are trying to say is that any bomb well this is not just for us so do you think shoot it do you I've got a couple of reform leaders here. Reform is nothing but pure racist. Pure racist. They got exposed badly this time. Nigel Farage is the same person who takes back and does, and he couldn't explain himself. He's part of the... Now, now, now. So, Raz, Raz, Raz, Raz. He's talking into your comment. They're exposing exactly what they are. Raz, this is a two-way conversation. Okay, we're going to have a two-way conversation, or else I'm going to hang up. That's fine. Okay, so if you want to have a conversation with me, calm down number one and um i'm going to ask you one question then i'm going to have to cut it off so you want illegal immigrants to keep coming in correct i didn't say that well i didn't say paul paul never said that you were trying to put words in his mouth i'm not trying to put words in your mouth i'm trying i'm trying to reach the conclusion of your argument and the conclusion of your argument what is the conclusion of your argument so it's for instance a center where they can go before we vet them and everything how do you vet someone who doesn't have id well we need to find out what country, so it's not hard to find out. And then, let's say someone, and they're from Afghanistan, how do you vet them? You can't. You can't vet them. You can't vet them. I'd rather, Raz, I'd rather keep the women of this country safe, than give the benefit of the doubt to someone who's trying to come into this country under illegal means. That's me, and I think a lot of people would agree. I hope they would. I want to say that the term asylum seeker really really please do not use it it begs the question asylum is a place of safety many people who cross the channel have passed through not only france a place of safety but many cases many countries before that and the word to seek has a kind of biblical connotation of sincerity and genuineness they're migrants don't they're illegal migrants asylum seekers migrant we don't know just leave it neutral migrant but not asylum seeker they are not because when you say asylum seeker people of goodwill and empathy go all sorts of jelly wobble and think oh the poor people we must be kind but we are so vulnerable we are so stupid it's it's the language begs the question and we I feel it's terribly strong point we just should not use it. I couldn't agree with you more, Susie. And the only reason we use it, they are actually illegal migrants. But as soon as they say the magic word, it's like open sesame. They're not seeking asylum. They are applying for a label that calls them asylum seekers. Susie, I couldn't agree with you more. Do you think the government's doing enough? No, absolutely not. What do you want? Are you happy the numbers are down or do you want to stop? I think we should resile from the UN Convention of 1951 because that gives us huge problems it says you cannot take steps against a person by reason of the manner in which they they entered your country if they enter exactly that Susie you are you are on the ball on that yeah I I that is so profound because in 1951 we didn't have uh the common motor cars we didn't have uh airplanes we didn't have all the means of transport that we now have well it was it was never meant to facilitate illegal migration of course it wasn't it was a different time and and we're I'm sorry I it just please stop please would LBC stop calling them asylum seekers point taken I shall speak to them UN document they are just migrant that's neutral just migrant and then you can determine are they legal or illegal well I would say they're illegal by virtue of coming here illegally if we're restricting it to the small boat so-called small boat to channel migrants I agree with you but but as an overall thing persons entering without what's called leave to enter um yes migrants okay yeah there is legal immigration and illegal immigration and we're talking about illegal yeah thank you very much susie and i will pass the message on to the powers that be in LBC? So listen, I've been listening to this show from the start with great interest and I can't believe listening to this hour how hypocritical you're being. You had a chap on there a couple of minutes ago talking about the boats and you turned around and said to him if there's one person on the boat that's a racist, stop all of them coming in. And in the previous hour you said please don't judge the whole party by a number of members that have been let's say less than favourable. Well which is it? But are you, is it different standards for different things? Of course it is, because these are illegal migrants. I don't have a filtering system to know who's coming in and who's don't. Well, what filtering system then is reform using to get people out? When someone's found to be a racist in reform, they are kicked out. When someone's found to be a rapist or an IRGC operative, they're not kicked out of the country. They're here and they become a burden and they become a danger to the country. OK, OK, fair enough. Do you not agree? Well, I agree at that point, but I just believe that it's a bit hypocritical. But, Kieran, look at this objectively, right? If 100 people come on those boats like we saw in Bulgaria and two of them, or one of them, is a national security risk, you really want to take that