Beauty CEO Chats Marlena Stell in the HOT SEAT

Hey friends, in today's video I have a super special guest. Marlena! I'm so happy to be here you guys. We've been trying to film together for a while. We've known each other for a long time. We'll tell that story in a second. You guys have to stay tuned for that but. So in this video you're gonna see me put Marlena in the hot seat. My butt is on fire you guys. I'm asking her all the questions about starting YouTube, starting a brand, kind of getting her to dish on all the things that no one talks about. And just have some fun kind of chitchatty conversation while we get ready. Yes. And then on my channel we do a get ready together. We talk about like all the details of behind the scenes of the beauty industry. Like what it really takes to bring a beauty brand to the table. So check that out on my channel where I put Lisa in the hot seat. I'll link that one down below. All right, let's get started. You ready? Yep. Let's do it. So I prepped my skin. I used a little bit of the Vitamin Enriched Face Base. I love that. It's so good. It's really good. That's a good face. I love the smell too. Have you tried their new serum that they have? No. They have a Vitamin Enriched Serum. It just launched last year. It's really nice. I have it at home. I love her cleansing oil. The cleansing oil is my favorite to get my makeup off. I'm gonna brighten my eyes with this. My Beauty Bio, the Eyeliner Concentrate. I don't know if you've tried that. Tell me what that is. So it's this eye cream, but it actually brightens the eyes because my dark circles are barking today, you guys. So I'm like woof woof. So what are you going to? It's an eye cream that brightens and I just massage it in and it helps with my circulation. I need that. Actually, I should show you guys one eye to the other. Like I haven't massaged this in or did it, but look how much brighter this eye is to this one. Yeah, and it preps for a concealer. Yeah. Yeah, it just helps my concealer go on smoother. Colleen Rothschild has a brightening eye cream, but it's much more colored. Like it has a peach tint to it. Oh, it does? That's pretty transparent. Yeah, so that's a good option too. Yeah. I should try that one. I actually would like a colored. It's really nice. It's very illuminating. It's actually beautiful. On some days, I don't even wear concealer. I can just do that. Yeah. Launched it maybe a year or so ago and they can never keep it in stock. It's always sold out. Really? Yeah. Wow, that sounds amazing. Okay, so I'm going in with the Dior Forever Matte Foundation, one of my favorites. Such a good foundation. It is good. I love that one. It's long-wearing. It gives a nice matte, velvety finish. It stays in place all day. I love it. It's so fun filming with Lisa, you guys, because we had met several years ago, but now we finally live in the same state together and she has her business and I had mine, so we have a lot of similarities, so it's so cool to actually hang out with another content creator and brand owner because there's not many of us. No, yeah, it is fun. So we had dinner last night and I had told Marlena, I met you in 2019 at a makeup trade show, which you remember that. I do. I met her in 2009, you guys, which I'm sure you don't remember. I don't remember that. Yeah, that was so forever ago, right? But I knew who you were because you were just starting on YouTube and I was watching your tutorials and we snapped a picture back then in 2009. You guys were gonna die. This picture, oh my gosh. She showed me last night. The picture, I was like, oh wow, that was a moment. My fashion, eyebrows, everything. Like, you look super cute. I looked at mine and was like, I dressed like that. I did, yeah. Oh my gosh. It takes you back to a moment in time, though. I was just talking to our team in Slack last night and I posted that picture and I was like, you know, it's amazing the turns that life takes you on. You know, like when I met you in 2009 and we took that picture, like who would have ever thought that we would end up here together, filming content together, both having brands. Like, it's just, it's really cool. It's such a cool experience. And by the way, you guys, Lisa in person is the same as she is on camera. And I appreciate that so much. I have to shout that out because that's not always the case. But with Lisa, it is. Because you never know when you follow someone on, you know, because I obviously have followed her on social media and I love her content. I love her brand. But I never know, you know, when you meet someone in person, but they're the same on camera or not, but she is. And I really, I really respect that. Thank you. Yeah, I know what you mean. I've been disappointed before. I meet people that are like, I really, really love. And then I meet a person, they're not the same. And you're like, oh, not the same. Back up. I always say, well, maybe they're having a bad day. You know, maybe they're having a bad day. And I do think there is something to be said about being someone that, and this is not my case at all, but like someone that's super recognizable. Yeah. You know, having people come up to you all the time, like I can kind of understand how that could be difficult to manage. So last night we had dinner and I got to like pick Marlena's brain and ask her all the questions. And now I get to share that conversation with you guys. I know. I have always admired Marlena, not only because she has been like, I mean, she was really the first to do any of this, to be on YouTube, to start a brand. And I feel like you really paved the way for so many people, myself included. And I just want to know like a kind of a little bit about like the early days for you, you know? And like what inspired you to get onto YouTube and what did it look like back then? You know? Oh, it was so different. When I look back at how much has changed in the last, I mean, I've been on it for gosh, almost 16 years. That makes me feel really old, you guys. I'm like- I can't believe that. 16 years. That's wild. I always tell my subscribers, I'm like, well, we're pretty much married at this point. I mean, you've been with me for 16 years. So we're in this for the long haul. But it was so