Spirit Release Therapy with Terence Palmer

Thinking Allowed Conversations on the leading edge of knowledge and discovery with psychologist Jeffrey Mishlove Hello and welcome, I'm Jeffrey Mishlove. Our topic today is spirit release therapy. With me is Dr. Terence Palmer, who is the author of The Science of Spirit Possession. He's a member of the Society for Psychical Research in England and also the Scientific and Medical Network, and he is a fellow of the Royal Society of Medicine. Welcome again, Terry. Thank you, Jeffrey. Thank you very much. It's a pleasure to be with you and to talk about spirit release therapy or sometimes in the United States it's known as spirit releasement therapy. That's the term used by William Baldwin who wrote a book by that name. That's right. Yes, and in Brazil it's called spirit depossession. My journey of discovery began as we discussed in previous interview when I had personal encounter with a possessing spirit. Yes. And that led me down the avenue of investigating the scientific evidence for that and the discovery of Frederick Meyer's work and so on. And where it has led me today is to put in all this knowledge into practice and my work now is solely focused on helping people who are suffering from some kind of spirit intervention. So the practical application of spirit release therapy. And as you explained to me, this is something that typically practitioners don't charge for. There are some practitioners that do. Some traditional hypnotherapists and therapists that incorporate spirit release therapy into their toolkit, if you like, of approaches will charge their traditional fee for their time. But there are other healers who use spirit release therapy who find difficulty charging for what they consider to be a God-given gift. The gift of discernment in being able to see malevolent spirits and to call upon the powers of light to heal them. And in every religious tradition going right back through history, you have these religious practitioners whose role it was, whose task in life was to help heal the sick. And the reason I'm in America at the moment is because I've been invited to work with such a religious group in Michigan. A Buddhist monastery. A Buddhist monastery, yes. They have been approached by people in their local community and they work as a charitable institution in helping people who are suffering from alcohol and drug addiction and they visit the prisons in Michigan to teach the prisoners, the inmates, Buddhist meditation, those that want to learn it. And they've discovered that they are being increasingly asked by people in the local community to help them with possible spirit. Well, the nice thing about that is that these are all monks. Yes. Who are very experienced in the disciplines of Buddhist meditation. Absolutely. Yes. So they understand the principles of going into an altered state of consciousness and the discipline, and I'm not an adherent of Buddhist teachings. Which makes it even more wonderful that they're calling on you for aid in this work. Well, they started investigating this. The head monk at the monastery, Sokuzan, very, very wise and accomplished teacher, began to investigate solutions for the problems that he was being presented with and his monks. And he discovered the work of William Baldwin and Edith Fiore and Shakuntala Modi, all psychiatrists in the United States, and he's familiar with all their works. And he contacted me last year, just before Christmas, because he wanted advice on where he could go to take himself and his monks for formal training in learning the techniques of these practitioners. What we should say here is is that there, besides there being a history of spirit release therapy going back to biblical times, and earlier in virtually every culture, that in the last 20 or 30 years or so here in the United States, there's a community of therapists. And in England, where you received your training, there's strong interest. But to my knowledge, it's interest that's sort of on the margins of the psychotherapeutic community. There isn't a journal. There isn't a scientific society for spirit release therapy. An attempt was made to establish such an institution by an English psychiatrist, Dr. Alan Sanderson. Back in the year 2000, he put together, he established the Spirit Release Foundation, and it was supported by members of the Royal College of Psychiatry. But unfortunately, mainstream institutionalized medicine, there was this resistance, and he couldn't get funding, and it was difficult to build the institution without the right kind of support. So the members, they still have no recognition or accreditation for their training from high professional institutions. And I'm sure many conventionally minded people are quick to assume that anybody dabbling in spirit release therapy must be incredibly gullible and credulous. It's a very, very difficult road to tread. I've discovered people, doctors and psychiatrists, who do acknowledge the validity of it. Indeed. And they do incorporate it into their practice