risk? Why do you want to give anyone... They're coming in deceptively, you know, under deceptive means without identification. Why should I give them the benefit of the doubt? Why shouldn't my priority be to the British people and be like, you know what? I don't know who these people are. I have no idea who they are. And that unknown is a huge risk. And I'm going to take that unknown into consideration and protect the British people from it. Okay. And then, well, if that's the case, you're saying they're vetting all these people before they come in. But you can't vet them. Oh, I mean, of course, we have very... What vetting are you doing? We have very strict vetting. Very strict vetting. I was vetted before I entered. But as I said, people can pretend to be something they're not during the vetting process and then say things after. It's very, you can't vet for someone for what they say after. It's the nature of being a human being and it's abhorrent. And I think you should judge a party by the actions they take when something like that is found out. And the action we take is a zero tolerance. On the small boats issue, they're not that small anymore. No, sadly. What exactly then? And so your reforms say they'll stop it. So how do you think you're going to just stop, be able to come in and stop it? And how long will it take you to stop it? Number one, we treat them like criminals and we detain and deport them immediately. You know, right now there is no... Deport them to where? Third world countries. So that's third countries. We'd have agreements with other countries or return them to where they're from. We have no problem returning them to the country they're from. And we will use all diplomatic levers that we can to ensure that that country takes them back. But I can assure you also that unlike successive governments is that reforms policy is that if you come to this country illegally, you will have no access to the benefits of this country. You will have no access to welfare and you will have no chance of ever becoming a British citizen or being housed under the British state. And I think you'll find that that that sorry, I think that's fair. I think that's fair. And I think I think once they recognize that, what's the point of me going to England crossing the boat? there's nothing there for me it's the pull factor and i think once you stop that i think i think they'll stop coming and it's happened i think australia did the same thing and and it's less about where you deport them because i think once the pull factor stops, they'll stop seeing a benefit in coming over so you have to leave the ECHR or to be able to do that, the ECHR yeah we would have to leave the ECHR and I think you'll be able to do that when you when it's so tied into the Belfast Agreement. Yeah, but the Belfast Agreement can also come under national law. You know, we could write separate legislation to cover that. But we cannot have... The way you're coming across, sorry to interrupt you there, but the way the party's coming across, it sounds like it's going to come in and basically do like what Trump would say, I'll have this sorted out in a day, I'll have that sorted out in a month. I mean, to be fair to Trump, he brought... To be fair to Trump, he brought illegal migration down to almost, I think, zero very quickly. Kiran, there hasn't been the political will to do it. There just hasn't been. And I think now there's definitely the public appetite. And I think that I would almost say a public desperation for it to stop. And it's the government's duty to do it. The government's the only person, the only organisation that can. I think there's a reason why Labour is refusing to stop these illegal, strangers who we know nothing about and they don't do any checks and I think it's quite obvious really I think it's an agenda I think the left have always hated our history and our culture and they think that they can use a battering ram by using mostly let's be honest Islamic immigrants to wreck our and our communities to dissolve our patriotism and I think it's an agenda I really do because what other government would be so careless to actually put so many men every day of every week of every month of every year into our communities and make women and girls unsafe there's got to be an agenda going on i mean and the previous caller a previous caller said that said in the absence of a reason you've got to assume the worst yeah oh you've got to i mean you've got to assume the worst, we haven't been, we have not really been given a reason why he won't stop, yeah, and as well do you remember when um Labour said they're going to bring in this um uh misogyny law, well that they've scrapped that, and I've been writing so many times to the different uh politicians asking where this is, you know, what's happening here, I never get any response obviously because they uh um they couldn't be bothered to reply but the reality is they've scrapped it because of their core voters, now I'm not stupid, I'm not racist, you're a Muslim yourself and who I really respect, I've got no problem with people who are Muslim, I actually have a a lodger who's a Muslim. Yeah, but he's got a lot in Shepherd's Bush. Yeah, but there is a problem with Islam. There's a problem with radical Islam. There is. There is a problem with radical Islam. And don't forget, we are a country, you