The New Rules of Executive Wealth: Clarity, Control and Choice

Good morning. I think we're ready to get started. A few more people joining us. Welcome. Take a seat anywhere. Okay, great. Thanks, everyone, for being here. My name is Claire Zellman. I'm a senior editor with Fortune. And really excited about this panel. This is the new rules of executive wealth, clarity, control and choice. And we have a great group of very enthusiastic speakers, I have to say, to lead the conversation today. and you're going to meet them in just a moment, but before I get started, I just want to thank our great partners at Fidelity for hosting this session. We really appreciate your partnership in helping make this conversation possible. This is meant to be, I mean, you've been in a few of these now, right? This is meant to be a group discussion, so please just feel free to chime in, raise your hands. We have a microphone up here that will be run to you when you raise your hand, And please just feel free to jump in, and I've encouraged my panelists to do the same. And a reminder that this session is on the record. Okay, let's get started with our discussion leaders. We have Mitra Best, founder and CEO of Avra. Anna Maria Nikoranik, CEO and co-founder of Align Private Capital. And right next to me, Carla Vallis, head of private wealth management at Fidelity. So welcome. Thank you so much for joining us all. So I'm just going to kind of talk big picture here, set the stage a little bit before we dive in. Women are expected to be the biggest winners of the $124 trillion Great Wealth Transfer taking place between now through 2048. Just incredible. In addition to inheriting wealth, of course, we are earning it ourselves through taking part in liquidity events and through equity compensation. There's a lot of money in the room, right? We're earning it. But we're here to talk today about how women can feel more confident and empowered to manage that money. So I wanted to start with a poll of the room. How many of you feel really confident in your investing right now? A couple of hands. Okay. And how many of you are here to gain that more confidence, gain more information? I'll put myself in that category. Yes. Okay. And how to take more ownership of your wealth. So I want to start with you, Ana, and help us help kind of set the picture and talk about these big macro events that women are at the center of that's really prompting the conversation we're having today. Sure. So I just got out of a couple of sessions where they talked about women in power. and it's my belief that the power is about to really shift so as claire mentioned where the next two decades are going to be this great transfer of wealth and for women this means something like 52 to 84 trillion dollars and most women are not the women that initially raised their hands in here and have the background to really be ready to receive this and to know what to do. And so it's kind of a personal mission of mine right now to assist women to learn the skills that they need to make the decisions with this money because we can change the world with it. We have a perfect storm because it's not just this wealth transfer. What we're seeing is this acceleration of super talented women reaching higher levels of organizations, getting higher comp, and getting stock. In addition to that, as you've heard in the room today, there are also women that are taking board seats, getting massive wins when small portfolio companies are being sold. These windfalls need to be planned for. This money is sometimes it becomes a stepchild to the core business or to the core role women have, and that needs to change going forward. Great. And Mitra, do you want to just talk about sort of the, I mean, we're in this huge moment of in the AI economy, you see these companies, you know, getting acquired, going public, their valuation is just skyrocketing. What does that mean to for how we women fit into that conversation? Yeah, so I'm not in wealth advising capacity. I'm an investor. I'm an AI scientist. I started this Fintech Avra because of the perfect storm of the women have never held this much wealth in the history of time. And what we're doing with that wealth is a little bit imbalanced. With the AI economy, we see, I don't know, a dozen people making all the choices for where the future is going to be. what companies are going to get funded, what technologies are going to get funded, what problems are going to get solved. And here we have this massive amount of capital that Ana just talked about, 53% of it unmanaged. And for me, that's the perfect storm to get more women engaged in investing in the sectors that are going unnoticed because of the distraction towards the few people that are making the decisions about where the money goes. Who writes the checks funds the future. And I've explored the sectors that represent the building blocks of the future that we actually want to live in, and I've seen an abundance of great ideas that would benefit from AI and accelerated AI in those problem-solving areas that are really underfunded. So to me, this is the perfect opportunity for us to get more involved in, be more engaged. We have more agency in learning about these companies, learning about investing, learning about how we could put our wealth in motion for our families and for our future. And so Carla, obviously the opportunity is huge right now. do you have a sense of kind of what sometimes holds us women back from taking full advantage of it or some of the hesitancy that that um like like Anna said that makes