very quietly. And they will perhaps refer their patients to a declared spirit release practitioner, who are usually retired psychiatrists, so they can't lose their job. It is very, very tricky. It is certainly fair to say that we could go back to one of the founders of modern medicine, Paracelsus, who was a practitioner of this type. You have me at a disadvantage there, Jeffrey. I'm not familiar with that particular practitioner. Anyhow, let's move on. Viewers can check that out for themselves, if they wish. So, where would you like me to go with this? Well, let's talk about the work that you're doing with this monastery, as an example. Okay. We've talked about spirit guides and various spirit entities. Now, I don't hear... Careful with your microphone. I don't hear or see spirit myself. So, in order for me to communicate with such beings, I have to work with a medium. Yes. And what I'm able to do is establish a working group called a soul rescue group or a spirit release group. Yes. It usually comprises of seven people. It's a magical number in these groups. When I ask for volunteers to bring a chair and sit as a group, it's always seven people. They form a circle. They form a circle. So, what happens is that a person will present themselves with a problem. It could be in a house. Yes. Let's use the term haunted, haunted house. Okay. Dark presence, or it could be a person who's suffering from some kind of emotional, physical malady, and they come for help. And I will invite the monks to form a spirit release soul rescue circle. Yes. And the principal medium, the strongest medium within the group, will be asked to investigate using his or her psychic abilities. Now, you're defining medium, I think, in a particular way here. This, yes, this is in the same sense that the word is used by spiritualists, a spiritualist medium. A medium is that person who is between the source of communication and the receiver. So, they are in touch with spirit guides? Yes. And the way it works is that everyone in the circle will use their psychic protection protocol. And then the whole group will be surrounded with a bubble of protective light, and the whole building, the whole monastery is protected from those forces that do exist, that will try to intervene. And when it's safe, and we're all protected, then I will ask for the higher self of each individual in the group, and for the higher self of the complainant, the person who's brought the problem, if we have permission to proceed. And this is particularly important. If you have a case where a person is so ill, so mentally incapable of giving informed consent, in the legal sense, or if it's a child, or if the person is so badly affected that whatever is possessing them will prevent them from giving consent. It's important that we ask for consent from the highest level of spirit of that person. Do we have permission from the higher self to proceed? Now, you're working at a distance, I presume. Yes. The person, or the situation, a poltergeist case, or a haunting, or a person who is suffering. It could be anywhere. Anywhere in the world? Anywhere in the world. Okay. We've worked on cases in Australia, and Russia, and Iran. From my work in UK, that is. Yes. But since I've been here in Michigan, working at the monastery, they've been local cases. Mm-hmm. Still, they're not at the monastery. No, they're not at the monastery. They might be a few miles distant. That's right. That's right. That's right. So, they contacted the monastery for help. They contacted the monastery for help. In fact, we had one case where the person was actually sitting in the monastery, watching the work of the group as we conducted it. So, we cannot proceed without permission from the higher self, and then we ask for all our individual guides to attend, and these guides are the spiritual guides, archangels, spirit entities that assist us in our work. We ask them to come and be present. And I gather that you know, each person knows through practice and experience that these are legitimate, positive spiritual entities. Yes. And as these groups are formed, when they begin, part of the process is, that's necessary, is to become familiar with the feeling, the energy, and the connection with the guides that are going to help us in the work. Because there are those forces that would prevent that. Mm-hmm. There are those energies, spiritual energies, call them dark force entities, that would, very, very clever, highly intelligent, that would deceive us, mm-hmm, and convince us that they are the guide and the helper, when in fact, they will cause harm. Mm-hmm. So you need to be able, this is where the word discernment is important. Absolutely. It's one thing to be able to discern the difference between different kinds of spirit that are affecting the person, but it's even more important to be able to discern who your guide is, and who the imposter is. And I took a group of people only a couple of days ago, through this process, and we discovered imposters. Mm-hmm. Through, through the process that