different because back then, I mean, you know, like it was, you know, super inexpensive lighting. We didn't have all the fancy equipment. You literally was just sitting and I was sitting in my second bedroom with these, you know, Damask curtains behind me and stuff like that. And I had started a YouTube channel honestly as a hobby because I was a music teacher at the time. You know, my background was all in teaching and I would post, I don't know if you remember that forum Spectra. I don't. There was this forum back when forums were really popular and people would post their makeup looks. You could only do pictures because this is like, you know, a long time ago. And people would always ask me, oh, how did you do your makeup look? And I would try to type it out in the forum and it's hard to explain it on when you're typing it. So I was like, let me turn on a camera and just film it. It'll be so much easier. I'm already a teacher anyways. It's just turn on the camera and I just teach instead of teaching at school, I'm just gonna teach makeup. So that's what I did. And it was a hobby for me. So I would on at nights and on the weekends, I would film YouTube videos as I was still a teacher. And I did that for a couple of years and I didn't earn a dime from it back then. There was no sponsorships, no affiliates. There wasn't even ad money from YouTube. It was just like everyone hanging out on YouTube and having a fun time. So that's kind of how it started. And you had a website. And was YouTube kind of more like a video integration for your site? It wasn't the search engine that it is today. Wasn't it? Because it was so small, I didn't even try to remember. It was just, you know, you just upload the videos and I don't even think we had thumbnails. It would just capture one in the middle. You're like in the middle, like doing some weird. And I would upload those videos or download them and then put them on the Makeup Geek site. And Makeup Geek was like a forum where I just hosted my content and would do like articles and reviews. And I started just having educational stuff on the site in addition to videos. So that's kind of how it got started. And that was 2008, right? 2008. And when did you launch the cosmetic brand Makeup Geek? In 2000, I think officially like it as a brand of our own line was early 2012, I think 2011, 2012. What did that look like? Like when you, okay, you had the idea. I'm gonna develop my own eye shadows. That's what you started with, right? Like, tell me what that looked like from the moment you had the idea to how quickly they get started to get legs and actually get developed to when you actually launched. Yeah. So I knew right away when I started my YouTube channel in 2008, I would just always was, I always loved makeup. Even though I was a teacher, I honestly, when I was younger, I wanted to go to cosmetology school but it just wasn't, I don't know. I wanted to be a teacher and makeup and that didn't really exist back then. So I just, well, I pick one. I'll be a music teacher. I'm good at music. But in 2008, I knew I wanted to start at least try to have a makeup line of my own at some time but it was a really hard process because I had no one to teach me what to do. There was no one doing that at that time. And the labs that I was trying to contact, I just did a lot of research. They weren't getting back to me because they're like, who's this girl? And they didn't even know what a content creator was. That word didn't even exist. I was just like, hey, I have a YouTube channel. And this was 2008? Wow, that's early. Yeah, so I started doing research back then. I took a while to, I just wanted to study. So I just did a lot of research on Google and was like teaching myself how to understand formulations and what ingredients were in makeup and how the process is made. And then I started just contacting labs and none of them got back to me. So I was just persistent on it. And I was telling Lisa the story earlier is one of the first labs that I actually stepped foot in their doors because I had contacted all these labs. They all were like, wouldn't respond. I was so determined. I was like, I'm starting a makeup line. I was saving up all my money and I was like really serious about it. My audience on YouTube was growing at this point. I was like, I think, I know I can do this. So my mom and I was living in Michigan at the time. We drove from Michigan to Toronto, Canada. It was like a good six hour drive, had to cross the border and everything. And I drove to this major lab in Toronto, just showed up there because they weren't getting back to me. I was like, well, I'm just gonna go to your doorstep then. So we went in and I was super kind to front desk. I said, hey, I've been reaching out to you guys to start a makeup line. No one's getting back to me. I really just wanna speak to one. I just need like 10 minutes of someone's time just to show you guys what I wanna do. Are you scared? Like I can imagine how you felt in that moment. No, I was just so like focused. I was like, I'm doing this. Yeah, I love that. That's amazing. I wish I could bottle that up and sell that. What's crazy, my daughter has it too. And I'm like, oh, she sold my child. Like my husband's like, that's you right there. I was like, I know, but it paid off, right? It did, it sure did. That's how you get things done. So long story short, I mean, they actually, the story is they kicked me out of the lab, you guys. My mom and I sat there for four hours. They were very condescending to me. They're like, you know, no one has time for you, bye. You know, they were just like, and I was like, it's okay, I'll wait. So we sat in the lobby for four hours and my mom was getting upset at this point. They're not even gonna try to whatever. I was like, no, I'm sitting here, let them know I'm serious about this. Like I'm not leaving until I talk to someone. And then finally they had us leave. Did they have security come or something? No, they just asked us to leave and said, no one's available, you need to go. So we left and drove another six hours back home. Wow, what a story. Yeah. So the moral of that story is you guys, if you want something bad enough, like don't let anything stop you. There's been