you know wealth management sort of like wealth management the stepchild in our lives yeah so we've had a lot of conversations and just in terms of prepping and getting to know each other and kind of where we come to this conversation not to mention we started on at one o'clock yesterday attending another conversation about wealth and influence. And all of the sessions along the way, whether they had a wealth or a money kind of component to it, I've picked up nuggets that really are very applicable to the moment that we have right now. Even Emma just talked about kind of knowing what lane you're going to play in. The lady from Latrice, from Sam's Club, she talked about curating. She's listening to the consumer to curate what the client, the customer wants. And from my perspective, I'm only in this role as head of wealth management for a couple of years now, but it's an amazing situation when I look out at most audiences and we look at most lead clients and I look at most lead advisors. It's a lot of men in the front seat, so to speak, and one of the things that we measure for our own advisors to ensure that we're doing all the things that we know we can be doing to have an impact and to help people achieve growth through their lifetimes and optimize their blood, sweat, and tears from the paycheck or the investments or the inheritance, I suppose. One of the things we measure our associates on or our advisors on is engagement. And I'd love to flip that conversation. All of us need to measure ourselves on our level of engagement. So meeting with your financial advisor, if you have one, one time a year, that's your choice maybe. That's not the advisor not being available that might be a function of that they you know where do you you know fall or they're responding necessarily to your engagement and interest level or you're delegating that to your someone else in the household or you're just completely sitting on your hands not doing anything about it because you're so tied up with your day job and that's a reality for most of us we are so busy that taking the time for yourself but like Emma said You've got to kind of staff up and you have to make the time. This conversation, I would like to be a little provocative, is actually working so hard night and day, putting kids in child care, doing all the things we've done, all the sacrifices, maybe in the beginning to make money. And now we just love what we do so much that we're just not even really maybe doing it for the money. But yet we're making money. We're compounding it. The growth that all of you are having in your tenure and where you are in your careers in this fabulous room, it's multiplying. it's quadrupling, it's compounding, and yet it may be off, unmanaged or uninvested, and you have agency. Think of the change you can do. So we talked to Anna about what do you want your money to do? And that's it. That's part of it. It's having a plan, but also getting engaged and understanding your options and making your advisors or those that are helping you. Ask them, what can I rely on you for? That's a question I would ask. It's asking more from, it's not what your country can do for you it's not what you're what you can do for your advisor they're working for you so ask them what questions aren't i asking so again it's a skill up type of moment you're fabulous at what you do during the day you know the bottom lines and the P&Ls and the money matters in your own companies how are you doing for yourselves sorry i'm really no i was saying when i said they're enthusiastic i wasn't joking um and how do you i mean you've had i'm sure you know women that have really made that switch to go from earning the money focus on earning the money to managing the money i mean what has been key to like really kind of having a new mindset when it comes to um wealth and and what to do with it i think there's a ton of information i think first of all every advisory firm in the nationally is getting in on this game and then you have the whole kind of the philanthropic um players coming into this everybody's trying to help everybody with their money. So there's a ton of information. I think the young people, I was with a young woman the other day, last week in New York, and she was telling me how she was self-directed. She's something or other at the company that she works for, and she was telling me how she's become the go-to person in her friendship group from college for financial matters. She's self-directed, so that means that she's reading everything she can and making choices, whether every day, she's not a day trader, but she's definitely reading, reading things and making decisions. She's not working with an advisor yet. She has three kids. She has a husband who works. They have no financial plan. So she's doing one piece of that puzzle, but she's not doing the other. But the good news is she's a go-to person in her network. She's become an influencer and they're talking. We have conversation starters at the table. How often do women have money conversations? Men do it all the time and we aren't leaning into that conversation because some of us lack confidence or confidence on the topic but there's no better time to start than now and somebody's got to start the conversation well it's funny you say that because i am famous or infamous for you know which one of telling people about the five different kinds of magnesium every time i get together and it's like the the standard branded you know discussion and when we get together we talk about you know we trust each other women listen