Jr. NBA Coaches Corner Podcast (Season 3, Episode 4): The Off-Season Mentality

We're back with episode four of the Junior NBA Coaches' Corner podcast. Today we are chatting about the off-season mentality. Here to help both of us, we have national champion and two-time national coach of the year, Maryland women's basketball head coach Brenda Freeman. Welcome to the Junior NBA Coaches' Corner. Here are your hosts, Dallin Cuff and Monica McNutt. What's up folks? Welcome in to another episode of the Junior NBA Coaches' Corner podcast. Alongside Monica McNutt, I'm Dallin Cuff. Special guest today, Brenda Freeze, the head women's coach of Maryland. Fresh off of the Sweet 16 campaign, won a national championship back in 2006. Monica, you have some history. You know her quite well. Dude, 06. First of all, I remember that team, Marissa Coleman, Kristen Tolliver, Crystal Langhorne. Maryland, obviously I grew up 20 minutes from Maryland. I remember getting my recruiting letter from Maryland, but also being like, I'm probably not actually going to play if I go here, so maybe we need to reconsider this. I mean, she was building a powerhouse. That was when Maryland was in the old ACC. Now they're a part of the Big 10, but the program is still one of the more recognizable names in women's basketball, for sure. In the DMV, what kind of weight does Maryland carry? When it went to Big 10, did anything change? No, I don't think. I think for that first two years, it was kind of weird because like Duke Carolina, obviously a big ACC rivalry, but sneaky like Duke Maryland was also like a rivalry that people looked for, right? Like that was a big one. So I know people lamented it for the first couple of years and it obviously was a football move. I do think the area would like to see Maryland football, you know, advance. And so they were able to get behind it then, but you know, she rattled off, what, a handful of the Big 10 championships easily when they first got to the Big 10. So she's continued to put out great basketball teams. Yeah, no doubt about it. And you mentioned the rivalry too, on the men's side, and you talked to like Boozer and J. Will, those guys are playing in no one. Maryland was their biggest rival. You know, North Carolina wasn't that great at that time, but that one Dixon, Steve Blake, that crew, they played in the final four, they played four times one year in that, in that one championship season. So that's, those were good days, but now Maryland's got different things going on. The Big 10 has been very successful. We're talking about off season hoops and off season kind of approach. What, what was your off season? Like, like, what did you, when you got done playing for the seat, like what was, what did it look like for you? Look at that face. I don't know what that face means, but go ahead. Because every year I had the same off season gold cup. And I don't know that I actually ever achieved it. I was supposed to get faster and quicker laterally, faster and quicker laterally and stronger. Right. Yeah. I think my senior year was probably the strongest I got. I mean, I was in the gym. I definitely was in the gym. I did have my little summer part-time job. I spent time in a gym, honestly, honing what I already did. Well, just keep shooting. I never, I never put them on the floor, like whatever. I remember our coach, Jim angles, who's now the head coach of Columbia. He walks down one time and I'm on the gun. I would get like at least a thousand shots a day on the gun. He's like, yo, man, we know you can shoot threes. Are you, are you, are you putting a ball on a deck? Like, what are we doing? Like, yeah, I'm working on it. Not enough. I did my senior year, my foot broke a bunch of times. Oh man. Like I'm going to do these drills off season, but I'm actually never going to use it in the regular season, but it's fine. All right. With no further ado, let's get into some off season approach. We got, we got, we talked about a lot of different things with, with Brenda freeze. Let's dive right into it here with the Maryland coach, Brenda. Great to be with you. Thank you so much for joining Monica. And I, I want to start here. You go to the sweet 16 again this year, solid, a great year in terms of success on the court. But as you reflect, I had time to reflect on the season. Is there something you learned about yourself, your staff, anything as you move forward in this profession and what did you take away from this year that could be educational for yourself? Yeah. You know, I think, you know, for us, I mean, we, we said, if we could get this team do a sweet 16 this year, it would have felt like getting to a final four. And the reason was just because we had had so much adversity, you know, between, you know, injuries and illness and COVID and you know, just a cycle. It, it always seemed like, I mean, there were, there weren't very many days where you'd show up and everything was very calm, peaceful. So I think just learning to handle, like, I mean, we've all are, are able to navigate tough things, but I think this was one was really an unusual year that, you know, we were able to, even in spite of everything that happened, be able to help this team get to a sweet 