Moments That Make Us: Serena Williams on Tennis, Family, and Impact Investing

So many players told me that they didn't think they could get pregnant and play until they saw me do it. So that felt good to just continue to inspire people like you can be mom and you can be an athlete. Last year, I started a conversation about life's turning points. This season, we're talking about what comes next, the next day and beyond. I'm Melinda French-Gates. These are The Moments That Make Us. Serena, I'm so glad we could do this today. I'm excited for this conversation. Me too. When I first met you, it was at a dinner. Everybody else had already gone into this event. It was a group of women. And people were kind of dressing up in just these light costumes and singing. It was really joyful. But anyway, I show up for a different reason, late. We both come in late. And you and I are looking at the costumes. And I'm looking at these costumes and I'm thinking to myself, there is no way one of these is going to fit in my hips. And I said it out loud. You said, you think one of them is going to fit me? And I just thought, oh my God, here's somebody who's so real in our bodies, right? To celebrate who we are. And I said that to you that night. I said, my gosh, you know, I didn't follow tennis that much. But the one time I saw you play, I happened to sit behind you. And I thought, there is a woman who is so strong in her body. Like, why are we not all celebrating our bodies? And it gave me the confidence to do that. Super well. Thanks for saying that. And I told you, I looked at you, I said, oh, you got body. You made me feel much better about it. Nice body. I was like, oh, not feeling so good here. I was staring at your body the whole few days. And finally, I got enough nerve. I couldn't hold it in anymore. I'm like, sis, where do you get that from? I loved it. So I've written a book called The Next Day. My opening chapter is about my father and how he saw in me potential that I didn't see at the time. My mother was also an enormous support. So I want to talk about dads and moms in our life, because I think we have this in common. You had a very supportive father and mother. Can you start with talking a bit about your dad? Like, did he see the potential in you as an athlete that you didn't yet see yourself? Or how did that play out for you? I feel like he saw something that none of us saw that the world didn't see, right? He had this more of a, I would like to say, a prediction. And he worked hard to get us to fulfill that prediction. And so he said he wanted to have two girls be number one. And he's like, they're going to be number one and number two one day. And that had never happened before with siblings, period, and definitely not Black kids from Compton, California. I don't know what he saw in me, because I definitely wasn't the best player growing up. But I definitely had a real champions mentality. I hated to lose. Like, I was just this person that was very always intense from as long as I remember. Even before I played tennis, I was just always just, like, super intense kind of person and perfectionist. And I think that maybe, I don't know, maybe he saw something in me. We all have kids, and we can kind of see what we see in our children now. And so I think maybe he did see something. Did he articulate to you all as children inside the home, oh, I want you to be number one and number two, or you can be number one and number two? You know, I think it starts so much with positivity and a lot of visualization. He always told us we were going to be the best. And I think when you're told that and you train every day and everything, you believe that. And so we always believed it. And it's really the power of words, right? I really think there's really something deep in the power of words and putting those words into your children or someone or your friends or whoever that is that you do want to inspire, could be someone that you're mentoring. It's really just putting those positive words and thoughts into a person. And I think that's what happened to us because if you're being told every day, you suck, you suck, you suck, guess what? You're going to not feel good about yourself. But if you're being told every day, you're going to be great. You are great. You're going to be number one. You're going to be the best. Like some part of you is going to believe that. And then that positivity kind of works itself into your life. And would you keep that in the back of your head? Like when you went on the court to play? It's hard to describe. It's like, I didn't keep it. I just knew it. I'm not sure if I knew it because I was always told, myself and my sister, that we were always told that. We just knew that we were better. And we were better, by the way. But we also knew just going out there that we were just better because that's what we had trained to do and to be. And that's what we were told. And you had the discipline and the hard work to put in. It's interesting. My father, I write in the book, went to a course unexpectedly from his business, sent him. And it was about setting goals. And he came back so fired up. He said, my sister and I had to go. We had no choice. I love that. My sister was not quite two years older than