to each other about oh you know i'm i'm using this doctor i'm using this supplement or i'm taking this class or i'm using this um you know child care facility whatever it is and we don't ever talk about money we don't ever talk about what we're doing with our portfolios we don't even talk about the future of our financial planning for our families so it's it's the present we're not talking about when about you know the finance we're not talking about our agency in creating the future either in wealth and in funding the companies and the and and the founders that need we spend 80 of the decisions for consumer spending is done by women, all of us. We sit around and talk about the things we buy and all of that, but so few of us make the investment decisions. And I actually read a Fidelity study last night. This just popped into my feed that women, although they invest less frequently, but their results are 40 basis points better than men. So I was like, I'm going to use that tomorrow because that's really cool. And I think the psychology is not, we're told we're not competent or confident or, listen, I left my very cush executive amazing dream job a year ago and I'm known to be an advocate for women. Everyone who knows me or knows of me knows that. Had leadership programs, advocacy programs at XYZ. there's nothing wrong with us we don't need more confidence or more competence or more anything we just need more time that's one thing i know we do need more of but we just think about life differently we we approach things differently and this structure was not optimized for us so i love that we're here together to talk about how we can navigate that labyrinth and and figure out, how do we have more agency and become more engaged to Carla's point? And I know, Ana, you have, you know, you started by saying this is your mission to get more women to, you know, invest more and be more empowered. So part of my journey is that 20 plus years ago, I had been in the corporate world in venture capital and private equity. And I found out that my mother was dying of cancer. And I decided to take personal time off to take care of her. And when I did that, that's where this journey for me began. Because I realized she hadn't optimized and she needed help. And then as I was helping her, people who knew me started reaching out to me saying, I know this family. They have a daughter. In one case, there was a 93-year-old father with three daughters in their 60s. He had had a stroke and he had 139 private investments. the girls had never been educated on anything and they were about to have this incredibly complex portfolio come to them and I started work one of them was a kindergarten teacher I started working with them trying to explain okay this is what you have this is what it means in layman's terms like it was so easy to explain some of the stuff but the industry creates a whole language around it it is really off-putting that I became engaged with another family and another family. So I gained an expertise in working with women that had somewhere between nine and 10 digits. And from that, I ended up starting my own business. But I have never left this mission behind. And what I will tell everybody in this room, you are in this room because you are a brilliant leader. What does that mean? That means you know how to pick and manage a team. That's what this is. It's about creating a team for yourself that's very sophisticated. And I'm going to quote somebody else who was on stage. It's about having a beginner's mindset. Ask questions. Do not be afraid to ask questions. It seems daunting when you look at the financial industry between the language that's been created around it, between the complexity of the financial instruments. But at the end of the day, you don't need to be the expert. You need to be able to pick the expert. You need to be able to do what you're doing in your everyday job, just in a different area. And I know everybody's capable of doing this because after two years, I had a woman who was a kindergarten teacher managing a very large nine-digit portfolio. It's not that hard, but it takes the first step. The other area that I'm really passionate about is teaching our daughters. I'm going to shout out Seema in the back, who also is passionate about this and brilliant about it. But our daughters need to know the basics. I spoke to somebody last night and I said, I've been reading about how the mind develops, and the way the mind develops is up until eight or nine, it doesn't really matter what you tell your kids, because their minds are not wired to listen, but they're wired to watch. So your kids are trained from day one to watch what you do. You become the role model for all of your daughters about being able to manage capital, understand what's happening. And I'll leave you with this crazy story. I've been on a journey, I have 20-year-old twins, and I've been on this journey for a while trying to teach them. And when they were very young, they got an allowance. They had to go work, they had to make money. And a couple of things happened with that money. They had to save and invest some of that money, and they were taxed on that money. So some of the money was taken from them, and they were like, why are you taking money away from me? I'm like, well, the government's going to take money away from you. And, you know, you're only going to have this net. They now understand that. I also had them, the minute they got a real job, I'm like, I don't care what they think they're inheriting or not inheriting. You go form a Roth