16. It was quite the run, though, coach. You guys, I mean, definitely highs and lows, as you mentioned, it's always cool for me. Like I remember your national championship squad, like how much fun that was coming out of the area. What does it take kind of to continue to move a program forward in this era of the You know, I mean, I, I am, you know, really proud that we've been able to sustain that consistency level. When you, when you talk about, you know, we've been to three final fours and, and, you know, winning so many of the big 10 titles and getting far in the NCAA tournament, but it, it definitely is a lot harder, you know, compared to when we started, you know, now with being at over 1200 kids, you know, it's like no other. So the influx of talent coming in and talent going out, you know, is, is a different animal. And, you know, one that I think you just have to have a really, one, you have to have a phenomenal staff and, you know, and then just making sure you continue to keep getting the right pieces, right. Not only talent pieces, but character pieces for Oh, go ahead. I was about to say D you're right. We're on the same page, Dallin, but coach you and I, I mean, Dallin, you got to know that like, when I got a letter from Brenda Friesen, University of Maryland back in 2005 or so, I was like, Oh my God. Then I decided not to go there. Cause I didn't want to sit behind Marissa Coleman, which was the right decision. But anyway, but coach, at final four this year, you and I had an opportunity to chat a little bit. And I think for this to be a coach's corner kind of podcast, you are well-established and we talked candidly about your staff and how you have empowered some assistants who are a little bit younger. Shout out to Lindsey span, one of the products out of the DMV. So just in terms of not only your players, but also helping to grow your staff, what's your approach there. You know, it's evolved, but I, I, I mean, I say this, it's the best staff I've had in my 20 years here. And I think the blend of, you know, between my associate head coach, Karen Blair and myself with that kind of experience and longevity, and then to have that youthful, we always say that youthful bliss and energy with Lindsey span and Caitlin fraud. So, you know, or five to seven years in this profession, just coming up, it works, right? So you've got, you know, a bunch of busy bees grinders, you know and then we're able to kind of share our experience with, with both of them, but they're just, you know, like, you know, an open book, you know, they're ready to learn. And because they're so open and, and, and they're so hardworking. And it also helps us, you know, it helps me to be able to relate to, you know, these players and, you know, you know, when they brought out pushing P this year, I'm like, what, like, you know, the, the, you know, tick tocks that we're doing. I mean, you know, I, I'm not following that stuff, but, you know, so, you know, I think they keep you young and relatable. You're talking to a tick-tock Maven over here and McNutt too. This is a whole side note. I don't know anything about either. I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm old too. I was going to ask you about how do you find players with like, in terms of character with the portal being, it's such a short window of time. I want to table that for a second, as you were mentioned, and we, this is our coaches at a corner podcast. You mentioned how great your staff is. Have there been years where the staff mix was not right? And how do you manage that? If it's not where you want it to be, how do you manage that as the head coach? You can't be in it as long as I've been in it and not make some, some, some bad hires. Right. So, you know, or, or the ones that, that just don't fit. And, you know, I think, you know, you, you try to work, right. You try to, to get those staff members to understand what, what the fit is, your culture, what you need them to do, how to line up, you know, different things. But, I'm also a coach that empowers my, my staff members to do their job and, and do it to the best of their abilities. So, you know, I, I think, you know, if you see that there isn't a fit though, you need to continue to have those conversations unless, you know, I think at some point, you know, both parties will, will kind of feel that maybe it's time to move on. So, you know, you, you try to the best of your ability and, and, and then you have to make your own decisions. On that. Okay. Now that's well said and critical. I will say I'm talking to both men's and women's coaches. You mentioned 1200 players in the portal on the women's side, there's about 14 or 1500 in the men's side. Every coach I've talked to since really their season ended, there is no off season. It's just, you're going right into the portal, right. And to figure it out, how do you motivate, motivate your staff? And how do you go about finding like, let's answer that question. How do you go about finding the right fit from a character standpoint, not just a game in terms of how they play when it's just such a small window relative to how long you may know a kid when you're recruiting them out of high school. I think that's the