so many times I was told no along the way. Can you imagine if you actually listened to that and you didn't? And didn't. Go for it, yeah. How different your life would be. Oh my gosh, so different, so different. And it's amazing when you think about the little choices that you make and the little decisions you make and how they create these webs throughout your life and everything kind of leads to the next. Yep, everything happens for a reason. And to this day, I'm not gonna, I did not do this because I was trying to be petty, you guys, but I still have not to this day worked with this lab. And they had approached me years later when Makeup Geek had blew up and was a big thing and they had wanted to work me. I was like, well, actually, I came to you guys first and you guys kicked me out of your place. So yeah, to this day I still work with them. It's like that pretty woman moment, you know? You're like, you remember me? I know. Big mistake. Big mistake. I know, that's why I kind of wanted to say I was very tempted to, but I was like, no, really didn't, Marlena, really didn't, because I was like, no, bye. Yeah, and so you launched in 2012, 2011, 2012? Yep, I was trying to remember the exact date. I remember, and it was right when my dad had passed. All these things happened in my life for a reason. And I think that's what helped the company grow is I was grieving from losing my dad. I was really close to him. He died in November, 2011. And I remember he was the last person to see my prototypes of eyeshadows. I had, you know, they weren't even fully named yet. I had these cheap little stickers. I'll try to find the picture to give to you guys. But it was like this cheap palette and I had all the eyeshadows and I was naming them. I was asking my dad to help me name some of these shadows and he was in the hospital and he ended up passing a couple months later. And then I think because of grieving, I just threw myself into work. And I was like, okay, this is gonna happen. Like, I'm doing this for my dad. Like, I'm doing this to- He's your driver. Yes. Oh, I love that. Yeah, because he got to see the shadows and he was so proud and so excited. I was like, I want him to be proud. So I'm just gonna throw myself into this thing and just make it work. And I did. I hustled and made it happen and just worked. Remember the day you launched? Like, do you remember that day? I wish, you know what's crazy? I wish I did. I don't. It's so wild. I think because- So much has happened. Yeah, it was such a crazy time. I don't even remember doing the announcement video, which is so crazy. I think because I still was in this weird grieving and this thing was taking off and there was a lot of things going on in my personal life. So it was kind of like, that actually happened. Yeah. And so you launched on your website and you were just sold on your website, right? I mean, I had my audience on YouTube and I thought, well, if anything, I'm gonna provide makeup for my audience because I want them to be happy and have products that they'll love and I can show them how to use it. And I really wanted to just help others feel beautiful and I wanted to teach them. That was what I really wanted to do and have the products to actually teach them with, so. I remember the day we launched. I remember like Brooklyn put the, did you have Shopify back then? No. No, okay. I don't even remember what- What the platform was? Might've been Magenta, I don't know, but Shopify didn't exist back then. Yeah, Shopify is a platform that makes it kind of easy for e-commerce business to get up and running. That's what we launched our site on. It does. And I remember that day, Brooklyn pressed the button to make the site live. And I'll never forget when you start hearing the orders come in. I was just like, oh my God, what is happening? Like, yeah. Oh. It was a cool moment. That's so amazing. So how did you feel when you did your announcement video? Were you nervous? Were you excited? I was really excited. I don't think I was nervous. I think I'm a pretty optimistic person in general. Like I don't really, not that I expected everything to just be sunshine and roses all the time, but I don't really think like there's a negative outcome. You know what I mean? I was just like, what's gonna happen will happen. And so I didn't have this big expectation. So I don't think I was that nervous, if that makes sense. That's good. I was nervous once we started getting products out to people, you know? And then people had it and I'm like, oh my gosh, are they gonna love it? Like, that's what I got nervous about. Every launch you do, you guys, I don't know if you feel the same way. Totally, yep. There is excitement, but then like you said, when it goes out to people, like, how are they gonna react? There's this very much like, are they gonna like it? Are they, what are they gonna say? Cause you just don't know, you know? All you can do is the best you can do. And I hope that everyone loves it as much as you. I hope they like it. Yes, totally. Everyone likes different things and you know, you never know if it's gonna resonate or not. It's... Yes, for sure. Okay, I'm gonna ask you some more questions. I prepared them. Okay. Well, how did you fund your business? Like, how did you, did you have any investors? Did you raise money? Like, tell me about that. No, I just saved up my money. So back then we weren't even really making much off of YouTube. But what we were doing at that time was just selling third-party products. So just very small. I just took whatever money that I had saved up from teaching and my husband at the time. And we had just invested really smallly in like selling third-party products. So Makeup Geek started really as selling other people's stuff. And I made these little Mac samples, like pigments and stuff. And I divvied them up in little pigment jars. Oh my God, I remember you did that. I would scout and I would take my time going to all these like, you know, cosmetic discount stores to buy the pigments so I could divvy them up in little jars and hand scoop them. I had like my gloves, my little hairnet, and I was doing that. And that's how I made, started making enough money. And I like squirreled that away so I could start