remember London was called Londonistan 20 years ago. And do you remember Abu Hamza, the terrorist with the hook? Yeah, absolutely, yeah. Do you remember, basically they said that, you know, the government has said that you can come and live here and seek refuge here as long as you don't attack this country. and and now you know you reap what you sow, we've allowed the Muslim, we've you know we haven't proscribed the Muslim Brotherhood, we've allowed you know, I remember 10 years ago going to an event with a conservative minister and he was saying how madrasas are a hotbed of radical Islam and hate and I literally put my hand up and I'm like why don't you close them down and he said well we can't because of community cohesion and and that that's a betrayal well yeah do you remember when the police were ripping down posters of Jewish hostages all around London. Yeah, I do. And they allow El-Kuds to march holding signs of Ayatollah Khomeini. It's weird, yeah. And I was told, you know, I said, if I was mayor, you know, I would stop those marches. And someone would, you know, I think a Labour MP was like, well, don't you believe in freedom of speech? And I said, freedom for me is if a Jewish young boy can go to school with a kippah without security. It is not people marching, praising Ayatollah Khomeini. And right now, that freedom doesn't exist here. But I do think, unfortunately, that there's a lot of people in this country who are more in despair than anger. And I think that, I don't think it's... I think despair and anger. Well, no, I think they're in more despair now than anger. I think the anger is sort of gone and it's in despair. And I've got to be honest with you, I am very, very worried that Labour are going to get in again, because the right are going to split the vote. Now, I've got to be honest as well that Kemi is fantastic. I do really, really like her and I prefer her than Farage, but I will vote for Reform this time. I will do that because they are the ones with the momentum, although they're losing the momentum and something's got to happen. Don't believe everything you read in the press, Luke. We're not losing momentum. Well, they're our last hope. I mean, they're our last hope. They are. And we're going to have to agree to disagree on Kemi. But all I can say is don't believe what you see. You know, I go up and down the country. The momentum is there. The support is there. and we're going to stop the boats. I admire your patriotic approach. Thank you, Mike. I just think it's lovely that somebody can feel passionate about our country and care. Best country in the world. It certainly is. And I just love the fact that Nigel follows Putin as his hero. I think it's lovely to see that. He doesn't follow Putin as his hero. He does. I've heard, I've seen. You've heard and received, but you must be watching AI. Go on, Mike. Well, maybe if you're following, if I went into McDonald's and I bought or a well-known burger chain and I had a really nasty burger, I would have a problem with McDonald's, the firm, the brand. And when you see reform, I see nothing but problems, absolute problem after problem. These people are not nice people you want to go and have a drink with. And I did think that when you started the conversation at the evening, that you were working on the script. It's a very, very obvious script that you're working to. And the boats are definitely not the problem that we have, even though you've inflated it, excuse the pun, but you seriously go on about the boats. Yeah, you know why I go on, Mike? You know why I go on about it, Mike? Because women are scared. Because women who have asylum centres next to them are scared. They don't want, they don't, I don't care about the, it's not about the statistics. It's about what people feel. of being sexually abused by a British man as you have from somebody coming over. Wow, is this coming from a man? Are you telling women that they have no right to be scared when illegal migrants are housed next to them? No, no, you put words into people's mouths. No, I don't put words. You really do. No, I don't, Mike. I would just... I'll tell you why I... Let's look at one of your colleagues. Let's go to Suella Braverman. Hang on. Shall we go to Suella Braverman who said... Mike, Mike, Mike, if you want to rant, if you want to rant, Mike, if you want to rant, if you want to rant, I suggest you leave a voice note. If you want a two-way conversation, then you're going to have to let me speak. You don't give people a chance all night and i know i know i don't like to finish my conversation no no no it's my show we're going to have a conversation and i'm going to speak and then you're going to speak okay and i'll tell you why i inflate it i inflate it because the people coming on the boats are a danger to this country and it's the duty of the government to stop it now you can have your bit what do you want to say well there you go he hung up there's different numbers out there but approximately 200 plus thousand small boats have arrived between 2018 Theresa May I don't think boats I think it's people oh I'm sorry I think so you are right you are right thank you for the correction I do apologize you are quite right so yeah 205,000 illegal immigrants have arrived between Theresa May's government in 2018 and June 2026 and I looked into this and according to home