IRA, all right? You become in charge and empowered. And I have never seen someone who, when you give them responsibility, they don't stand up and try to make the best. Well, I think we can talk, Carla, sort of going back to your point where we're talking about getting started, you know, or if you're in this room and you do feel some level of confidence, how to kind of take it to the next level. And you mentioned this idea of like, what can your money do for you? What do you want your money to do for you? I mean, what questions do you ask yourself when you're trying to make that decision and sort of strategize about where you're going to put your money and the team you're going to build? I mean, can you talk about like the very novice investor? Where do you start? Yeah, this is and this is where an advisor can really help walk you down that path and ask you the question. So there's all types of resources that the advisors themselves have. But they're going to be super curious. And it's going to take time for you to really reflect on the conversations. All the people that are on these leadership panels today have really, really thought and they have a self-awareness. But they've not just prepared for today. I mean, Emma wrote an entire book that if you've read it, you can actually see how she's evolved during the time. And so you can have a plan for today, but it might change. And so you have to revisit that plan. But it starts with sort of like, what do you wish for? Some of us have been triggered by certain situations in our life. And I'm not just talking about philanthropy, but, you know, what are your goals and dreams? You all have, you're in this room, you've all had parents, you've had your parents, you've watched your parents, you've role modeled, like, what did they want for you? What did they want their money to do for you all? Probably some version of education was a priority. So after, at a certain point, you've filled up certain buckets, then you have more disposable income and you're making money and it's multiplying. And now you have real flexibility in your money situation and it starts really multiplying. We have a ton of sudden wealth-type people, whether they've sold a business. That's a whole new reckoning. Entrepreneurs are very interesting when they have those windfalls or those events. They actually are just shocked. By now, what do I do? Even 88-year-old mothers like mine, she doesn't understand how she makes money every month without working and how all of her investments or the dues that she's paid is now causing her to have to pay taxes. But that's something that, again, we model out all of that. So it starts with a conversation. It starts with your team. And back to the competition, there are great advisors all around the nation. You don't necessarily, we would love to be primary advisor to all of our clients, but we know some of them are working with other advisors, and we love that because if you have another advisor, it's fantastic because they may be bringing some information to you that is different than what the other advisor is. And then you have to say to yourself, why? If one advisor is only bringing certain information to you, is it that because there's a limitation in your qualifications of your advisor, their expertise, their own journey to keep growing in their practice? Do you have an advisor who's sort of aging out or even kind of culminating and they're tired of learning new tricks? There's new tricks coming all the time, new devices, as leaders of companies, role modeling back to, you know, having what kinds of conversations are you having with your associates, your youngest, I don't mean to say youngest, but your youngest, most entry level employees, how are you investing in them so that they can have a financial journey day one when they start that first paycheck. And the benefits programs were involved with many of you on the benefits side of the house, you have incredible benefits, but those are just kind of check the box you really need to start that level of engagement from day one why am i investing in the 401k plan where is that financial education how can i get the help that i need so again it starts with a conversation and the first question i don't know but you you can sort of um work with someone or each other this is like people have book clubs where's our financial you play mahjong together you know where what are they what are you people ladies talking about. Most women in a certain age group are now talking about financial issues because they're now responsible. Who's an eldest daughter in the room? Wow. I'm the third, I'm the baby. So, but the eldest daughter persona is actually a persona right now where we need to work with you, not for your own situation and your next gen, but for your G1, your parents generation. And some of you might even have grandparents that are still involved and there's a money situation whether they need help because they didn't plan or whether there's an inheritance that needs to be dealt with and then there's all the stakeholders again that's where you need to understand the plan for their money too because again you have a responsibility when you're an inheritor forget when you make it yourself and you're on your own and for you know women in the room who are maybe more sophisticated investors there's a lot of sort of choice not a lot of choice these days a lot of more alternative investments that are available I mean how do we how do you go about deciding if that's the right thing for you and obviously there's trade-offs to those