the, my own line. Were you nervous about putting that money that you've been saving into it? Or were you just like certain? You were like, this is gonna be a success. Yeah, I was nervous because it's like, I was a teacher at that time. I wasn't making much money as a teacher. So I was like, okay, if like, you know, this is going all in, just kind of, this is it. We're doing it. We're doing it, yeah. I remember we had to buy our website domain because someone else owned it and it was $5,000 to buy that domain. And I remember being like, oh my gosh, are we sure we want to do this? Yes, really? Yeah. I'm having the problem that now with my new business, like all the websites are taken. They're all scalped up and all these people are trying to charge thousands of dollars for website domains. It's crazy. It's like a business. If you scooped them up in the early 2000s, it's like real estate almost. Okay, I have a question for you and this will be interesting. I'm interested to hear your answer on this because you were one of the first like to do it all. Like you were the one of the first creators, beauty creators, I mean, you know, influencers. Of course that wasn't a thing back then, but and the first to start your own brand. So I'm curious, have you ever had anyone in the beauty community that has been like your mentor or someone that has really helped you and kind of shown you the way or helped support you? This is going to sound negative and I don't mean this negative at all, you all, but no, I really, I wanted one. I tried so hard, but because there wasn't anyone else doing what I was doing at that time, I didn't have a mentor. And I remember reaching out to several brand owners at that time. Like I remember emailing Bobby Brown and some other ones. And you know, of course they're big companies and they're like, who's this girl? They're not going to get back to me. So that's when I was like, okay, if I'm going to do this, I just have to figure it out on my own. And that's what I did even throughout the entire lifetime of Makeup Geek. There was no manual. There was no one to tell me what to do. And it was just figuring out as I go. So I mean, my biggest lesson I learned is like, you learn through your mistakes. And I made a lot of amazing decisions with Makeup Geek and I made a lot of mistakes too, but that's how I learned. And looking back now, it's like, I wouldn't change anything because all the mistakes I made made me so much smarter now. So even as I'm moving forward to do new business, it's like, okay, I'm not going to do that, but that worked really well. I'm going to do that again. And it's just like trial and error. It's like the most valuable lesson versus having a mentor saying you should do this because- I agree. Each business is different. And I think there's some beauty in not knowing. Yeah. Right? Because you do things your own way and you're not afraid or you don't have the influence of someone telling you, you have to do it this way or you shouldn't do that. Yeah. You don't have that. Everyone has a different opinion. Totally. And so there is, while it can be more scary and difficult and it takes a certain type of person with a lot of just direction and, you know, discipline to keep moving forward without that guidance, I think it's a blessing sometimes to not have that. Yeah. Oh, for sure. And just to figure it out your own way. Oh yeah. And I think that a lot of people, myself included, it's kind of an excuse almost when you're like, oh, I don't have a mentor or oh, I don't know how to do this or oh, I don't like- You just got to figure it out. Yep. You got to figure it out. Yep. You got to figure it out. Is that how you feel like your process has been too? Like you just figured a lot of stuff out and just kind of trial and error as you went? Yes. I do. Yep. You know, Paul is a big support of our business and he is definitely a person that is like, he just figures it out, you know, and he loves to learn, he loves to have problems and figure out how to like get through them. And so, you know. That's kind of the fun part, actually. It's like a puzzle. Yeah. You have to figure out like, okay, this is how we're going to market it or this is how we're going to get around, you know, our business model or how we're going to fund this or. Totally. Yeah. It's a fun puzzle. Yeah. So you have to, you have to enjoy the unexpected. Yeah. In your life. It's not for everyone. I think you're resourceful too. You do. I think people think that they have to have like, oh, I have to have an agency help me with this or I have to have a media buying agency placed on my social media ads because I don't. But the truth is, is you can figure this stuff out, you know, and. He's done really well for us. Oh, he has. I mean, mad props to you guys. Like just the amount of growth you've done in such a fast time. You definitely, you know, are making a lot of great decisions and learning a lot. Thank you. You're doing really well. You should be so proud of yourself. Thanks. I am proud. How much growth you have. You guys, she's literally in just five years is like blown up, which is wild. And in a post COVID world, that's the crazy part. Like, you know, myself included, I had to shut down Makeup Geek and so many big brands, like Becca Cosmetics and Crown. And there was a ton of beauty brands that, you know, COVID demolished it. And here you guys are not only surviving, but thriving in a post COVID world. That's crazy. I have a thought about that. I actually had this conversation the other night. I think for us, we were a very, very young brand. I mean, we launched in August of 2019. So the beauty, I mean, the blessing for us is that we didn't have these infrastructures that were built for a massive brand. We didn't have 30 employees. We didn't have a big lease of an office. We didn't have all this, you know, all this inventory sitting that needed to go to a retailer. We were, it was just Paul and I and one employee. So we were able to get through COVID because we just didn't have the overhead that a lot of other brands had. That's what killed, yes. So if it had been, if we were where we're at now, I mean, it might still have been okay because we're not in retail, but I can understand