Raise Nature-Loving, Screen-Free Kids with Emily Rokser

Let's say you want to read a really good book to them about amphibians, but they've never held a frog in their hands, or they've never found a toad in the woods. You know, they really need that experience in order to make these things meaningful to them. Welcome to Our Life Homeschooling. My name is Sherry, Christian, wife to my high school sweetheart Nelson, and thankful mom to ten incredible kids. I'm the author of the blog and YouTube channel Our Life Homeschooling, where I share homeschooling encouragement for everyday moms. I believe that motherhood is ministry, and homeschooling is simply an extension of parenting. My passion is to cheer on other moms who are at home doing the most important work of all, raising the next generation for the glory of God. Welcome to the Our Life Homeschooling podcast. Today's guest is Emily Roxer from the Curious Schoolhouse, and we are talking all about nature study, being outside, raising kids who are screen-free. You're going to love this conversation. I don't know about you, but I am so inspired this time of year to get our kids outside more. It's easier than it is in the winter, and there are so many things to observe this time of year. So, let's jump right in with this conversation with Emily. Hi, Emily. Hello. Thank you so much for joining me. I'm excited about our conversation today. You're welcome. I'm excited about this, too. Thank you for having me. Why don't we start by having you introduce yourself. Tell us about your family and about your blog and where people can find you. Yeah, so my name is Emily Roxer. I live in southeastern Wisconsin with my husband and my five kids and two guinea pigs and an unfortunate number of ticks at the moment, but that's the way it goes in Wisconsin. So we've been homeschooling since my oldest was in kindergarten, which is about eight years now, and I've been blogging for about three years, a little more than that, kind of casually, at thecuriousschoolhouse.com. I write mostly about Charlotte Mason style homeschooling. I like to write about simplifying our homeschool because I really believe that a lot of moms are often trying to do too much and it just gets too stressful. And also, of course, I like to share a lot of book lists and book recommendations of what we're reading right now. Well, I visited your blog and one of the first things that stood out to me was all that you've written about nature study and about getting kids outside and just making wise decisions with our kids with screen time. So I know this is going to be a great conversation. Let's just start by talking about why nature study is important. Yeah, so that's a great question. In our homeschools, I feel like nature study is not just important, but kind of essential. It's really a foundation to so many things and in our life specifically, I've seen it as a foundation to science, to art, and even to the Bible. So I feel like it's really foundational for any future science study because kids, especially when they're younger kids, you know, not as much for the older ones, although it's still important, but especially when they're young, they really need that hands-on experiential sensory experience, really, of what nature is before they dive into any analysis or, you know, taking things apart. Before you get into physics and chemistry, like, the little kids really need to know what a frog is and what a dandelion is. And so it's just really important for, you know, all of their future science study. Let's say you want to read a really good book to them about amphibians, but they've never held a frog in their hands, or they've never found a toad in the woods. You know, they really need that experience in order to make these things meaningful to them. And then when you think about art, I think about, like, art and music, actually. There's so many references to nature, and I think if our kids don't have this experience of what nature looks like and feels like and sounds like, it's really hard for them to fully appreciate, you know, the seasons by Vivaldi or Beethoven's Spring Symphony or like any of Monet's paintings. You look at them, and they're lovely, but what if you've never, you know, felt the snow on your face before? You can't appreciate it quite as much as the children who have. So it's really foundational even for that. And then... Yeah. Kids are so concrete at that age. They just... They are. They have to learn everything by their five senses. So if they haven't seen it or felt it or heard it, then it doesn't exist to them. Right. Exactly. And you can try to, you know, explain it to them more abstractly, but it means nothing if they don't have that actual physical experience. Yeah. And then the third reason is just for an understanding of the Bible. And if you think about all the metaphors, the allegories, the parables, and just think about how many times nature is mentioned, it's insane. It's like constantly, you know, like in the Psalms, it says he'll be like a tree planted by the rivers of water. What does that mean? And why is it important for a tree to be by the water? That's based on an understanding of nature and an experience with nature. Or you think about Jesus and he tells us to consider the lilies. How are you supposed to do that if you've never seen a lily? You don't even know what that is. So the more we can give our