as well, sure there's risk but again that's where we we have there's alternative investments is it's the democratization of alternative investments is here and now and many of you can afford to be to have some sort of a component of your portfolio allocated to that if nothing else to be on a learning journey so you don't need to invest a thousand hours of your own time to get smart on alt x or cryptocurrency there are professionals out there that can help you there are CliffNote versions but start small and get to know the asset and then talk about it and understand the risks because again you can't completely outsource your risk management all advisors have duties and responsibilities but and you need to be qualified to be in that game but certainly be aware that it's a choice and that people like you are doing it um don't and that's the other question i would ask just like when you go to a doctor do you say like if you're if you're having a really serious situation for yourself for your child or your parent and you've never been in this type of you know diagnosis before of course everybody's got that first situation you're not expected to be knowledgeable about diagnosis x so what do you say i have a i have a situation where i have a child that i deal with on this every day and i say so what do parents like me ask about what questions do am i supposed to ask you medical professional you know boston biggest hospitals best hospitals most experienced what do parents like me ask about that i don't know enough to ask about because they're there on the clock they got the next client coming their next patient is much as serious and committed if you don't ask that question you're actually leaving their value on the table and you're not leaving you know where's their reliability yeah demand more from your people i'm curious as to everyone there was a there were a lot of hands raised that you feel really comfortable managing your wealth i would love to know from you guys what questions can we answer for you what is top of mind for you because you've got broad wealth management and then you've got kind of alternative assets over here. And I will say, from the first time I attended this conference, I met this fabulous woman who's based in San Francisco, and then I ended up in an angel network as a result of it. And I run a fund for my day job. So I think... Yeah, we'll give her the mic, Brenner. I feel like I'm pretty good at managing my wealth, but then as we're talking, I'm like, maybe I'm not as good at it. I mean, overly confident. But you had mentioned, you know, planning for these exits, right? And that this takes planning. And then we talked about wealth advisors. And from where I sit anyways, I must get, I don't know, 20 inboxes, LinkedIn and emails for wealth advisors. And I took one, you know, meeting and I got the ick. And I'm sure it's like therapists, you know, you need to try out a few of them to find the right fit. But what are the things that is there a quick set of questions when you're evaluating a wealth advisor when you're planning for this type of um you know future scenarios that you should be asking about to identify who's good and who's going to probably not be great for me i'll start and then pass it over to you so i i think it's not just about the wealth advisor you need to look at the accountant you need to build your team you need an accountant you need a really good trusted estate person And then I think a lot of it is understanding what you want. Carly said it very well earlier on. Understand what you want and ask them what they can do for you that nobody else can do. Because at the end of the day, part of the problem with the industry is everybody's trying to sell you something, right? The question is, do you want to buy? You are buying something when you do this because there's going to be a fee associated with it, right? You need to ascertain whether or not you're getting your money for that fee, right? Who's going to deliver the best service? And I think it's about interviewing people in terms of capability, getting references in terms of capability, but it's also, you know, do you like working with this person and do you trust them, right? Like, that's a big deal. And I think to add to that, because I actually work with a number of wealth managers, because I have different interests and I find the ones that are specialized in the particular area. You know, here I have someone for sports, I have someone for, you know, AI, I have some, you know, spread around. And I feel like when I, what really works for me is if they, if I know how to articulate my need and if I can get a handshake on that, because the ick that you talked about, I have gotten ick in spades like I can't even tell you the ick factor outweighs the you know happy factor and it's because they just they're not seeing me they're not hearing me and they're just like you said selling whatever so finding someone who's a partner with you like we've said you know a team Someone who can hear you, see you, and be able to deliver and have the humility to say, you know, maybe this is not part of our offering. Because the wealth advisors, they don't have access to everything. They get what the CIO gives them, right? So maybe that's not in their basket. And having someone that is open enough to say you need a specialist for that I think is important. And let's have Sirma, maybe you can answer that question a little at the end? Oh, answer. I was going to ask a question. Yeah, I will, but I have a question actually very relevant to what you