me. And we set goals and dreams. And then it was about achieving those. Did you write the goals down? We wrote them down. Did you do that? Absolutely. You did? Because my father always said that your eye, it's like the optical connects with your hand. And then it connects to the paper. And it's different than just saying it to yourself. But when you actually write it. And nowadays, there's computers. But it's better when you write it with your hand. That's what he always said. He's like, you need to connect your brain to your hand. And to the words. And so, yeah. I was told in this course, and even by my parents, be careful who you share your goals with. Because not everybody is going to believe in you. You need to surround yourself with people who do believe in you. Were you the same way? Or did you share your dreams with more people when you were up and coming? So I was never told to be careful. I think that's amazing advice. But I did one year. I remember playing. And I was like, oh, I want to do this and that. And when it didn't happen, it was so much negativity around it that I learned to never share my goals. And so every time, people would say, what's your goals? And I'm like, well, I don't share them. That way, if you reach them, then great. And if you don't reach them, then at least you know that you didn't reach them. And you know that you have things to work harder on. Yeah. I know. I often think we sometimes don't talk to kids enough these days in school about setting goals and dreams. I think setting goals is so important, right? And I agree with you. It's just different. I think it's so important to talk about setting goals. How are you going to do anything if you're just saying something? You have to set goals. And then I always say set small goals to get to the big goal. Don't just have one goal. Don't go for the sky. I mean, go for the sky. Things along the way. Exactly. Have check-ins along the way. So you can see your progress. Exactly. OK, let's talk about the role of moms. Yeah. Because your mom has been very present in your life, is my understanding. Talk about her role. Well, my mom has been so present. We always have been traveling with us when we went on tour. And it was great. It is so great to have her. And still, she's so present in my life with my two little girls. I always describe the dynamic of the family as my dad being like the body and then my mom being like the spine. Oh, say more about that. Yeah, because it's like she is the spine of a body. It's every function that you need. It's where the nervous system is. It's where you obviously need the body as well, right? But it's such an important part of your body is your spine. I mean, hello. It's like you can't function without it. That's kind of how I describe my mom. She really supported the family when my dad had this wild dream. I mean, if my husband did that, I would be like, oh my god, this is nuts. Like, oh no. But she hunkered down and she supported the family. But she would wake up at five and take us to school. And she taught us culture with music and all kinds of stuff. And she taught us being our religion and being very spiritual and putting God first, most of all. And that's the most important thing that she's been able to teach us and share with us. And it was just so much that she has done for me. And she still shows up. It's been such an honor and a pleasure to have that opportunity. Because not everyone has that, right? Totally. To have that opportunity to have them in my life and to have my mom in my life. Absolutely. And the fact she's now also in your two girls' lives. Yes. And she's obsessed with them. Good. Yeah. She's like so obsessed with the girls. And that love just makes me feel like it's almost overwhelming to see how much love she has for my daughters. She spoils them. Of course. Makes me upset. That's the grandmother's job. Apparently. You said impregnate? Yes. Oh my goodness. Being a grandmother now myself. Do you spoil your grandkids? Of course I do. Oh man. I was just recently in Louisiana with my daughter, Jen, who has her medical degree and she's in her first year of residency. And we went to Louisiana to learn about maternal mortality. And so as we're talking to all kinds of people, pediatricians, OBs, but then this group of moms who were advocates who've been through the health system and had bad experiences, one of them quoted you. And she talked about your experience. And she said it was so powerful because she said, finally, someone was talking about the experience I also had. Can you talk both for those who don't know about your experience in the health system as a new mom with Olympia? And then what gave you the inspiration that you then wanted to write about it? There's definitely something wrong there. Yes. And let's be clear and honest. It is more black and brown people in this country that really face that maternal mortality crisis, right? I think the mortality crisis is absolutely more black people, more brown people. I've heard so many experiences from people that just barely made it. One woman didn't have the plug in for her epidural because the plug wasn't in right. And I'm like, and these are black people or brown people. And it's just unfortunate. But there is a lot of