we use. So you have a methodology that enables you to do that. Yes, and it's a method that's highly effective. It's challenging. Would you like me to explain what the method is? Well, all right. There are, there are various, three different ways of doing this. Yeah. It's a bit like when you receive a telephone call from someone. Mm-hmm. And you want to know who it is. You ask them their name. Yeah. And they will tell you their name. And then you ask what, what it is they want. Mm-hmm. Now if it's your best friend telephoning you, you don't have to ask who it is. Mm-hmm. You know by the sound of their voice. Yes. And by the attitude that they have. Mm-hmm. So you, you're very, very familiar with your best friend. Mm-hmm. So when a spirit release practitioner steps onto the path, as we say, to learn these techniques, they have to build a rapport, a friendship, this relationship with their best friend. Mm-hmm. With their, with their helper. But in the beginning, this is tricky. So we have to use a challenging protocol. Mm-hmm. And we say to the presenting entity that's saying, it's your guide, tell me your name. And if they can't give a name, and the names are usually unpronounceable, because these are generally entities that are not of this earth. Okay. I had a doctor friend of mine, a medical doctor friend of mine, wanted to know who his guide was. Mm-hmm. So we invited a guide that was known to us by the name of Chen, and we said, and this doctor friend of mine said, can you tell me the name of my guide? And Chen said, I could, but you wouldn't be able to repeat it, because it's unpronounceable, because this guide is not of this planet. Okay. So let's call him Henry. In other words, the guides may not be human. Yes, absolutely. They may not be human, and very often they're not. Mm-hmm. They are from, they could be described as beings of light. Mm-hmm. From another dimension in their universe, or they could be from another galaxy, far, far away, as they say in Star Wars. The possibilities are endless, but the important thing is that we get to know them. At some point you're going to want to, being a scientist as I know you are, you're going to want to have some sort of empirical evidence. Yes. Somewhere down the line. That's right. And I'm sure one of your goals would be to begin to develop an archive of case histories. So that you're not relying on what somebody might say could be just pure imagination. It's a very, very simple test for this, Jeffrey. You have a person present themselves to, let me use the example of a person who hears voices. Yeah. And you have the evidence that they hear voices. You interview them. What do the voices say? Right. How do they affect you? So and so and so. And they're being hounded, let's say. They're being hounded, right. Or being given instructions to kill somebody. Yes. Had a case that we're actually working on at the moment. Such a case. Person who's being given instructions to cause harm. Yes. So that's the baseline data, if you like. Right. So you want to be able to alleviate that condition. Exactly. So then we introduce the intervention. Mm-hmm. And then when the intervention is completed, you go back to the subject and say, are you still hearing voices? Yeah. Are you feeling better? Mm-hmm. Did the intervention make a difference? Yeah. And this goes back to William James pragmatism. Mm-hmm. Simple. Did it work? Right. Did it make a difference? Yeah. That's scientific. It's very important, I think, to document this work. Absolutely. Mm-hmm. Yes. So the objective is to be able to plant seeds around... We've planted three seeds in the state of Michigan. Mm-hmm. Where people have come together to form spirit release and soil rescue groups so that they can provide a service within their community. Mm-hmm. And the guides now, we were describing the process of testing to make sure that these guides are not impostors. Yes. The test is very simple. You ask them their name. Mm-hmm. And if they can't give you a name, and you press them, you press them three times, what's your name? Mm-hmm. What's your name? What's your name? And if they can't give you a name, they will withdraw and just disappear. Mm-hmm. And I use a protocol where I invite the initiate, the naive practitioner, to imagine that they are being led to their guide. And the guide is standing in the mouth of a cave, and I ask them how they feel as they get closer to the guide. They may feel wonderful. They may feel welcomed. They may even see an image of Christ or the Madonna. Mm-hmm. But is it really the Christ or the Madonna or the Buddha or whoever they think it is? So as they get close, say, tell me your name. And if they can't get a name, they will withdraw. Okay. And if they withdraw, they'll know that that was an impostor. Mm-hmm. Another question they can ask is to say, are you from the light? Mm-hmm. Another question they can ask is, are you here for the greater good of mankind? Mm-hmm. And if they don't get a definite answer, they will just disappear back into the darkness. So those three