part I like the least, you know, being a relationship type of coaches, you know, I liked when we could foster these relationships for, you know, a couple years and get to know the kid and, and know the family and, you know, and now we're, you know, signing kids out of the portal within a week, you know, or on a zoom, zoom, you know, and they haven't even been to campus. So it's definitely making our jobs a lot harder. I think if you talk to any coach, men or women, it's, it's not probably, you know, one of our greatest times right now, you know, because it's really hard. I mean, you're basing things off of unknowns and you hope you get it right, you know, and if you don't get it right, you're not going to keep your job very long. And I think that's the, the tough element right now is, you know, we're not trying to, you know, at least for us, the kids that we've gotten out of the portal, we know, you know, we've been able to, you know, have relationships with, you know, the majority of them that, that, you know, so you're not just kind of flying in there and, and, and taking every kid that, that you think, you know, can, you know, just play from a talent end. Do you think it'll level out? Like right now, the numbers are crazy. This is still relatively new. We're going on the second year of this kind of, do you think it'll level out coach? I hope so. You know, I don't, I don't know in the sense of, I think COVID obviously in the additional year factors into these couple of years, but then when, you know, the men are ahead of us. So, I mean, you know, I, I think the last time I checked, they were at 18 or 1900 and they're, you know, I mean accelerated in all of this. So when, when I look at what's happening with them, we've, we've mirrored that we follow it. So I don't know per se that it's going to be going away. I think it's going to be our normal, I think with the NIL you know, I think there's some great things with it, you know, that they're able to, you know, secure money and, and benefit from that. But right now there's so much at play of the money factor and the ego and the notoriety that it's not really going in, in, in the best direction all the time. How do you manage that within your locker room? Have you had some issues, whether it's, you know, with players making money and not making money and equality within that, or, you know, how have you had, have you dealt with it? And if you have, how have you handled it? So, you know, I think it's so relatively new. I mean, yes, we've had, you know, players secure and they put it out there. They're, they're what, you know, they're promoting their, their NIL deals. So it hasn't been as big of a thing yet, you know, but I think, cause it is so relatively new, you know, it's kind of that unknown right now of where that money's going to get to, you know, for, for these athletes. So, you know, I think, you know, ask us in a few more years, what, what it looks like. So the other side of that though, coach, I know as I was having conversations as this thing evolved was like, particularly for women's basketball players, your collegiate experience could be the height of your notoriety, right? So, but just in general, in terms of the influx of corporate support, network support, enthusiasm around the women's game, how encouraged are you? Cause you've been at this. So I know you see a difference or do you, or has it always been the same for Marilyn? I imagine you see a difference though, right? Oh, huge difference. Yeah. Huge difference from gosh, the time I played to the time I've been here at Maryland to where it is now, like this is an all-time high. I mean, to see the ratings and the reviews and social media, you know, I mean, things are just instant anymore that everybody's connected and knows what's going on. So, yeah, I mean, and I think a lot of those things are, are great. Right. I mean, it's exposure, it's notoriety and, you know, it's instant. So you're, you're able to be able to get it at your fingertips. The things you think that you want either the media partners, the NCAA to do, are there things that helps continue to grow the women's game and get more exposure? There are things that you think that could be necessary to keep building on this? You know, I thought, you know, this past season was a step in the right direction, you know, absolutely. You know, I think, you know, they're trying to move that needle, you know, it's, you know, still has a gap and there's a long ways to go. I mean, you could even go into equality of salaries between the men's and women's coaches. And, you know, you know, I thought there was a great article written this year of like, you know, finally where coaches are at, but it's still maybe, you know, a dozen coaches that are over a million dollars versus, you know, on the men's side, that's kind of the norm, you know, so, you know, just, you know, continuing to grow those things, you know, I think are huge continuing to, you know, grow that exposure, you know, from a television and, you know, I think it is big, you know, and, you know, hopefully they'll continue to see that those ratings are backing it up. So the exposure is starting to come, people are finally getting with