Michael B. Jordan and Ryan Coogler Talk Creating Black Panther and Reuniting for Fifth Film, Sinners

You got to love the energy. They love you. Come on. That's what I'm talking about. Michael. Michael, welcome back. Ryan Coogler, it's your first time here, so I want to make sure you're having a good time. Are you used to this applause? No, I'm not. No, I think that was for him. No, no, no. You, too, man. Let me give you some info on Ryan Coogler, by the way. Your first movie, Fruitvale Station, won many awards, including top awards at Sundance. Then you made Creed a giant blockbuster. Your next movie was Black Panther. Come on! A movie to be Oscar-nominated for Best Picture. Then you made Black Panther Wakanda Forever! Ryan Coogler! I'm so happy that's correct. Yeah, because you hate compliments, so I love this. Oh, I love it. That's perfect. Oh, I'm so sorry to embarrass you. All of these have something in common. Michael B. Jordan is in every one of these films. Is that the secret? What makes you want to work with Michael B. Jordan? I mean, look at him, man. No, he's an incredible performer, bro, and a consummate professional. You know, and when you're filmmaking, bro, chemistry is important. I'm sure you've worked with a lot of your crew for a long time. I've seen my homies from Philly to Roos here. They got a chemistry. And if you find a connection, you know, you got to keep that in the industry like art. Yeah, and you feel the same way, Michael? I mean, if it ain't broke, don't fix it, you know what I'm saying? But no, man, we are like-minded, you know what I'm saying? Do you have a shorthand on set? Yeah, it's kind of crazy. Sometimes we don't need to really talk too much, you know what I'm saying, because I kind of know exactly what he's looking for, what he needs. How do you feel? Yeah, it's just kind of like, you know, the cadence and rhythm of being on set and making movies and making scenes, and I kind of, you know, I'm always observing him and seeing what is he anticipating. How can I make his job? How can I make his day easier? You know what I'm saying? How can I get ahead of it? Because usually we're behind on time. You know what I'm saying? We're trying to make our days, which is a tough thing to do in the film industry. You got to stay on time, stay on budget. Yeah, and we're just always trying to, like, make things efficient and try to get better each day. So, yeah, we got a crazy schedule. When Ryan calls you for a project, is it an immediate yes? Pretty much, yeah. It's like a yes, and then, all right, let me read it. And then I ended up reading it pretty quickly and be like, all right, cool, let's get to work. Let's do it. Right, is that how it happened? In general, you know, it's been different every time. Mike's gotten a lot more busy since we got an order, so I try to be cognizant of his time, and this time is a little bit different. Yeah, a little bit. I actually, I was calling him to pitch him a project, and he was like, oh, man, that's cool, that's cool, that's cool, but, hey, I've been working on something. How about this? Wow! Flipped it around. Flipped it on me, and I was like, all right, this is pretty cool, let's do this, let's do this. Did you even get to pitch your idea? A little bit, a little bit. We got time, we got time. No, definitely, but he gave me some ideas and some pointers on that one, but that one's still in the tuck. We're gonna get to that one. But, yeah, this one was the most important one and really, really personal for him, so I wanted to make sure I was available. I remember last time you were on the show, you were telling me how great, what a mentor he was, so you're like, helping you when you're directing. You asked him, I know you hate compliments, but I figured I'd throw one more in there. About to get up out of here. No, sorry about that. I gotta say, I saw Sinners, it's unbelievable. I would suggest go see it in IMAX, because it's just gorgeous and it's a big movie, and it's really, I don't know how you did this. I've seen it done before, but you play your twin brother. You play a cross opposite of yourself, but it's a new technology that actually looks like you're two different actors. It's very well done. Thank you, thank you, thank you so much. How in the heck did you do that? How'd you do it? We got a brilliant visual effects department. Our head of VFX, Michael Rowland, and our VFX producer, James Alexander, had developed a lot of excellent technologies for us. But a lot of times, it actually is Michael on the other side of it. We were filming things twice using a technology called a techno dolly, where we do repeat passes. You have to act as one character, and then go get changed, we'll find something else to cover. We couldn't move the camera. We'll find