how you just can't recover. You know, if we were a few years ahead of it at the time, it would have been really difficult. So it was kind of a blessing that we were so young, but it was also scary too at the time because, you know, Paul left his job. His last day was the day that they canceled South by Southwest here in Austin because of COVID. Really? Yeah, and he had been in the works for like six months. Like he had already told his boss he was leaving, but his last day happened to correspond with that. And obviously when he put his notice in, we didn't know COVID was going to happen. And I just remember being like, what are we doing? Like, this is a terrible idea, but it all works out. It does. I'm a huge believer in what's meant for you is meant for you. Yes. And it took me a long time to come to terms with that because when I had to close Makeup Geek, I was so devastated. This is my baby. I've been at this for so long. I was so devastated. And then I just came to the realization. I was like, okay, it like, it had its lifespan and that's great. Like it had its moment and not everything's meant to last forever. And it doesn't mean that you can't start something new and be really excited and do something bigger and better. And just, you know, it's a new start. And I actually like new beginnings. That's my favorite part. Yes, it is. It's fun building a brand. It is. Yeah, it's fun to kind of birth that. So I'm going to ask you a few questions. I have this amazing Facebook group that I shared with him last night that we were going to be filming. And I asked them to submit their questions. Alma asks, what motivates you to continue making content for social media, especially with so many creators out there and new platforms to keep up with? I think because I just enjoy interacting with my audience so much. It's so fun for me. And it's almost like my escape because it's like, you know, I'm a mom and I'm a wife and I'm building a business and all that. So when I sit down with a camera, it's like, oh, I get to socialize and have fun with people. So I love the process of it. It's like a fun time for me, but I'm motivated to do content because I feel like I have a different perspective now. So, you know, the beauty space obviously is saturated, but I feel like me being a brand owner and knowing like the production side of things, like this is how products are made. This is what it costs. Here's, you know, I don't even look at the products the same anymore. Like we were just talking earlier when I was looking at this YSL lipstick, when I look at it, it's like, oh, that's a pretty lipstick. Now I'm like, okay, that was extra tooling there. And that probably costs this much. And okay, so this formula, what did they use for that? Okay, that viscosity is pretty thin. I'm very analytical with my makeup now. And so I'm able to share some of that knowledge with everyone out there to be smart shoppers and know because not every makeup brand is somewhere going to rip you off. And how do you know? You know, I just want to share that knowledge. And so that's where I'm coming from. I have fun with the kind of the production side of makeup now versus just, you know, teaching how to apply makeup. I get to teach something new, which is really fun. Yeah, very educational. And you have a very unique perspective, you know, to be able to share that on YouTube and in the content that you create. What's your favorite content that you create on your channel? Do you have a certain, you know, like you just really love to film, you know? I love to film like really educational content, like breaking things down and making them really practical. You know, I used to be a Mac trainer, like along, you know, and the thing about Mac, I think the thing that set Mac apart, I mean, Mac, it's a different brand today than it was 20 years ago. 20 years ago, it was the jam. You know, it was the brand. The fact that she started there when she was 18, you guys, that's like, that's impressive. Yeah, Mac was very picky on who they hired. They were. Yes. I was real proud to get a job there. But I think what set Mac apart back then is the training that they gave. The other brands didn't do training like Mac did for other artists. So if you worked at Mac, I mean, it was like going to makeup school. Anyway, and I was a trainer for them. And so I really like latched on to just educating and teaching makeup and understanding color theory and placement and just approaching makeup as an art form. So I like to make videos when I can kind of share that perspective. Yeah, and that's what I love about your videos. You explain things really well and you demonstrate it and you say, you know, why I do this technique and why I like this product. And it's very, you learn, but it's very entertaining too. Thank you. Because I think it's really easy for us to probably be like, oh, makeup is so easy, you know, because we just know it and we do it. But it's not for everybody. And I think when I get an email or a comment like, oh my God, I just started makeup and I watched this video and this video and this helped me. It's like very impactful. It is. Yeah. Because at the end of the day, I mean, you're helping others to feel confident and beautiful. I always told myself that it's like, makeup is so much more than, I mean, it's an art form. It's fun and it's creative. But at the end of the day, like when you help someone be like, oh, like that technique really worked for my eyes or I really felt beautiful when I did this look. Like that makes me so happy. I could. That, yeah. That's like, oh, this is why I'm doing this. Yes. Exactly. Totally. Exactly. Were there any big lessons you learned from Makeup Geek? Oh my gosh. So many. I could write a book, you guys. I think you should. I should write a book. I'd buy it. So many lessons I've learned. Maybe one moment that was, when you were going through it, it was really difficult, but looking back, you're like, oh, I'm glad I learned that lesson or I'm glad I went through that. So my biggest thing is listening to your gut. If I could say anything to any brand owner or anyone wanting to start a business is listen to your gut because when I started Makeup Geek, I was very confident in all of