it. It's about time, both you and I know that. Dallin knows that too, he's a progressive man. But all athletes are getting better, right? Or is that fair to say? Because I don't want to discount, you know what I'm saying, you doing your thing back in the day, but it seems like the product continues to improve. For sure, for sure. You know, they're, you know, bigger, stronger, faster, more athletic, you know, I think there's a depth to our talent pool now that is unlike anything I've ever seen. So, you know, I think that's where you're starting to see a lot of the parody within our game is the fact that, you know, what was it, 10 years, 15 years ago, it was all UConn or Tennessee. And that was the only exposure you saw, you know, from the media. And so finally, you know, through, you know, having media that's showcasing more than two programs and you're seeing that influx of talent that has changed in the game, you're starting to see so many more programs and hence why you're seeing all these unknowns and teams beating each other that we've never had before. I was in at ESPN when, when I think Creighton beat Iowa and you could actually hear executives heartbreaks, like, like two buildings over because oh God, Kayla Clark's gone. It was, but that, but there was an element of losing her, but the upsets are what makes these tournaments special. Like, is that good for the game to have, to have these upsets and have a tendency to go as far as they went and there were others. It is, I mean, it's bad for our big 10 foe, you know, but and, and it is, like you said, I mean, everybody male or female knows who Kayla Clark is. That's a beautiful thing. But then the upsets, you know, I mean, there were so many, you know, last year and this year that, you know, our game is finally, you know, able to grow, I think for our game when it eventually gets to, you know, neutral sites, you know, that's the next step, getting them off the, the, the home campuses, you know, I think, you know, when we're able to see that, I think you're going to see another change in our game of, of, of even more, you know, parity. So, you know, I, I think there's more room for, for this thing to be able to grow. I agree with you on that one coach so much, and I'm looking forward to the day, but what excites you most as the women's game continues to move forward and grow, like you said? You know, I, I think, you know, in some regards similar to the men that, you know, I mean, our players do, they walk around campus and they're seen, but almost like from a national end that, you know, they don't just have to be that marquee player, right? Like, you know, an Asia Wilson or, you know, you know, you name any, you know, great professional player that, that the exposure is so high from these players that, that they're recognized, you know, wherever they go. And I also think, you know, where the game is headed is, you know, continuing just to see the depth of, you know, these players and, and how many more players are going to, you know, be afforded that opportunity just as this talent continues to increase and grow within our game. I agree. Yeah. I want to dive back into your team a little bit. Now that you are in the off season here, how do you approach it in terms of, in terms of the off season plan with each individual, how much time you get on the court, just kind of take us into how you deal with off season and player development and what's the focus? Well, I'm, I'm laughing because, you know, it's, it's been like an off season, like no other, which I think is where it's going to be until May 1st is the transfer portal. It's never been like this where you just come off a season and just have to put your head down and spend the transfer portal the entire time until the deadline, May 1st, thank goodness there's a deadline. Otherwise I think you'd really see more coaches retire sooner. So I think that's changed it, you know, you know, because you do, you need a reset and you need a refresh, which you're not going to get until May. And then I think for us, you know, is, you know, now you got to look at, you know, we're spending our time on all the new kids coming in and getting them transitioned and getting that built. So, you know, it used to be where you spent that time between your own current roster that you knew was coming back and then you were adding a few freshmen and, you know, and your staff, you were, you were doing a lot of things, you know, within your staff, but that element obviously is changing, but, you know, we do use, you know, the off season to kind of, you know, tweak things we want to do offensively, defensively, looking at, you know, for us, our roster isn't completely finished yet. So we, we still need to see what that's going to look like. So we have an idea. But then once you get your players in here is like, you know, utilizing them from skills work and off season and, you know, strength and conditioning and really getting them prepared for the upcoming season. All right, coach. So what has all of this change required of you? Like, are you the same? I mean, of course you still have the championship winning pedigree, like the ability, the competitiveness, but how much in your coaching