kids this experience and this understanding, you know, little bits here and there, every time they go outside, they're learning a little bit more. It just lays the foundation for all of these areas of study. Yeah, I couldn't agree more. Just that free time of exploration, it's exactly what kids need when they're that age. Yeah, and they don't even know that they're learning, you know, they just think they're playing and looking at things and exploring. But in the process, they're getting this massive foundation for all these subjects that will come in the future. Yes. Yeah, and that's a great way to explain it. It's a foundation for what's coming. It's just the very building blocks. So why is it worth time spending outside for you? Why is that something that you've really prioritized? Well, there's so many reasons. There's a lot of health reasons, and I'm not a doctor, so I'm not going to try to talk about all of those in detail. But I do believe it because I've seen it for myself and for our own kids, you know, physical health and mental health and emotional health, and everybody's so much happier once we get outside. It's so true. I know. It's so true. Yeah. You don't need the science to prove it. You can just see it in your own life. Yeah. But even beyond that, I've seen in my own kids that it really grows our attention span and our children's powers of observation because nature is not like a screen. It's not constantly flickering or changing or flashing new things at us. You know, it's a much more quiet, a much more subtle type of stimulation, but it really rewards observation. So the more time that our children spend looking at things and just sitting still and observing, the more there is to see. And they learn that really quickly. They start to see that, oh, wow, you know, if I just look at this flower, oh, there's an ant inside. There's a bee inside. And then it leads to all these other questions. So it really rewards that patience and, you know, just that slowing down and paying attention, which is an amazing skill for kids to have. Yeah. I think of how many times we were outside and saw like a whole colony of ants. You know, there's like a circle of black and you're like, why? Why are they all here? What are they doing? Yeah. And how many times little things like that have happened and it just generates questions. Yes. And sometimes I don't even know the answer and we just, we learn about it from looking it up or finding out or just observing, seeing what they're doing and you, you know, can kind of take your clues and figure out what they're up to, but you wouldn't see those things. You wouldn't observe them unless you have the time to slow down and be outside. Yes. And that's a key that it takes a lot of time and we don't always want to spend that time. You know, I have better things to do, but just to take the time and go outside and put our phones away and just, you know, pay attention to what we're seeing, that really does make a big difference. I have one story to share. So last December I was up in Minnesota at my parents' house with my kids and my parents have several acres and we didn't have a Christmas tree yet. So we thought, okay, we're going to go outside, we're going to cut down a Christmas tree. It'll be free. We don't have to pay for it. We'll haul it back here to us, with us to Wisconsin and it'll be great. But you know, it was early December, northern Minnesota, very cold. It was windy that day. There's several feet of snow on the ground and the kids did not want to go. And I finally said, you know what guys, you just need to bundle up and come with me. It'll be fun. We'll get our fresh air. You know, we'll get some exercise. So they did and we were checking out of the woods and we noticed a nest. So oh, side note, winter is a great time to look for nests because all the leaves are gone. So a lot of times when we're out in the winter, we will see wasp nests or birds or squirrels. It's like the best time to notice any nests. So we found one. And of course, when you see a nest, you have to try to get it down and figure out what kind of nest it is. So we pulled it down and we were looking inside of it and there was something sitting inside and I was trying to figure out what it was. It almost looked like a stick, but it wasn't quite the right shape. And I said, you know what guys, I think this might be an owl pellet. And it actually was. I couldn't believe it. But I had never found one in the wild before and it was sitting inside of a bird nest, which is really crazy. So we brought it back home and we did get a Christmas tree too, by the way. But we brought it back home and then my son ended up dissecting the owl pellet and found two complete animal skeletons inside. I could not believe it. And you know, I never would have predicted that. I never would have guessed that we would find this on our winter walk to get a Christmas tree. But because we went, because we braved the cold, because we were, you know, looking around trying to pay attention to what's around us, we happened to see the nest, happened to find the owl pellet. And it just felt like a little gift from God. It was so, so fun and so special. Oh, that's so neat. And that's something he'll always remember. Yes. And it's kind of cool that he found it himself. Yes. I mean, our kids have done in co-ops, they've done owl pellet experiments where they, you