other people as well that are dealing with some issues, too. For me, when I did share my story, I know with Olympia, I had a baby and I was fine. And I just started coughing really bad because I've had blood clots in the past. And I couldn't breathe. And I coughed so hard that I ripped my stitches. And you know how hard you have to cough to do that for a C-section? It was nuts. I kept telling the nurse that I needed some, I needed, she may have thought, rightfully so, she may have thought that I was nuts because I'm like, okay, I need you to sign me up, get me in a CAT scan. And I need the dye. And I need you to look at my lungs bilaterally and like talking like that. And then she just was like, totally dismissed me or whatever. And eventually time, time goes by. And then finally, my doctor comes in and I told her that, you know, I can't breathe. And I, you know, I'm struggling to breathe. And then she was like, well, this is crazy, but I'm listening to her. And I'm going to definitely do what she said. And that is the reason why I was able to get help because I had such a wonderful doctor. And it was good that my doctor came in and was there. It was crazy because I was right. Ended up having blood clots. And then we had to just, had a lot of surgeries. I don't even remember. I was so out of it. Did you always know you wanted, you wanted to be a mother? Yeah. Ever since I can remember, I always wanted to be a mom. And I was that girl that like had the dolls and like had the family with the dolls. And, you know, that was just, that was all me. And that was, I always wanted to be a mom. And so that's why eventually I had to stop playing tennis. Wasn't because of any injury or anything. I just wanted to pursue a different career of being a mom. Okay. So talk about that transition. Yeah. Because that is a big transition. I mean, for any woman, I think to go from a career to being a mom is a very large transition if they choose to have children. But for you, you were the number one in tennis. And you said, I'm going to set that aside so I can have children. Talk about that transition for you personally. How did you make the decision? How did it feel after you knew you were pregnant? Well, I didn't make the decision. I was in the Australian Open and I'm like, my boobs are getting big. I'm like, that happens. And someone's like, take a pregnancy test. And I'm like, I'm pregnant. I'm like, okay, well, the decision has been made, you know? So that was kind of almost easier because I think if I had to actually choose, then it would have been a very difficult decision for me. So it was kind of made for me. But it was great. I had an opportunity to have a kid and to keep playing. And I think that transition was made a little bit easier because I traveled with my child, with Olympia. And we just did so much together. And I remember holding her, putting her to bed, playing in the next morning, and competition, and just going through so much with her. And I really wanted her. I wish she was a little bit older. But I really wanted her to have these memories of seeing her mother. She doesn't remember much. I don't think she remembers a single match. But, you know, I remember. And that's what matters. It does. Yeah. I'll just say, when I was seven or eight months pregnant, I was enormous. Enormous. And I just felt like, am I ever going to, like, I used to jog, get back to jogging. Did you have a sense, I will always go back to tennis? Or did you worry that, hey, my body might not let me do that later? Yeah, I had no doubts. I knew that I wasn't done with tennis. And this is after my first. I knew that I was going to go back. And I didn't know the welcome that I received, not from the players. Obviously, that was a nice welcome, too, but from just moms in general. And so many players told me that they didn't think they could get pregnant and play until they saw me do it. And there had been other people that did it. But for whatever reason, when I was able to do it, they all felt empowered. And I was like, wow, I didn't expect that story to come from that. So that felt good. It felt really good to just continue to inspire people. Like, you can be mom and you can be an athlete. For tennis players, it's different because we play 11 months out of the year and we train one month, 12 months out of the year. It's completely different dynamics. And so it hadn't been a ton of women being able to do that. Now, a lot of people are choosing to have a child and to be on tour. I think it's fantastic because I think women in society are so often told you can be this thing or that thing or here's your limit. And yet women can be anything. They can be a mom. They can have a career. They can have a career and be a mom. They can choose not to have children. And I think the more we have people who are out, you know, like you're doing role modeling, hey, you can do both things well. Talk about did you have doubts, though? I had doubts as a mom. When I was both working at the foundation and a mom, I went through many years when the kids were young. And I write about this. I had this image of a perfect mom, which there's no such thing. I think everyone has that image because society puts it out there. Exactly. Of like, this is what you're supposed