said, and it is health and wealth are connected. So we learned that all health research was done on men, right? And only recently we've started to say, hey, there's women, we exist, menopause and all that. How do you think the investing world and the advisory world have to change to accommodate the woman, whether it's a woman in partnership with somebody or the single woman who is the breadwinner. So how is the paradigm needing to change? Who writes the checks builds the future. And as long as we are not participating and asking for those assets to invest in showing up with our 124 trillion dollars you know or whatever it might be that's not going to happen now okay it's shifting a little bit but that is one of the sectors when i said earlier i you know explored these sectors to see which are the building blocks of the future women's health and longevity and wellness is a huge one we are living you know 10 to 20 years longer than men but unfortunately in poorer health who's interested in living a lot of years and and not living in health i'm not so i but i do want to live long so i'm going to make sure that i'm healthy and that you know all of that but how do you have access to that and that's one of the things that Carl and i were talking about before um we came on on on stage was about this the opportunities for private companies and private assets that are actually looking at solving these problems there's a lot of noise in the system so you have to be super careful i'm not i mean that's probably a wrong thing to say to our group to be super careful because we are um but i think it's really important to be circumspect to be really um thorough with your research with your observations with your references talk to people talk to your wealth advisor talk to everybody to find out what those opportunities are because if we don't invest in women's health nobody else is going to and then we're going to still receive the one percent of the entire health research and you know the just a little tidbit that i learned the menopause research is on rats do you know that rats don't menopause so yeah so that whatever yeah carla you mentioned i mean just having more women in this conversation in in this space um and being able to curate then the offerings to meet that demand right i mean that's kind of yes what we're missing we might be missing we might be missing because again we listen very carefully to our clients and the demand and every conversation that you're having with an advisor are in private wealth management or in you know our mass affluent or our executive population we provide fidelity provides amazing executive services financial advice to as a company benefit to many of the companies that are represented here so as a young employee as a new entrant you might not get that but as a mid-level you know where the money is starting to accumulate where you have stock options where you you have your 401k, and then you have your outside pot of money and you're buying your house, which is an investment. And then you have your charitable nest egg and your 529. We are working very holistically with people at every step of that journey. And so it's really important for us to be 360 degree knowledgeable of your conversation. But even if you're working with outside advisors, we inventory all of that. So then we have conversations and typically the lead client, if you went to our Salesforce system, the person that started the relationship is typically a male. And then, of course, with our executive services population, there's plenty of working women, and they can bring in their spouse to the conversation. But all of our notes go into the verbatims that all of our leadership reads. And where we check boxes and say we have a gap in our product offering, or we had to refer this client to an outside provider because they needed this because we're always going to do what's in the best interest of the client even if we don't have a certain thing if there's a gap in our offering we're going to educate you about that and that's what a good financial advisor does we're going to say you really need this based on your facts and circumstances based on your wishes based on your plan for the future and all of the things we know about you we know you need this and right now we don't offer that you know we don't have a long list of that stuff but nonetheless there may be something that at this moment fidelity may be you know not there yet and other people maybe have put their toe in the water but fidelity has been the first on a lot of you know innovation with with regard to dealing with your financial complexity and pioneering and who better than a company with all of that research and access to it but that's what i would say it's it's um you've got to be in the conversation to give us the feedback just like when you go to sam's club and you like your lollipop lamb chop lollipops. How is Latrice, the CEO of that company, ever going to know what's missing from her shelves or what's missing from your experience? That's the other thing. So again, women love to convene and women do the best. So that's a conversation that if we don't see it and we can't bubble that up, somebody's got to innovate. And we try to innovate real time. And it takes one conversation that you have because you're on your fifth or 10th meeting with your advisor because you're super engaged, that's again, not my associate or my advisor's problem. That's an all of us problem because we're choosing to cancel the meeting, not show up, multitask when we're in the meeting, not