FANTASTIC FOUR: What Healthy Families Look Like

This family loves each other. They playfully tease each other. You are going to be the best dad. Just kidding. They're imperfect. They have problems, but it's not because they don't love each other. Sometimes you being you hurts me. Well, I don't mean to. Conflict is inevitable. With love and understanding, that is beautiful. Because that's what family is. It's about fighting for something bigger than yourself. This is what a healthy family looks like, and we're going to break down why. Hello, and welcome to Cinema Therapy. I'm Jonathan Decker, licensed therapist, and I stretch, but not well, because I'm old. And I'm Alan Seawright, a professional filmmaker, and I'm a big pile of rocks. More in temperament than literally, so we're going to be talking about Fantastic Four. I love this film, and I was originally going to do this as a family therapy, and then I said, oh, no, they're just actually quite healthy and functional, which is a nice change of pace from the other Fantastic Four movies where they're bickering the whole time. Yeah, which is not what the characters are. Have you read a freaking comic? Jeez. Clearly, the people at Marvel Studios have. This family loves each other. I mean, they playfully tease each other. There's banter. Listen, they're imperfect. They have problems, but it's not because they don't love each other or they're real d**ks. And I love it when people in our comments say, show us what a healthy relationship looks like and talk about why. Yeah, this is what a healthy family looks like, and we're going to break down why. Should we wait? So first of all, they celebrate each other's wins. Check this out. You're late. What do you mean? What do you mean? What do I mean? You're late for dinner. Oh, yes, we are really. By a single minute. Yes, we were just. Put some aloe iodine on my shoulder. Why is that breakfast here? Why are you being weird? You get a glint in his eye. Yeah, I'm not being weird. Well, I'm doing that weird thing with your face. Oh, we don't know what you're talking about. Are you pregnant? That is one perceptive pile of rocks. But his eyes are so deeply set and veiled in shadow, and you still catch the little knowing glint. Incredible visual effects work on the thing. You are going to be the best mom. Oh, my God. And you are going to be the best dad. Just kidding. You are out of your depth. But what sells that as Pedro Pascal's response is he just kind of goes, yes, I am basically. You're handling this well, you know. I figured you'd be locked in your lab, drenched in a panic sweat. I have that scheduled for later. The writing for Reed Richards is perfect. That is exactly like I love the Fantastic Four. I've read a bunch of the comics. Yeah. The early Stanley run is just amazing. And no one's ever gotten right on film. Right. And it's so refreshing to see. That is exactly what Reed Richards would do. And he's not joking. Yeah. He does have that scheduled for later. And what makes it absolutely sing is not only that they wrote it correctly, but Pedro Pascal, who, you know, we mostly know as like tough gruff daddy, you know, Mandalorian or flippant playboy from Game of Thrones is playing Reed Richards perfectly as Reed Richards, like contemplative, a little bit boring. Type A intellectual. Almost flat affect on a lot of stuff. And it's just an incredible performance from a guy who just disappears into roles at this point. Like, I am so impressed with Pedro Pascal in this movie. The whole time, none of them are threatened by each other's successes. It only increases, you know, the whole of the family. They're just very proud of each other. And I love that. Hey, you know what's really fantastic? Therapy? Yep. But I know there can be a lot of hesitation to start therapy. It's true. In a recent survey by today's sponsor, BetterHelp, they found that 76% of people believe mental health care can help, but so many still hold back because of stigma. Do you think that stigmas keep the Thing from living his best life? Heck no! And you shouldn't either. BetterHelp connects you with a licensed therapist who is trained to listen and give you helpful, unbiased advice. To get started, click the link below or go to betterhelp.com slash cinematherapy. And then fill out the questionnaire to assess your specific needs. You'll get matched with a therapist, in most cases, in 48 hours or less. That's fantastic. BetterHelp has a network of over 30,000 therapists with a wide range of expertise. And they're committed to helping you find a therapist who's a good fit for you, not me, not Johnny Storm. 