to do as a mom. And there really are no rules. It's how you raise your child. And it's like the rule is how you do it in your house. Like, there's no right. There's no wrong. Feel out what works for you and what works for your child. Because by the way, every person is different. I love to talk to my kids. I love to tell them how I'm doing. I want to be very open in an open book because I want them to talk to me. Definitely. And so that's kind of how I try. And if you start that young, at least my experience is, it carries through the teen years when it's also very important. There's a psychologist, Donald Winnicott, who's written about being a good enough parent. And that wasn't a concept I knew about before. And when I read what a good enough parent was, I was like, I definitely can check that box for myself. And it helped me let go of the doubt, right? And that if a child has one parent who is good enough, they're going to be OK. As long as they're loved, right? But good enough. And there is no such thing as a perfect parent, right? There isn't. No matter what they say out there, there isn't. I feel like it's like one of the greatest honors. I also knew I really wanted to work and I wanted to be a mom. It's just one of the greatest honors to be able to be a mom, right? Because not everybody can or wants to. So Serena, talk a little bit about, if you're willing to, God or spirituality in your life. You said it plays a huge role that your mom taught you about that. How does it play a role? Where does it show up for you? It shows up for me in every day, my everyday life. And also just in how I treat others and how I want to be and my humility. I also know that there's greater purpose and greater reason that I believe that happens. And so for me, I feel like knowing that there's something always greater. First of all, it keeps you humble. You look out, you look at the stars and there's definitely a creator for that. And I love learning about that creator. And why are we here? And explaining that to my kids as well. It, for me, is the foundation for my life. And it is the reason why I also think I was able to have such a good career. Because I always understood there was more to life than tennis. I grew up Catholic. But over time, I'm still Catholic. But over time, I had to maybe let go of some of the rituals and let go of some of the rules of the religion to really just find, for me, what is spirituality? Like, where do I find it in the world? Where does it show up? And I definitely believe in the power of prayer and sometimes meditation. I know, as you said, looking up at the stars, being out in nature, you see something vast that's so much more than you are, right? So much more. And the way we're designed, the way our cells and our body works, and the way we can naturally heal, it's just fascinating. The way we use our brains to create is fascinating. Okay, now in a completely different vein, one of the early conversations I had with you by video was about Serena Ventures. Yes, yeah. Talk about that fund. You and I both believe in investing in other people, and particularly people that have a hard time getting investments. How did you start that? What have you learned from doing that? What have you learned about yourself in doing that kind of investing? So I started investing... I was just talking about this the other day. It's been over 15 years now I did my first investment, and it wasn't a good one, but it was one that was done. But I've always been just curious, you know? And I've always wanted to kind of just understand, oh my God, what is that? You know, I never heard of that or Yahoo or, you know, AOL. And then there was Facebook, and then there's Uber, and there's Airbnb. There's like all these huge companies. I'm like, how in the world do I invest in these companies? That seems like something I should do. And so I was just naturally curious about it. And then I became an angel investor. So I would just randomly invest in companies. And I went to SF, had a lot of opportunities, and just sat with companies and just wanted to learn the lay of the land and to learn how I can do more. I never wanted to do a fund. I just liked angel investing. And then, you know, coming out of that as well. And then one day I was at a conference and they were talking about how less than 2% of all VC money went to women at the time. That was shocking because I'm thinking 98% of all money is going away, wait, that doesn't make sense. And I knew from there that I wanted to do something bigger. You know, I was already investing. I'd already had several unicorns under my belt, but I wanted to do something more and more impactful and use my platform to be more impactful to women, to people of color, because women were getting less than 2%, people of color were getting even less than that. So I'm not getting any money to start a business. And that's so many people have wonderful ideas, but they don't get an opportunity to get them started. And so that's kind of how Serena Ventures happened. From there, it took four years to just really build out a team, to build out my investment strategy, to build out in more investments and to work up and to make sure we had a better portfolio to present. Because I wanted to win and