really listen, not ask the advisor, what questions haven't we asked for session 32 of the year? What books are other women like me reading? What conference should I go to? I mean, it's literally, you have to take the bull by the, you have to be responsible and accountable if you want to optimize. The industry is not going to change until we change. Why would it? If we show up passively once a year to a meeting and don't ask really difficult questions, and we just look once a year at our accounts, there's no need for the industry to change. That was the golden nugget. Like, seriously, that should be framed. We have a question. Hi, I'm Beth. Books would you recommend for people to read, to become more informed and strategic. I am a customer fidelity and I have a female advisor. And another question is what percentage in your wealth management are advisors women? So I'm curious about that. But, you know, I have read books. I've tried to get over the fear associated with money, tried to become informed on what to ask. And so what do you recommend in that space that I should read to become more informed? Like, I don't know how to actually engage on private investments i've never done that before no one's taught me how to do that i have a lot of money but i'm afraid of it so i need help so we have a number of advisors in the room we have Mandy Sipioni who's on the CFP board you know the number of CFP with female male to female at this point or i don't mean to put you on the spot yeah and the latest number that i saw with 77% men, male advisors nationally, not at Fidelity. And we're doing our part to try to keep more of our young women associates who come through our talent pipeline engaged in the process, but inevitably there are choices that people, women make in a career path, but we are really trying to be as progressive as we can be to attract women to the profession. But this concept of sales, at Fidelity, it's not a sales job in any way, shape, or form. We and that's where I think some of that awareness of what the role is and what it is not. It's a partnership. It's a relationship. Your EQ skills have to be higher probably than your technical. But we are forging and supporting both. I would say, you know, we we heard about die with zero. There are other you know, we have all kinds of programming and educational curriculum, which is more nuggets podcast. Alex Rocha runs our Smart Women Talk Money program where there's all kinds of resources available, but I'm not sure. Do we have any other book that comes to mind that would help people with overcoming fear or getting started? Yes. It goes back to the psychology of money and women, right? And the psychology of money for women is very different. We're generalizing, but we can do that because we're women. It's very different than for men. I mean, think about this. I'm sure you've read the studies about how women don't apply for positions if they're not 100% or 120% qualified. But our counterparts will see a keyword and they're like, yeah, I've got this. And they get it and they get the job, right? So we have shied away from the private markets, and we can talk about that offline, because it's so opaque, it's so convoluted like you talked about, and it's in this tight network of who knows who, and we don't talk about it while we're talking about magnesium, and the minimums are too high, and then da-da-da-da. and we have we want to know everything about the decision that we made but actually many of the women at this conference were once were working for a company that was once private so their biggest body of energy and capital was in their own private company that's true really many of the women here have been in or you're buying private companies in your day job but yet you're not investing it through your whatever kind of opportunity or nest egg you are that's right and And I actually gave a talk a couple months ago, and I said, here we are. And it was to like 150 women at the New York Stock Exchange. And I said, you know, we've reached the CEO levels. We've, you know, take care of our kids and our parents and the kids' pets and everybody at the same time. And we've managed. And in-laws. Yeah. And the community. We do all of this stuff. And we have, yes, we work harder. We talked about that. We work harder to get into these positions in corporate structures that were not designed for us. All of that. But then there's this like gated community we haven't crashed yet. And that's that sort of. But we don't want to come back next year and have the same conversation. No, we don't. We don't. So. I would also say one thing here. Emma said it in the session and I wrote it down. You are never ready. you are waiting to be ready yeah you're way too late yes yeah I'm sorry we have to wrap we have to wrap it up so I'm so sorry um we're gonna head back to the main stage in just 10 minutes but thank you so much I really feel like the just talk talk a lot of these questions I feel like you get a lot of the answers talking to your friends about money you know what book are you reading who's your advisor etc and I hope that you can all walk away from this like having a little bit more. Grab the conversation cards. Use them tonight or tomorrow and have those conversations. And then if you have any follow-up questions at our booth, please give us your name. We'll try to send you a reading list. Let me just thank one more time Fidelity for hosting this panel and for all of our speakers for just shining some light on this topic and for you for asking such a smart question. Thank you so much.