know, you order them and you take them apart, but to actually find one yourself in a nest in the wild is a completely different experience. It is. And I'm sure he'll always remember that. Yeah. It's like, wow, this is real. Like owls actually do this, you know, and here it is. Yeah. We don't just order them from Amazon. They actually do, do this in nests. Yeah. Yes, they do. Yeah. Oh, wow. So how can you get started with nature study in your homeschool? Are there just some simple ways that you began when your kids were just getting old enough to understand these things? Yeah. Great question. So we have never done anything very complicated, I would say, because I just cannot do anything very complicated. As you know, with a larger family, like life just has to be simple. So I've never used a fancy curriculum or a unit study or anything like that. Our main approach to nature study is that we go outside, we pay attention, and we try to stay curious and ask questions about what we see. And that's really all you need to get started, you know, and then you can try to answer the questions that you come up with, maybe with a book or just by talking about it or maybe Googling something, but you really don't have to have anything fancy or even have an organized plan. You know, you can just go out in your backyard and spend time, see what you see, put your phone away, that's a big one, because if I'm on my phone, my kids are not going to be paying attention to what's around them. And then when we do get out to like a different nature center or somewhere besides our backyard, that's really good, too, because in the backyard, sometimes the kids will be distracted with their toys or the trampoline, and they're not really paying so much attention to what's around them. But if we just go for a walk somewhere, maybe a simple hike, then they don't have any toys with them, they don't have anything to do really besides walk and keep their eyes open and see what's around them. So then there's even more opportunity for just noticing things, paying attention. Yeah. And I just think this is, we just finished our 16th year of homeschooling, and we have made nature study and being outside just a part of our daily life, and I've approached it very similarly. We keep it as simple as possible, it really is just a matter of observation. But I just think of where I was as a mom when we started, how many flowers I knew, how many birds I knew, compared to now, I have so much more to offer my children than I did at the beginning because we've just learned so much by being out there and being observant, looking things up when we see them, and bringing things in the house. And sometimes, I remember one time we were out in the woods, and my kids found this big round ball, and you know, right now I can't think of the name of it, but it was this big round ball that was green and literally looked like a brain. And it was very obviously a fruit, I had never seen it before. We brought it home, found out what it is, which of course I can't remember it right now, but I just, yeah, I personally have grown from just being outside with our kids and observing things. So I'm curious how you make this a part of your daily routine, your daily life. Yeah, so the simplest way to begin is just in your backyard, as we talked about a little bit. And even if you don't have a backyard, you can always look up at the sky and start by watching the weather. We were actually, this last school year, we were reading through Apologia's Earth Science book. I don't know if you've ever done that one. Yeah, we have. Yeah, it's a great one. There's a whole chapter in there about weather. And it was really fun because we would read about things and then we'd kind of pop outside and see what the weather was like at that time. And I was just thinking about this more how, you know, wherever you are in the world, even if you're in the middle of the city and you don't have any sort of yard or any green space, you've still got weather. So that's something that anyone can start with, really. And the other great thing about it is it's always changing. So, you know, you have one weather at one time, and at least here in Wisconsin, maybe not like Hawaii where I hear they have 70 degrees every day. But for us, we have different weather every single day. So there's a lot we can observe and learn just by looking up at the sky. And then another thing that has worked really well for us is to find friends to go with us, like on nature hikes or walks. Because if I have a friend coming, I am much less likely to cancel, for one thing. So I'm a lot more likely to follow through and actually do it. And our kids are more likely to enjoy it. And of course, we get a little bit of social time, too. But that's worked really well for us just to like maybe once a week or once every other week plan to meet up at a park or a nature center and just do a little walk with a friend. Yeah, that accountability really does make a big difference. I can do the same thing. If I know I'm going with someone, then yeah, then I show up and you actually do it. Yeah, I'm more tempted to say, I don't know, guys, it's really cold. I know I feel like it's. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Another thing that's helped us, too, I just wanted to mention is to get some like nature guides for your local area. So I've got a bird book for Wisconsin. I've got like a plants, flowers, trees book. And that's really helpful, too. Sometimes I'll just keep them in the van. And then when we see something, I can quick, you know, look it up and see what it is. And like you were saying, I've learned so much, you know, just by doing this or by following my kids lead, something they're interested in, too. So that's just another little thing that has helped us when we, when we go out. Yeah, those are nice. We have just a small collection, too. And we lose one of them. It's like, oh, man, because we we do use those frequently just to find things. Yes. What about nature study, nature journaling? Is that something that you include? And I know some people like they take their journals with them out into nature and that hasn't always worked for me because I feel like my kids get distracted or that it takes away from actually just observing nature. But I know I've done some people bring it in, bring specimens home and journal that way. How does that work for you? Yeah, so we haven't actually done a lot of this. We did it most consistently when my kids were younger, when I just had my three oldest boys. And it kind of started because during the winter I would take them to these indoor botanical gardens that we have here. And during the week in the morning, there's like nobody there. And it was just a really great way for us to have a little outing, get some energy out and see some greenery, which is amazing in the middle of the winter. Yeah. So we'd be walking through, you know, looking at the plants and everything. And I was trying to think of a way to get them to just sit down and pay attention a little more to what's around them instead of just racing each other like boys do. So I started bringing these little notebooks and just like a handful of colored pencils. And I would sit them down on a bench after we had walked around for a while and say, OK, guys, look around and pick one thing you see and I want you to draw a picture of it. And they would just draw a little, you know, little plant, little flower or whatever. And then I would help them to write down what it was. And that was it. That was the end of it. And then we would keep walking and we'd maybe do it once more if we needed another little break. But it was very simple. Again, no fancy supplies, but it really did help them to stop and pay attention. And another great thing about it is we kept going back to the same place. So they kept seeing these familiar plants again. And it was almost like visiting an old friend and say, oh, mom, there's that, you know, that palm tree that I drew last time. Yeah. So that was really fun and it worked really well. We've kind of fallen off doing that as the kids have gotten older and we've gotten busier. But I would like to get back into that again, you know, maybe this summer or this fall, because I think there is a lot of value to it. But at the same time, if, you know, people are in a season where they can't do the journaling as much, I would say that don't worry about it, because the nature study in itself, just getting outside and seeing these things and experiencing them, that is the more valuable parts, even if you're not able to do a lot of journaling about it. Yeah, yeah, I agree. They're learning, they're picking up on so many things. And what you mentioned about seeing how the trees change, that is something that's really interesting, too. We have some honey locust trees and a sycamore tree. And so at certain times of the year, the honey locust trees drop these pods all over the ground. Of course, it's interesting. And these are just things that you see that unless you're observant, you just think they're just things on the ground, like you just don't think about them. But the kids have been interested in them. They found out that cows like to eat them. Really? Yeah, the pods. So then they wanted to collect all these pods to find a cow to see if they would eat it. And then our sycamore trees always drop these little seed balls that are just so like powdery and dusty and just at a certain time. And it's just it's another one of those things that if you're busy, if you're rushed, if spending time outside isn't something that you prioritize, it's just totally missed. Yes, you'll never notice. Yeah, we know when to expect these things, when we're going to see them. It's just once a year. And it's it's something you only see if you're observant and you take the time. So cool. Yeah, so cool. And what you're doing is you're just giving your children more areas of interest. You know, other people who don't notice this, they never have the opportunity to become interested in these things and they don't even know what they're missing, really. Right, right. Can you give some good book recommendations that could encourage, because sometimes what you read and what you consume really can. I know for me, sometimes I just need the motivation or the kick in the pants. Yes. To do some of the things that I really do want to prioritize. But maybe it can be harder, especially in we're coming out of the winter season. So it's a great time to be outside. We're outside as much as we can be right now. But I know, yeah, definitely during other seasons, sometimes just that little bit of inspiration goes a long way. It does. Yeah. And I feel like it's also kind of confirming to me, too, because I'll think, oh, this feels