that. And over time, ironically, as the company grew, I had so many people telling me, do this, do that. And I would listen. It was like, oh, well, they must know what they're talking about. They've been in the business for a long time or this person is just so convincing. So I wouldn't listen to my gut anymore. And I would listen to other people. And I lost that confidence in myself and all of the decisions, like the biggest catastrophes that happened in Makeup Geek were the times where I knew intuitively I should have listened to my gut and I didn't. Yeah, I think listening to your intuition in general is like the thing that, gosh, like I'm learning it as I get older and it's in business, it's in friendships. It's like that voice is their reason. Totally. To protect you. And no one else can tell you, like everyone can say like, I could sit here with Lisa and be like, okay, you should do this and that. But at the end of the day, she's the only one that's gonna know exactly what's gonna work for her brand and what to do. And only her gut can tell her that. Everyone can advise and give warnings and it's always good to take feedback and everything. But at the end of the day, you take all that feedback and information you're getting from all these people and you sit in silence with yourself and say, okay, what is it that my gut, I really feel like I need to do? That's my hardest lesson I learned is I listened to so many people and I didn't trust myself when I knew intuitively that my gut was gonna tell me what I should have done. And sometimes it's a really hard decision, right? I did a video recently with my friend, Lindsay, who's the founder of a skincare brand called Kyra Moon. And she was talking about how when she first started, Ipsy actually emailed her and wanted to include her in our subscription boxes, which was a huge opportunity. I think she had just started the brand. It was like two months old, but she wasn't able to do it. She's like, it would have killed us. Like we weren't operationally, logistically ready to take that on. And if I had said yes, because it was like a great opportunity that you can't say no to, it would have destroyed the business. It would have destroyed the relationship with Ipsy. I would have let them down. It would have been a catastrophe. So she said no, which I can imagine how hard that was to say no, you know? That's actually smart. Yeah, but then a year later when she was, she had her stuff together. She called them and she's like, okay, now I'm ready. And now they have a great relationship. Oh, that's amazing. And it's been a success. And she's been in like five of their boxes, I think. Wow. I think that's one mistake I actually wanna talk about that I have not shared with anyone. It was, we had gotten into Target stores and I'm not bashing Target at all. It's actually, you know, I still shop there. I love the brand and everything like that. But I had, you know, said yes to going into store and structurally with the business and my margins were not set up to handle retail. And that's honestly was a excruciating lesson that I had to learn is I, you know, I should have said no and said, okay, you know, cause I'm thinking in my mind, this is a great opportunity to get it in the hands of other people. And like, who says no to Target? Like that's an amazing opportunity. Like Target's amazing. I love Target. So I said yes. And from a financial standpoint, just demolished the, you know, sales. And it just was not a wise decision on my part. Yeah, that is, I think that's okay to say no sometimes. I think that's a misconception too. A lot of people have about brands that are like fast growing or having a lot of success is when they get in, but growth is great. But if you're not prepared or ready for it, it can completely like destroy your business. It can, yeah. You have to, you have to, it's almost better to be slow with your growth. Like, I think that was one thing that was a hard lesson for me too, is we grow so quickly. So it's like, you're kind of as, because it explodes and it grows so fast, the infrastructure and how you're setting up the business and all the standard, you know, procedures and things you're doing, you're hobbling along and just trying to stay above water because it's growing so quickly versus like steady growth that's, you know, you're able to adjust and implement along the way. Absolutely. I think explosive growth is exciting, but it's also a little scary. It's like, okay, we're here now. How do we sustain this? Yes. Like how does, how do you scale it up? Right. And then all of the additional overhead that you take on to keep up with that, you know, the extra facilities, the extra employees, the extra everything. And most people think, oh, the business is growing so you have more money. But the reality is, is the bigger you grow, the more expensive your costs are, which seems ironic because you're like, you're making more money, but now you're having to hire like, you know, an entire legal team and an HR department. And I have multiple managers now, which, you know, their salaries are going to be more than when I had one manager. And it's just, your sales grow, but so does your cost too. Which is important in the beginning when you're pricing the brand. Yes. You know, when you're coming up with your price, it's not only for that growth, but it's also for getting into retail one year. You know, and I think having, being able to like know that going in, like starting the brand, because it's very difficult to underprice yourself and then to raise that price over time. That's what my mistake was with Makeup Geek. I priced it too low. And I know a lot of people get mad at me for saying that. Cause like, you know, everyone wants great products for a low price. And that's what made Makeup Geek so great because I was direct to consumer. I could do that, but I didn't set up the margins healthy enough. So when to do retail or to scale it up. So when the business grew, it collapsed because I didn't have margins that were meant for long-term to scale it up and allow for retail or, you know, getting in other countries and things like that. I can't do that if I'm pricing it too low for the quality that I'm bringing to the table when