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Fantastic help. Next, they make time for what matters to other family members. Threatening. No, no, no. Not at all. It was, uh, kind. Kind. Not kind. Warm. I don't know. It was, she was, like, right here. And I was looking into her beautiful face. And I saw stars. And I could see me in her face. Reed's, like, trying to be patient. It was kind of, um... Warm. Kind. Kind? No. I get it. Johnny loves space. Johnny loves women. Now there's a literal naked space woman. And Johnny thinks they had a moment. I think she was naked. It was probably a stellar polymer. Johnny speaks in third person. Ben loves it when Johnny speaks in third person. Again, they give each other crap all the time. Oh, yeah. It's fantastic. And it looks like they just dismissed him. Except for Sue's gonna come in. They did hear him and they are taking it seriously. Okay. So she spoke to you, yeah? And? There are 23 of these. The only repeated language. And the oldest recordings. I don't know who they are or what they're saying. But this? This is the same. This is her language. Okay. Maybe that is... See? They don't just dismiss him. He's not just, like... Reed wants to see me. Stupid younger brother. They're not... You saw me. Me? They hear. Knocked it off the list. What? The new spacesuits. And this is something Johnny was bothering Reed for for a while. Flame retardant. Maxed out oxygen supply, but... You have to monitor the gauge. If you stay flamed on in zero atmosphere, you will burn through your air reserves in less than 10 minutes. I take back every single bad thing I've been saying about you. To myself. In private. I don't know if Sue, in the moment, planned to go back and talk to him one-on-one. Or if they're just like, oh, Johnny. And then she starts to think it's like, oh, maybe... Maybe he's got something. Or maybe we shouldn't have just teased him and left. Maybe at the very least, I should hear him out. But either way, again, a flawed family. But it's a beautiful, healthy family dynamic. And then Reed taking the time to... Not just, okay, spacesuits ready. But to upgrade them because he knew it mattered to Johnny. Right. Again, there's a lot of little beautiful touches in the family dynamics in this film. That if you're just watching to be entertained or getting swept up in the superheroics. You might not hone in on, oh, this is actually showing us what it looks like. Next, they build each other up while keeping each other humble. It's a nice little balance. Hiya, pal. Johnny showed me the new suit. It's pretty spiffy. Especially compared to the old ones. How are the old ones? They weren't adequate. Who could have known? There's a lot of meaning in that glance. Please, you gotta stop beating yourself up about this. You know, Stretch, I got bad news for you. You ain't that smart. Except I am that smart. Oh, yeah? Can you cook? It's more of an art, not a science. Did you pass your driver's test? That was due to poorly marked signage. But then Reed laughs. This Galactus, this Harold... These guys are best friends. ...they're up against. Yeah. They've been best friends for forever. And, you know, you're not that smart, but also I believe in you. Yeah. And I love that when you talk about Pedro Pascal being perfect as Reed, he is very smart, but he's not without humor. Right. Right? So it's very dry. Yes. The only way that we know that he's joking is because he gives that rival smile. He plays it so dry that it's like, wait, does he really just think it was due to inadequate signage? And then he gives the smile. It's like, aha, he's in on it. Good. But just the keeping him humble of all of us are really great at some things, and all of us suck at things. Even the most brilliant people suck at something. Everybody. Yeah. Right? And so just this, hey, you need the family and Reed already knows that. Just that balance of, and you've heard me say this on the show before, if you feel respected and loved, you can be teased. Oh, absolutely. We generally only get defensive when we don't feel respected or loved. But there's so much love and respect here that Ben can just take Reed to task over. Dude, you can't cook. You can't even drive. You're not a genius. Yeah. And Reed just laughs it off. He's like, yeah, that's fair. Reed puts a lot of pressure on himself, which we'll see a bit more of. But first they work together towards shared goals. Okay. Is the shared goal deliver a baby? It's deliver a baby, escape a black hole and escape the silver surfer simultaneously. All at the same time. Yeah. No pressure at all. But the real world application of this is that life happens all at once. And when it rains, it pours, right? Yeah. So families, everyone has a role. I love the back to the future reference here. You have to hit 0.88 light speed in order to... Anyway. No, just everyone's got to play their part to make it come together. And in a healthy, functional family, instead of one person trying to do everything, they trusted each other to, okay, you've got your part. I've got my part. And it's that implicit trust. Again, the movie does a lot of showing, not telling with the family dynamics. It doesn't say, here, look how healthy they are. Just the whole time, like, this is such a good, solid, strong family. Well, I love this right here. He puts a hand on her face and that brings her back. Well, and that slightly cross-eyed exhausted look that she gives is great acting because labor is hell. And, you know, we've been talking about Pedro Pascal, but Vanessa Kirby is really the MVP of this movie. I mean, she's the MVP of most movies she's in, but true. In that clip and in what came before, everyone's doing their part to juggle the task because no one person could do it alone. And an unhealthy version of this dynamic, which I think we've seen in other Fantastic Four films, is Reed, assuming he's the smartest in the room and not trusting in his family to get things done and trying to handle everything or micromanage everybody. And instead, and maybe that happened earlier in their story and we're far enough along in this story that everyone's just like, okay, we know what everyone's strength is. We've got everyone in the