questions, those three challenges, what's your name? Are you from the light? Mm-hmm. Are you here for the greater good of mankind? Mm-hmm. And that will establish with positive answers. And the positive feeling of love that goes with that will establish the relationship. And that can be tested each time you ask for the guide to come. Each time? Yes. And it comes with practice. Yeah. And at some point now, I gather that what you're going to do is have the guides explain what sort of treatment is required in any particular case of possession. We simply ask the question. The scanning medium will encounter, I simply ask, scan the subject, whether it be a house or a person, and tell me when you find something that doesn't belong. And when I get an indication there's something there that needs to be attended to, then I need to know what kind of entity this is. In other words, you're relying on the medium to exhibit a pretty high degree of clairvoyance. Absolutely. Very much so, yeah. So when something is detected and we can have a person, let's say for example, it's a house. You can have the person sitting there with the floor plan of the house with marks on the floor plan where it is believed there is an infection, a negative energy. And without seeing the floor plan, the psychic, the medium, will investigate, will go into the house, and I ask, let me know when you find something that doesn't belong. And the correlation between what he finds and what is on the floor plan tells us how accurate he is. The floor plan that was given to you by the complainant. Yes. And again, this is a form of scientific evidence. How could the medium possibly know that? So it's evidence that what he sees is actually there. And then we have to determine its nature. It could be a portal where aliens have come through. It could be an earthbound spirit that's trapped, that's died, and is lost. Or it could be a dark force entity that's been deliberately sent to cause mayhem and destruction. So the medium will be able to tell me what kind of entity that is from what he sees and what he feels. But if there's any question, then we can call upon the guides. Let me give you an example. We had one case only two days ago where a lady who had come to learn the protocol for self-defense, and she found that there was something preventing her from completing the process. So we asked her permission, would you like us to investigate the blockage? And she said, yes. I said, okay, guys, you know, get your chairs, let's have some volunteers, let's check this out. And we went through the protocol that I've described to you, and the medium detected the spirit of someone who died. So then I had to engage that spirit in conversation to ask who it was and how they came to be there. And it turned out to be the spirit of an alien who died. He'd been sent, he and his crew, his spaceship crew, I know this sounds like science fiction, and people are going to say this is nonsense. For sure. You've lost your marbles, according to some people. We can count on 25% of the population thinking you're a total nutcase. Well, I'm a scientist. Yeah. And my colleagues back home and people I've met here are also scientists. And let me assure my viewers that I have the highest respect for what you're doing. So let me continue with this particular case, it was discovered that the spirit that was lodged with this woman was a member of a crew. They'd been sent here to investigate the possibility of this planet being habitable. And they had run into difficulties, the ship had run out of oxygen, and they'd all perished. And they were stranded here. So we had to ask which planet they came from. And if someone could come from their homeworld, to show them the way home. And it was really amusing. I recorded this. And it was an amusing thing to watch where the trapped alien spirit said, that would be okay if someone could come from our homeworld. And someone came and presented himself. And I said, do you recognize him? And he said, oh, yes, that's one of our priests. So I said, you have religious beliefs? He said, oh, yes. Just like you. So the priest came to show the entire crew how to go back home. And the portal that was open, that enabled this woman to pick this up, was closed and she was free of distress. Well, that's the key. Ultimately, the empirical evidence will be in... Are you feeling better? And checking again in six months and so on to make sure that the cure lasted. And this is why the final chapter of my book is a scientific protocol to test whether people who have auditory hallucinations, according to psychiatric definition, are in fact hearing real voices. And there's a scientific protocol to test that using this method. Well, Dr. Terence Palmer, we've just had a tiny little exposure to what is a huge tradition, thousands of years old, truly, that you are doing your best to validate and to awaken on this modern society and this planet. Thank you so much for being with me. And thank you for inviting me, Jeffrey. Thank you. And thank you for being with us.