I'm paying myself for the product. So that was a big mistake that I had to learn with that too. That was a good conversation. I know. How do we- That was a great question. That was good. Yeah, what was the question again? I don't even remember, but that was like flowed very well. Okay, Marlene, I have another question for you. What big changes came from when the brand first launched to kind of where it was when you decided to close the brand in terms of like, who was your customer? Who were you speaking to? Like all of that. I think one trick that happened because I had the company for so long, it was open for 12 or 13 years. There's always gonna be a natural evolving. When I started Makeup Geek, it was, you know, these high quality shadows for an affordable price, which didn't exist at that time in, you know, 2010, 2011. And then years later, many brands started doing that. Drugstore brands had gotten on board. And so the whole industry kind of shifted and a lot of things, a lot of formulas and things were improving. So I had to learn how to evolve and bring different things to the table. And that's the tricky part too, is just changing over time. And I didn't wanna just keep selling, you know, here's Marlena's got the eyeshadows, great quality for an affordable price. Now, okay, now what? So trying to figure out how you're gonna pivot has been a challenge. And I think over time, that was what I'd struggle with and why something I'll learn in the new business that I'm building is that having multiple plans of things you can pivot to and not just focus on one thing. Like I don't, I wish I could go back in time and really focus on offering other things other than just the eyeshadows and branching out and creative in different ways so that when that market got saturated and everyone else was doing the same thing, okay, I've got like plan B, plan C, plan D set up. So yeah, it was a lot of changes had happened in the company just in the industry as a whole from when I started and when it ended. How long was it till you launched the eyeshadows and then how long was it before you launched your next product? I wanna say a couple years cause we had sold, we had done eyeshadows for quite a while and just kept expanding the eyeshadows. And then I think after that, we had started doing blushes and those did pretty well cause they're kind of similar to eyeshadows. But then when I started going into lips because it was like a whole different category, we really struggled with that. Cause everyone's like, well, wait, you're the powder company. You make eyeshadows and blushes. What are you doing with lipsticks? And so it kind of, you have to figure out how to strategically expand the line where it makes sense to your customers. And that's another lesson I had to learn and make some changes. If I had to do it differently, I would have maybe done it, sold products in a different order. So that way it would have been accepted more and I wouldn't have just been known as like the eyeshadow company. I do remember when your eyeshadows, when I started learning about them, everyone would compare them to like being better than Mac and for a lot less. Exactly. Because back then Mac was the one and you could buy Mac in single shadows, which you could do yours too. And no one was really doing that either. No, no. I really have been dying to use these lashes. They were sitting on the desk here. They're her BK Beauty lashes. Look how cool these are. I was actually going to go to the store today and pick some up like this. This is her Martini false lashes. I'm putting them on today, you guys. Yes, we did those in collaboration with Risa Desnico. Oh, I love her. She's so sweet. She is. She's a makeup artist too. Super great makeup teacher. Very educational. Very glam, stunning. She is. And she's so kind too. I've been following her for a really long time too. I love the people that you collaborate with. I think you just pick some amazing people that are just good people, very talented, and bring different things to the table. Thanks. Well, it's interesting you say that, yeah, because I was having this conversation a couple weeks ago about like, you know, when we first launched the brand, our core customer was kind of really like my following, like the community that kind of watches my YouTube videos. And it's a, you know, woman, 30s, 40s, 50s, 60s. And when we, our first collaboration with was Angie, you know, who's, you know, her content is really geared towards mature women. It's skin, beauty tips, and advice for mature, the mature beauty community. And now the brand has like reached this whole new demographic through TikTok. And it's really funny because I'll have creators, I'll actually tag her down below. Her name is Bobby. She's a YouTuber and she's amazing. She has been a long supporter of ours. And she messaged me that her daughter like came in and was like, mom, I want that viral BK Beauty concealer brush that's Angie's. You know, Angie's hot and flashy concealer brush. So it's really cool to like, have like this demographic that we originally reached. And now like their daughters are like fans of it. That's so cool. That's really hard to do. Cause I find that once you find kind of your niche crowd to branch outside of that can be really tricky. I think it's just not being afraid to just speak to other people. You know, I think that yes, it's good to kind of look around and see what the market is doing and maybe get some inspiration or some ideas, but really just kind of follow your gut and what feels right to you. Even if it seems like, oh, well, no one else is doing that. And that's one thing that we try and do. We try not to just like speak to just one demographic. Yes. Yeah. That's really important. And brushes anyways. I mean, that's, what's so great about your brand is you can, everyone can use them. It's all about, you know, quality brushes. If you're 18 or 80 years old, everyone needs a great quality brush. So I think that's a great strategy for your brand is they work for everyone. Yeah. I think one of the keys to our success is starting with brushes. Starting cosmetics is very expensive and it's very competitive. And there's a shelf life on cosmetics. So it's like you develop