lane they need to be in and we're trusting each other to get it done so that we can all focus on the thing that we need to do to be there for one another. And that level of maturity comes through preparation. It also comes through experience. And part of the journey of family therapy is when families don't have trust in each other. They don't have that established, I know I can count on you and rely on you, is identifying, okay, well, why not? Why not? Is it a you thing that you can't rely on me because you're not willing to extend trust? Or do I need to make some changes so that I can show up for you and you can count on me? Right. And what we see here is further down the road of, let's just pretend they did family therapy. Well, this would be the byproduct, is a family that looks like this. Next, they fight in healthy ways. I love scenes like this because conflict is inevitable. Disagreements, strong feelings are inevitable. So what does it look like to navigate that in a healthy, supportive way? And they may be right because right now we don't have a workable plan. The clock is ticking. So their plan looks good. It's mathematical, it's ethical, and it's available. What are you saying? I'm not saying anything. And he's not. No. And on some level, she knows that, but she also knows what you just said was incredibly... Yeah, mama bear came out. Callous. You're not saying we should sacrifice our child. You're saying the people who want to sacrifice our child, that makes sense. Yeah, they have a point. Yeah. Because he's Reed Richards. He can't not, and we're going to get into that. No, Ben's wrong. There's always people that can hurt you. Ooh, that was pointed. Referring to him. Yeah. I would never give him up to Galactus. I would never do that. Mathematical, ethical, available. This is so easy for you to say that. It means nothing. It means I know you. I know how your brain works. It means you've thought about it. It means you've rolled it around your head and you've worked the problem. Which means nothing. It is my job to think terrible things so the terrible things don't happen. It's not your job, Reed. That's you. Okay, but then he owns it. You're right, it is me. He owns it. And yeah, she's not wrong. No, I invite the worst possible thing into my head to figure out how to hurt them before they hurt anybody else. And you know what? Sometimes, sometimes you being you hurts me. Yeah, I'm going to break this down. But this is right here. Well, I don't mean to. Yep. Oh man. It's... This is some of the best family dynamic stuff I've seen in any movie, including like talkie dramas that are just about family dynamics. I'm going to solve this. I'm going to make it right. This is a silly movie about a guy who can stretch and a woman who can turn invisible. And is modeling so well. We don't know what he is or what he might become, but I am not giving him up. Let me talk about why. Why that's healthy conflict. Because on the surface, it feels like, oh, it's unhealthy. They're fighting. They're arguing. The energy is negative and aggressive. And so it seems unhealthy. But in a therapy office and at home, because she never calls him a jerk. Nope. She never lashes out and says, you're an insensitive creep or what is wrong with you? She's descriptive. Here's your behavior. And here's how it hurts me. Here's how it makes me feel. And she says, sometimes you being you hurts me, which sounds like an attack on you. But the subtext is sometimes you being you is the things that you do. Yeah. That's me. And it's specifically about the thing he just did, which is he did the math and the math is available, ethical. Well, and to that end, he's explaining, here's why I said it. Here's what I was thinking. But he never says you're overreacting. You're being ridiculous or acts like what he did was right because his motives were good, right? He's merely just explaining. And then when she says, well, that may be why, but it hurts me. He says, I don't mean to. Yeah. He doesn't say you shouldn't get hurt. Yeah. He doesn't, he doesn't say, well, that's ridiculous. He's just making clear. He's acknowledging. I can see that it hurts you. I want you to know that's not my intention. I also love when he starts with, this is my job. This is what my role in the group. And she says, it's not, it's you. It's how your brain operates. And he very quickly, instead of fighting that says, yeah, no, you're right. John and Julie Gottman talk about 60 some odd percent of differences or struggles in a couple of relationship are unsolvable. Right. Just because it comes down to who people are. Sure. So you just have to accept the other person where they're at. Right. Well, and it comes down to, okay, how can I be me? Maybe a more sensitive version of me, a more thoughtful version of me. I am analytical. I am never going to stop assessing situations to see how we can solve problems and keep the worst from happening. That's Reed Richards. How can I do that? While also being sensitive to the way I express myself and the way I go about that so that I don't hurt the people that I care about. And that is healthy. And that is beautiful. And she doesn't even hate him for it. Because you see how she still pivots to, I'm not giving him up. She's still opening up to her husband. Yeah. She's still expressing where she's coming from. And again, conflict is inevitable. But how you navigate it is you describe