office figures fewer than five percent of small boat arrivals as in the illegal immigrants who arrived on them um have been have been recorded as returned um by june 2026 so what my point i guess is that uh labor since they come came to since they you know formed their government um they had this wonderful returns agreement that was going to uh solve the small boats crisis the one out a thousand in that one exactly exactly yeah and how well has that gone it's actually ended i think it's ended yeah i mean i could have told them from the very beginning it wasn't going to work it was never going to work no i couldn't see how it was going to work we'll give this a go for a laugh but yeah um i mean it's they seem completely incompetent to actually negotiate a deal with France that would actually stop the boats. It's not France's responsibility to stop the boats. It's up to us. It's our problem. Look, I think it's going to be... The only government that I can see forming that could actually stop the boats is the reform government. And I'm not just biased. It's because I've actually read the policies of all the parties on this, and I've, you know, researched everything to do with the small boats crisis as, you know, something I'm interested in because it's the knock-on effect, the effect of these, you know, these people living here. It's just constant. They're criminals, they're terrorists often. It's just constantly people coming into our country that we're going to have to house, we're going to have to pay for. They present a national security risk. They present a risk to women and girls and it's constant. And I don't understand how Andy Burnham can sit in his office and look at that and say, we're not going to do it. We're not going to stop it. Well, I mean, I don't understand. I don't understand. Give us a proposal of what's next. I mean, one agreement's ended and there's nothing out there. No, I tell you what they're doing is they're saying everyone has to take their fair share. Right. So they're going to spread it across the country. and to be fair to them they are taking action they're giving them leaflets to tell them that they can't have sex with children i mean that that that by their very admission these men are dangerous they are and some of the iranians who were coming across as well you know that pose a grave threat to people in this country and you know what number you know it's a national security like Nigel's been saying for a long time and don't forget when he did say that they they ridiculed him and it's someone i saw recently that someone actually that there have been uh prosecutions already following people who have come across who have either been associated indirectly with the regime or or directly uh i don't want to be careful about what i say there but um i think you know 50 you know 50 IRGC operatives and and listen i i prosecuted so many illegal migrants in london uh they get the full benefit of legal aid um and so many come here to commit crime and they commit lots of crime with lots of aliases and and and it's a problem that needs to be dealt with and it's a problem of course we have our own criminals i don't see why we have that excuses more coming in illegally i can't see this is my opinion um i can't see a french government ever doing business with nigel farage government well it's already signed he signed one with the Bardella and they are polling to win. Well, that's, you know what I mean, that's on a wish. It's not on fact. Well, actually, it's on paper and it's signed. Well, they've got to win first. You can't... 100% they have to win. No, for sure. But if polling's anything to go by, I mean, they're on track to win. So it's a hope that polls are right. And the other way is... It's a bit more than hope. It's an agreement. Well, you're hoping. You're hoping that they win. Well, I hope... We don't rely on a subjective kind of wish. We're relying on the polls. But the EU work as a collective bloc. So is France going to pull out of the EU? I can't see that happening. And stop the boats. I think Labour's doing a good job. They've almost asked, if not asked it. Stop the boats is just words. How are you going to stop them? Are you going to use lethal force? So, Robin, back to reducing the boats. Do you accept that some of those coming on those boats are a national security threat? Absolutely. Okay, so fine, fine. We agree on that thing. So does reducing them eliminate that threat? They've been in power. Labour's been in power for two years and they've almost halved it. They haven't halved it. Does reducing them, reducing the numbers, eliminate the threat that these men pose? National security threat. Just a yes or no question. You're clutching at straws, Leila. I'm not. I'm saying that you can reduce it all you want. And what benefit is that? It does not eliminate the risk. I don't want to hear they've gone down from, you know, 50,000 to 40,000 to, I don't know, 33,000. I want it stopped. Because every man that comes on there could be a national security risk. The reform is hope that the French elections go the way you are. And if they don't, or the EU make a mandate. If you don't, we will have a huge deterrent and we will make it very uncomfortable for illegal migrants in this country that they'll stop coming. Anyway, Robin, I've enjoyed jousting with you. It's been great. It's been fun.