products, you better sell them, sell them quickly before they go bad. Right? And with brushes, it just kind of eliminated some of those risks for us. So it was, I'm glad we went with brushes. Yeah. Yeah. I think it was definitely a smart move for you all. I mean, you do great job with them. What I love about your brand too, is like you're very particular in the shapes that you do. I mean, they're like, if there was any changes to this brush, it wouldn't be the same brush. It wouldn't work the same. Like if it was bigger, nope. If it was smaller, nope. Like shape differently, no. Like as is, you're very great at creating specific shapes that like excel at what you need them for. Like the 101 is my favorite brush. It works great for buffing foundation, but I also used it today to apply my bronzer. And then I just tilted the brush handle up and now I've got a blush brush. And it's the perfect size and shape. If anything was different on this, it would not be the brush. It would be the same. It'd be a different brush. Oh, thank you. You guys are like our one-on-one. It's our best seller. It is. It's a great brush, by the way. I'm not just saying that because Lisa's saying it to you guys. By the way, you guys, I'm like sitting here like, I don't know. I don't know what happened here. I'm a notorious, I cannot leave stuff alone. And I had a breakout and I was like, I'm filming with Lisa and she looks so gorgeous. Her skin's so amazing. And of course I'd have a breakout. So I'm over here trying to mess with it. Made it into the avalanche that it is. I left yesterday and my daughter was like, mama, what happened to your face? You love kids for that. I know. It is what it is. We're just gonna, you know, we're gonna rock with it today. It's a great opportunity for me to show you guys how I use my concealer to cover my breakouts. You used the Natasha Denona, right? I did. I used the Natasha Denona. It's so good. Such a good formula. And to hide it, I used the BK. It's the N14 brush. It's one of my favorites. I use it for under the eyes. But if you actually, let me, I need to hide it a little bit more. I want to do a little demo for you guys because it's still peeking out a little bit. So I put a little concealer there. What I like about this brush is because it's so fluffy. You literally can just tap it on and just cover up. It just blends out around the breakout there without, you know, like messing it up. So it just kind of feathers around it, which I think is so good. Yeah, Nikkie did a great job with those brushes. She's so sweet. I really like her. She is. She is amazing. I was a huge fan of hers when I approached her about doing this collaboration with us. You know, since we've become good friends. It's like, it's fun being able to design products with friends, you know? Yes, exactly. Other than the 101, because I know that's your favorite, most iconic product, is there other things that you are looking to create or that you have created that have also been just really fun? You're like, oh, I really enjoyed creating this, or, you know, I would love to create that. I think the most fun is doing collaborations. You know, with the three people that we've done collaborations with, Angie and Risa, like, I was friends with them before, you know, and Risa had actually, was interested in developing lashes herself, and so I was kind of helping her and answering her questions about, like, starting a brand and everything she needs to know, and that's kind of how it came about for us to do the collaboration for lashes with her. Yeah. And then Nikkie, I was a fan of hers, and then now we're friends through the whole process, but I think just, like, working with someone, you know, that you like, that's a friend of yours, developing a product, bringing it to market, you know, doing the photo shoots, doing all the creative behind it, and then just, you know, having it be well-received by customers and community, and, like, being able to share in that with other people is pretty cool. It is pretty cool. I think that's the most fun, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I hope to do more collaborations with just people that are really, you know, great fits for the brand and really aligned with the brand. Let me see those on you. So you already put mascara on. Oh, those look so good. They look good, right? They do. Those lashes are really good, you guys. They give you a little, like, cat eye. They do, because I like elongating my eyes. I'm not even joking, I swear, you guys, I was going to stop at the drugstore on the way to film today, because I was like, oh, I really need some, like, half lashes, and so I was looking for some, so when I saw these, I was like, oh, can I have these? I just invited myself, I was like, can I have these lashes, please? Yes, I'll send you more. They're really pretty. They're very comfortable, too. Yeah, they're so easy to pop on. Yeah, like, that was really fast, and look how my eyes are like, boop. Yep. Lashes make all the difference. I like those. They're so good. Your makeup looks pretty. Thank you. I like it. I like it, too. A little different than what I did on your channel. I like it. What do you guys think? What do we, how did we do? Yeah, I love your makeup, so which look's your favorite, the one you did on your channel or this one? I like them both, I don't know, but I'm feeling these lashes, so maybe this one. Yeah, the lashes, I think. Yeah. Well, thank you so much for being on my channel. This was so fun. Yes, you guys, she really is the sweetest person, like, authentic, what you see on camera is what you get. I know I keep saying that like a broken record, but it really is, so I love seeing good people win. The same to you, and I think people know that, but I just want to reiterate that, too. Well, thank you so much for watching this video. We will link all the products and list them down below, because I know we didn't get to mention them in the video. I'm going to link to Marlena's channel down below, and I'm also going to link to the video that we filmed and shot for her channel, where she put me in the hot seat, down below, so be sure to go over there and check that out. Thanks for watching, you guys. Bye. Thanks for having me. Bye.