the behavior. You describe its effect on you. And you do it without pointing fingers, lashing out, name calling, or being critical. It's just saying, you did this. This is how I felt. And then accountability, acknowledgement, and here's where I'm coming from. These are all beautiful stepping stones. This, as a couples therapist, is probably my favorite scene in the movie. It's well done. Next, they care about the larger whole. And he lives. Again, from the comics, is one of Sue's superpowers is her ability to communicate with people. She's really good at it. Instead of saying, you're not going to take my baby. And that's the end. She also looks at the other side. He wanted us to be together because that's what family is. It's about fighting for something bigger than yourself. It's about connecting to something bigger than yourself. She realizes they both matter. My family, but also everybody else's family. And like, what was she going to do? It's about having something bigger than yourself. And the four of us, the four of us already do because we have you. There you go. You know, our mom always used to say, Susie, for you, I would move heaven and earth. And we would do that. It's not just her family and her kid that matter. I will not sacrifice my child for this world. But I will not sacrifice this world for my child. We will face this together. We will fight this together. And we will defeat this together. As a family. Pretty good speech. Ted Lasso's therapist approves. And then Johnny's like, as a family. As a family. He watched it like quoting his own sister, you know. I'm going to go bigger picture now. Galactus, okay, you're talking about big comic book trope. He's a giant world consuming guy. He's a giant purple guy who eats planets. Okay, but what he represents is division. He says, give up your baby and the planet can be saved. Or keep your baby and I'll destroy the planet. And so everybody's losing their minds because this big powerful guy says, these are your only options and pits them against one another. And she finds this middle road of just because he said that doesn't mean that has to be what we do. Yeah, there's a third option. Kick Galactus's ass. There's a third option, which is we can treat each other like family. We can find something where every voice matters. Every life matters. Every family matters. And then we can figure out, okay, how do we make that work in a practical way? Like I got chills in the theater as a family therapist is all about unifying people because that is the way. This is the way. Next, they are open and supportive. The worldwide energy curfew only works if everybody does their part to conserve electricity. This was honestly the one part of the movie that just kind of lost me. And I get that it's like an idealized future, but it's like curfew Friday. People wouldn't agree to this. Now I look like an idiot. Bear could be cool. Seriously? I built this to see what you look like. Man, the way Evan Moss' background plays. Now I look like an idiot. So good. Exactly like them. Inside and out. Look, I don't want you to be like me. There's something wrong with me. Always has been. Different, not wrong. The more I look at you, the less I know. That is parenting right there. Yep. So you know what? I love this though. I'm gonna let you tell me who you are. And if you'd like to tell me now, that would be helpful. Especially if you're an all-powerful space god. I'd like to know that sooner rather than later, if you don't mind. These are the kind of conversations I had with my kids all the time when they were babies. They're busy peeing. And it always ended with them peeing. The most relatable scene as a parent. So I'm cherry picking little moments that you don't catch unless you're honing in on them. When Johnny compliments Ben and says, beard could look cool. Yeah. You know, like a rock beard, you know? And Ben's like, seriously? But just how open and freely he compliments his friend. Or you know, not literal brother, but in this case, essentially brothers. Yep. That it's not hard for him at all to say something complimentary. And I don't know, so many families struggle with that. They fear it's going to be cheesy. They fear it's not going to land. Or people are going to worry about their ulterior motives. Or they just don't know how to be kind, right? It's just not what we do in our family. And here's Johnny who's, you know, this bad hero who likes the ladies. And he can light on fire and do all sorts of cool things. And he has zero problem paying a sincere compliment to another man, right? Which is really cool. And then Reed recognizing what I think any open-minded parent recognizes. Whatever you thought you knew about life and adulting and how to manage things kind of goes out the window when you become a parent. And you look at this little thing and you say, I got to start from square one. Oh, crap. I have no idea. And the fact that Reed Richards, who's the most brilliant mind on earth recognizes, I'm going to stop thinking so much. I'm going to set that aside and I'm going to let you tell me who you are. I love that line because obviously the kid can't speak right now. But that's a mission statement for him being a father. I'm not going to try and figure you out. That's what I do with all sorts of things. I'm going to let you reveal yourself to me and I'm going to support you and whoever that is. And that