something else with the other camera, and he'll come back as another character. You can't move the camera. You got to keep it mounted and wear a shirt. You won't even believe it. It looks like there's two different acts, but it's both you, it's so well done, and you're doing one little different thing, different, but I can tell you're twins. You're brothers, and I'm like, wait, this is, I know, it's hard to describe, but you actually brought a picture of one of the things that you're wearing. Is this the thing that you have to wear? It's called the halo, you know what I'm saying? This is not in the movie, by the way. They developed some new technology, some new cameras. They call it the halo that we use, and I do a pass with that as well just to get all the facial features. How do you even act with this thing on and act like it's not there? He actually did a great job, man. Yeah, Mike, you can throw him into anything, man. He'll give it his all, but I was actually astonished that he would put that on and then go through the whole scene. It's so, it's so. I'm trying to figure out which camera to stand behind to direct him. Yeah, and really, yeah. But they're so nuanced and different, but this is the first project that you've done that's not been an existing IP, it's not Marvel. This is something that you really are behind and based on people you know and your life experiences. How did you get into writing this? Well, I had an uncle named Uncle James who passed away in 2015 when we were finishing up Creed. But he was kind of the eldest male member of my family. And he was born and raised in Mississippi, but then migrated to Oakland, where I'm from, when he was in his 20s. And whenever I would hang out with him, all he wanted to do was listen to blues music on vinyl. And I came to associate that music with him. And when he passed away, whenever I wanted to think about him, I'll find a blues track to play and I'll kind of conjure his spirit, you know, by listening to it. And so, you know, when we were looking for a movie to do, you know, after Panther, I wanted to do something original. I wanted to do something only I could make. So I got into this as a love letter to him. And when I started to research it, I realized that there's an argument to be made that Delta Blues music is America's most important contribution to global popular culture. That music is in everything that we listen to us and everything that we like today. And I realized that if I made it a genre film, you know, we can make the biggest movie possible for that art form. And that's what we did. But putting that music, that music is great by the way. Who is the kid that, the young kid? Miles Kane. Yeah, his voice is incredible. He has a great, like regular speaking voice, but when he sings, it just turns into something else. There's a scene where he's playing in the car with you and he's like a slide guitar and he's playing on that national, whatever that awesome guitar is. And he's like, and he learned how to play the guitar for this role. Like, it was insane. He starts singing and your face, you're like, no! And I was like, yeah, that's how I'm feeling. Everyone in the theater was like, yeah, we're all feeling the same way. That kid can sing. But then, I don't know how to describe the movie because it's not really that genre. It's not just like growing up, you know, Delta and Blues music, it becomes scary. Yeah, a little bit, a little bit. It's a vampire movie. No, it gets real scary. In the first two minutes, it's a jump scare where I'm like, I'm not gonna get that. Oh my God! Oh my God, you got me, first two minutes. I know you don't like scary movies like me. I don't like scary movies. I don't like to be scared. Sorry, bro. Yeah, yeah. I'm glad you're apologizing to me because I was apologizing to you. No, no, no. No, you scared me and then it got scarier. In the end, I mean, we all see it. Yeah, but it gives you moments to laugh. You know what I'm saying? It's a huge musical component to it. It's a great story, though, too. Family story, brother story, gangster story. You know what I mean? Dude, it's full on gangster. Yeah, you want to make a full meal of a movie, bro. That's what we wanted you to call it. It really feels like a real movie. It's unbelievable and it feels expensive. Yeah, but that's why we want to go see a real movie. It's really great and I want everyone to see it and laugh and love it and get scared and enjoy it, go with friends. But before we show a clip, you guys are doing something very cool. You got tickets for everyone in this audience to go see Sinners in theater. Sinners, take a look. You've been in and out of here all day. You never need to invite them. Yeah, something ain't adding up. Can I at least get my money? Careful.