span lifetime so far have you kind of stretched? Like, did you envision yourself being this version of yourself at this point? Cause there's no way we could have predicted the transfer portal. You know what I mean? Like Maryland is still one of the premier programs in women's basketball. So you've maintained that. I just wonder like how much coaches have had to, you know, adapt and adjust and what that feels like for you as a competitor, as a woman, as a coach, as a leader of these women. Well, I think that's the thing you find out is that if you are inflexible and you can't adapt, you're not going to last long. And I think for us, like, you know, I was really fortunate at the time when we were in the ACC and we made the move to the big 10 and that was a huge, you know, thing, you know, and we, we adapted, you know, and we had to, you know, very similar to now this transfer portal. I'm pretty sure if you asked any coach, there was not one coach in, in favor of it on the men's or women's side, but you know what, it's not going away. So I think the competitive side of you, you know, as we've lost players, the competitive side of me says, okay, let me know the next great player that I'm going to find to put on a Maryland uniform. And I think for me, that's where my competitive juices come from is that, you know, yeah, I don't, I don't like it. I don't like that. You know, there's, there's no adversity to having to sit out. You get to go as you, as you want, but at the same point, you know what, like, you know what the competitive side of me is, I'm going to find more great players to put on that uni and represent us to the highest level. I mean, to be fair, if you have players that transfer, you already, you don't have to scout them. Like I know exactly what you're going to do when we play y'all. I already know your game. We were talking a little about, about how you, from a player development standpoint, but with all this change and adapting to, to having these players, new players come in, players come out. Once you get into bay, how much do you focus on like team chemistry and like finding, like building that, that core group, not much on the court, but off the court with all this turnover, it's going to be huge. You know, like I said, first, we have to know what our final roster is going to be. So talk to me in may after the deadline of may 1st, but are there certain things like in terms of, does it, you put more of an emphasis on, well, we're going to have team events or we're going to have meals or we're going to do like, is it different, I guess, than it was before? Yeah, for sure. You know, and, you know, I think we also learned during COVID, you know, you can zoom from anywhere, which is nice to be able to get everyone involved when you're kind of, you know, putting pieces, cause we have a blend, right. Of incoming freshmen to grad, you know, seniors to everything. So, but then yes, when you get them here in the summer, in the fall, there'll be a lot of team building because there will be a lot of new faces. With all this turnover, are the players different? Do they seem less invested at all with the institution? You know, I think, you know, you used to play for the name on the front. I still think there are some players that play for the name on the front, but it's usually the name on the back anymore. And the NIL has done that, you know, that I not per se saying these players have come in with that, that mentality, but when you're now, you know, having your own Jersey made for you and you're getting money off of that. And, you know, why, why wouldn't you be playing for yourself and playing for your image and playing for, you know, that, that as much money as you can make. And, and so it, it has changed a lot of that. Okay. So part, like it's you, your players, but then there's like, I don't even know if it's fair to call them the elephant in the room because they're a very big piece of this puzzle and that will be the parents. So from where you sit now, coach, like the transfer portal be what it may. But what would you say to parents? Cause I know going into school, myself, my boyfriend, like we've had this conversation about our future kids. Eventually, like we're not doing a transfer because I think there's something to be said ideally, you know what I'm saying? Barring crazy, something crazy happening. There's something to be said to your point, the chemistry, the stick to sticking with the program, finishing and completing, like, what do you say to parents in this era? You know, and I am a parent and I'm living both sides of it, you know, as a coach, as well as, you know, with my own, my own twins and, you know, the parents are so big by the way. Oh my God. Exactly. And, and I think we can all reflect on your parents are huge. You, if your parents are going to allow you to run away and, and hide, then you're going to be able to do that. If your parents are going to make you fight and, and go through adversity and, and stick it out, I think you're going to be better because of it. And I do think there's unique situations and when you're talked through a hundred percent, but you know, I am concerned of the fact that we're not, we're trying to bubble