is awesome. Next, they've got each other's backs. Stretch Armstrong. This is such a mean thing for Galactus to do. And it's just the look on Galactus's face in this shot where he's just like, oh, fun. Is a kid playing with an insect that he's, you know? What time is it, Ben? No, Johnny. Say it! Side note, the beard does look good. It does look good. I don't know how he combed it, though. It's not that type of movie, kid. So just a brief little moment of them coming to his rescue. But, you know, real world application. You see a family member in trouble, you see him under attack. Usually more socially or verbally than being stretched to death. And you're there for him. And then they give and sacrifice for each other. But the fierceness, like the ferocity of a woman protecting her child. But also, she's going toe to toe with a giant planet-eating monster right now. So you could see the anguish on her face. You could see the determination, the rage, the fear. And then she's fading. And at the moment that she's fading... This is another example of everyone doing their part, right? Yeah. We get the team together again. I love that he collapses a building so Galactus has nothing to hold on to. I love that match cut from her feet moving forward to Galactus' feet dragging back. Such a fun little filmmaking flourish. And, you know, Michael Giacchino? Giacchino? Giacchino. Cha-ching-ching? Ching-ching, if you know what I'm saying. Because the music is also telling us she's giving her life right now. Yep. This isn't just a cool superhero moment. She's fading. Triumphant and sad at the same time is a tough thing to do musically. And that's what it sounds like. Well, and also Pedro Pascal earlier like begging her to stop because he knows, you know, he knows exactly what she's doing. Yeah. And then she says, save our son. And what's really cool is as a couple and as a family, he immediately says, you know, I love her. I don't want her to die. This is what she wants. And also, I love that kid. And he pivots immediately. Like the grief will come later. I will respect her wishes right now. Yeah. And he resigns himself to I'm going to lose her. And of course, they fight to bring her back and everything. And that scene, my mouth was on the floor just watching this whole thing play out. Sometimes family relationships require giant levels of sacrifice. In fact, I would say in almost any case of parenting, if you're doing it right, you have to sacrifice a lot time, energy, sometimes your dreams. I mean, you've talked about how you could have been much further ahead in the film industry. I would not be making this show if I hadn't had kids. I would be directing film and television. Yeah. I would be living in L.A. and that's what I would be doing. But we had kids. And so I had to make some changes. And that's what happened. You said something really beautiful to me lately. For a while, you had even while we were doing cinema therapy, you had all of this big energy of all the other things you were going to do. And you said to me, we only have our kids for a few more years. Yeah. And I know you're still pursuing other film projects and developing them, but the order of priorities and energy shifts. At such a slow pace, I might as well not be. It's what it feels like. But why? Because I want to. I only have my kids for a few more years. I only have three more years left with all three of my kids at home. Yeah. I only have that much time left. I have, theoretically, a bunch more years that I can make movies. Nobody can tell me if anybody wants to watch the movies that I'm going to make. So what's the harm in delaying a few years? I might not have an audience. But it's your dream. And there's something to be said for, well, kids should see their parents pursuing their dreams. It's all about a balance. But sacrifice. And we all sacrifice in family relationships. Sometimes we sacrifice taking whatever you're feeling, whatever point you want to make and putting it on the shelf. Which we talk about in our Kristoff episode. That's true. He's the master of it. Is a type of sacrifice. I would rather sleep right now than hear you talk about Minecraft. But I'm sitting up. And for some reason, this is emotionally important to you. Wiping my eyes. Okay. But you know what? That's how people know they're loved. Fantastic Four is, in my opinion, one of the best Marvel movies in years. Between this and Thunderbolts, I feel like Marvel's on the upswing. And I'm excited to see what they have in store. Me too. But even beyond that, I loved seeing a healthy family on screen. And that the drama came from, okay, how are we going to navigate with love and understanding these impossible odds instead of drama from, oh, they're going to hate each other until the last reel of the film. You know what it is, Jono? What? I could tell from the way you said that, that I'm, what? Fantastic. Oh my gosh. So until next time. What time is it, Alan? I don't, don't make me say it. What time is it, Alan? I don't want to say it. What? Say it! It's clobberin' time! And clobber movies. Wow. Special thank you to our patrons who are truly fantastic. Folks like... Gamer Therapist. Abibi Shelton. Natalie Lewis. Sarah Malon. Steve the Bean. The Bean. One word. But you are the Fantastic Five. We love you and thank you. Fantastic. You know, you're supposed to sleep when the baby sleeps. He thinks the baby actually sleeps.