I still want to win. And I didn't want to do anything and just show up one day and be like, oh, here we are. You know, I wanted to actually have background and back work and stuff like that. But the main part of that is, I feel like the only way that I thought we can change that story was to have women writing checks. I love that you say you started with curiosity and you started as an angel investor, but then you kept just learning and learning and women being able to see other women moving money, writing the check and funding things they believe in that- It's also inspiring. Totally. And they don't see society going for it. And yet there are these great ideas that, just because the system happens to fund 98% of white guys' businesses, doesn't mean there aren't other great ideas. Like, I'd love to see that be 50-50 one day, right? Right. Women have great ideas. People of color have great ideas. They have their different lens on society. Yeah. And so that's how we look at it. We like, we invest in good ideas. We don't invest in what a person looks like. Yeah. And so I really like, we don't only invest in women either. We just invest in good ideas, great founders. And I think having your own investment philosophy about how you do it and then showing that, hey, I can win doing it this way. Again, I think then other people say, oh, I can do that too. I want to do that too. And that's what I said in the beginning. It's just about, I'm not going to be able to change that number, but I think my platform can help change. And just talking about it, like sitting here, talking about it with you and other people, it just makes other people think and say, oh, you know what? That does make sense. I'm going to invest in good founders. And so I'm going to be more consciously making sure that I invest in a good idea. And if it comes from a woman, I'm not going to snark at it. So I think that has been, I think my platform has been helpful. You've also, you're role modeling facets of women's life. Like you're an athlete and you're a mother and you're an investor and you're a writer who uses her voice to say, in this piece, maternal mortality should be changed in our country. How do you choose what to use your voice, your time, your resources? I mean, because you have clearly must have a lot coming at you. How do you make those decisions? So kind of like the baby decision. They just happen. I didn't mean to talk about my experience. I just was writing about my experience. I didn't know that it would lead to so much more. I think I'm very authentically me, as you know. And I think when you are authentically you, things just happen and they come your way. Like I had no reason to lean into the birth and mortality. I just thought it was a story that people needed to hear. And then, you know, even with VC, like I was just, I was happy angel investing. I didn't want to do anything. And the last thing I want to do is start a company. Literally the last thing I want to do. Things just happen to just fall like that. I don't necessarily go out and see, you know, what's popular and let me do that. I just like to go with the flow. I don't want to overthink it. And I think the more natural you are and the more it's just real, for lack of a better word right now, the more real it is. I think it's just more relatable. And people just right now are at a time we need to just be able to relate and just to be able to, you know, take a deep breath and say, oh, she's just like us. And that's all it is. That's all. That's all I've ever been. How did you learn, though, somewhere along the way? You were this very goal oriented. I'm going to be a champion. But then somewhere along the way, you now it sounds like go a little more with the flow. How did you how did you transition into that? Where did you learn that? I think I put so much pressure on myself and my tennis life and in my athletic career that I think I naturally didn't want to do that in anything else. I mean, I can't say I put so much pressure on myself and venture like I'm super intense in that. But I couldn't do that same stringent attitude with everything. And I also feel like my career could have been better had I been able to relax a little bit. So for me, life is about learning. And what did you learn? What did you learn from the past and what could you have done better? And can you can you apply that right now? Can you apply that in the future? I think of sometimes being on a continuous learning journey. It is right. You're learning. There's so much knowledge in the world. We couldn't. I mean, we're never going to take it up in the time that we're here. That's true for me. I've had to learn to be joyful in my learning. Again, not even put pressure on myself. I used to feel like I have to learn this. I have to learn that. And just to even ease into the joy of kind of learning and say, oh, where do I go? Who who might show up and teach me something? Right. Yeah. And for me, I just have to be kind to myself with something and take time for myself. Yeah. Thank you for being real. Thank you for being you because you are a role model to so, so many people. So thank you for being you and being there for the rest of the world, being you. I so appreciate it. Thanks for saying that. Yeah.