wrap our kids. And, you know, the minute one thing goes wrong we want this perfect world. And that's not life. You're going to maybe get, you know, eight things you like and two things you don't, you know, Hey, my job, I don't love everything about my job, but the majority of it is pretty darn good. And the other stuff comes with it. That's life. And so I think the parents are huge. I think, you know, making your kids resilient, making them fight, fight through adversity, not be handed it. You know, I don't know how many freshmen come in and have stellar freshmen campaigns, make them fight. Like make them fight through the first year's tough. There's not very many freshmen that get to play their first year. So make them fight through it. And then we better because of it, you know, going, going on in life. I just want to retweet darling. Cause if anybody's listening, I don't want it to feel like, you know, we got coach versus players. No, I'm in the middle. And I will point out that during the women's tournament, I think this was kind of a trend. And I remember Asia Wilson tweeting out after her first year at South Carolina, she wanted to transfer Don Stanley quote, tweeted it and said, and I had your replacement coming, but Asia's point was she stuck through it or stuck with it and look what was able to happen. And so, I mean, even among, you know, my peers that are WMBA players and stuff, we have this conversation because I don't, I'm not who I am as a person. If my parents let me transfer beyond just the basketball, right? Because sports, why we love sports in so many ways is because of all the other life lessons that it teaches and then life, baby transfer portal. Good luck. I do love the bond. Yeah. You kind of buried the lead that you and your, your boyfriend have discussed the transfer portal like that. We're basketball people. There's no kids. There's no kids, but we've just got some transfer portal. No, I don't see that for our kids. We're looking 20 years down the road here. We're figuring this thing out. It'll be back level down coach. It won't be as crazy by then. Yeah, but it's volumes to the, the, the piece of that you want to raise resilient kids. And I think somewhere in all of this, it's, it's all changed. And, and I don't know, you know, why, how, you know, where it started, but, you know, I, I think, you know, you are better because of it when, when you've gone through some tough things and have shown that you can persevere and, and can fight through it. Yeah. I've always been pro the opportunity for the kids to transfer, but I do think there's an element of the grass is always greener. It's not going to be the case. And I think kids are going to look back years later, five, 10 years down the road. And maybe Monica got the exact opposite experience you're describing where it's like, man, I probably should have stayed from that. Leaving that was not the right option. Maybe I seated a scholarship at the D one level. There are those stories too. People don't have a spot to land. There's a bunch of different kind of problems with, with it, but I felt, you know, to have the opportunity, but with great power comes great responsibility, I guess. So coach, just to, just to wrap it up as you, as you kind of go into May, once you actually know your roster into the summer, do you set it up as certain goals? Do you want to attain in the off season as you get ready to have people come back on campus? Are there certain things you kind of set forward to accomplish? You know, I think, you know, obviously for sure with our strength and conditioning and in the summer that there's probably more goal oriented there, you know, but I, I think I have found like, even, you know, you might have a picture of what type of team you have and what those goals are in the back of your mind. But, you know, I think even for us this past year, like those things can really change a lot once you've had a significant injury to, you know, a key player, or, you know, we saw through a lot of our injuries and illness that it was going to impact us greatly. So I think for us, we still have the mentality, let's get better every single day. Let's put our head down, let's do the right thing, let's work. And when you do those things, I think those big picture goals and, and when you come to a Maryland and Monica knows this, like it's to win championships, it's to cut down nets, it's to get to final fours and beyond. So, you know, we understand the expectation. I mean, I understand it as a coach, you know, we want to do it year in and year out at, at a really high level. But I think when, when you, when you do it day to day and, and you're trying to win every single day, then I think it's a byproduct of, you know, to prepare you for what lies ahead. No doubt about it, coach. Thank you so much for your time. Really enjoy you joining Monica, myself on the junior NBA coaches corner podcast. Thanks a lot. And good luck as you go in the off season. Awesome. Thanks for having me. I really appreciate it. Thanks coach. Thanks for listening. Make sure to join Monica and Dallin each week on the junior NBA coaches corner. For more go to juniorNBA.com or wherever your favorite podcasts are found.