like a good idea. But then when you read about it or you hear someone else say it or you actually see it in print, then you're like, oh, yes, this is a good idea. And I'm not the only person who believes this, you know. Yeah. So I thought of five. I don't know if you've read any of these. I could even pull them off my shelf here if you wanted to see them. But the first one I thought of is Balanced and Barefoot by Angela Hanscom. Have you read that one? OK, that one is mostly about like the physical and health benefits of kids being outside. Really interesting. And she does talk a lot about kids being barefoot and the benefit of that, too. So that's a really fantastic one. The second one is Adventuring Together by Greta Eskridge. Have you read that one? OK, no, Greta Eskridge. I recognize that name, but I haven't read that book. Yeah, that one's really great. And she talks mostly about just doing things with your kids. A lot of it is outdoors, but not entirely. But just how adventures and things out of your daily routine can really help to bond you together as a family and just create these shared memories. When I finished reading that one, I was very excited to do more things with my kids, which I feel like is the sign of a good book. I already do a lot of things with my kids. The third book I thought of was The TechWise Family by Andy Crouch. So this one is not specifically about getting outside, but it is about technology and just how your view of technology and screens shapes your family life. And I thought he had a lot of really fantastic points there. And it wasn't like judgy or, you know, condemnational at all. Very, very encouraging and talking about, you know, shaping your family life in a way that's focusing more on real life experiences instead of just screens, which relates very much to nature study and getting outside. The fourth book I was thinking of is Modern Miss Mason by Leah Bowden. So that one's all about Charlotte Mason homeschooling. Have you read that one? I haven't. No. I haven't read a lot of the more modern books. I feel like I was caught up in the getting meals on the table stage. I did so much reading when we were new homeschoolers. And now that I don't have a baby, I probably should get caught up on some of these. I'm familiar with that name, though. I've heard that recommended by so many people. Yeah, it's a really great book. She's kind of breaking down Charlotte Mason homeschooling into what it means for us today, you know, because Charlotte Mason lived a long time ago and some of her, the way she writes can just be a little difficult to understand or kind of feel out of touch with modern life. But yeah, she explains it really well. And she has a whole section there about nature study and the importance of it with homeschooling specifically. So that's a really great one. And then the fifth book I wrote down was Until the Streetlights Come On by Ginny Urich. Yes, she does A Thousand Hours Outside. So, of course, she's a huge proponent of all of that. And that was a really encouraging book. I really enjoyed that one, too. So how, then, have these books or just your experiences shaped some of the decisions that you've made for getting your kids outside and for limiting screen time, too? Because you mentioned that, and that can be, I know in our family, that can be something that just will, the more we're on screens, the less we're spending outside. Yes, exactly. Those two just seem to go together. Yeah, it's definitely a trade off. So the main thing we try to do is just be intentional about it. You know, we're not 100 percent screen free. We never have been. In fact, while I'm doing this right now, the kids are on a screen to keep them quiet and out of the way. But I think the point is just to be very intentional and think about it. You know, don't just automatically do what everybody else is doing around you, because you're right, it's a trade off. The more time your kids are on screens, the less they are reading a book, the less they're outside, the less they're spending time with their family or their grandparents or their friends, you know. So just thinking about that and then, um, we try to also think about with the screen time we are using, if it is consumption based or creation based. So if the things we're doing on the screen, if we are just consuming entertainments or games, you know, something that doesn't really require much brain power or creativity or imagination, or if it's something where we're actually creating something, you know, maybe we're using an art program or maybe we're writing something or maybe, you know, we're creating like my kids like to make stop motion videos, something with some little apps that they have. So I feel like that's kind of a different category and we try to make sure if we are doing screen time, at least most of it is more on the creation side versus just the consumption side, if that makes sense. We're the same way. We have three days a week where we give them an allotted time that they can just be on screens for their little video games. Like, um, some kids have games they play on my phone and then our boys have a system downstairs that they play. And on those days we still do a time limit, which is different for each child. But, um, yeah, I think there's such a big difference between entertainment type of screen time and screen time where they're like, our kids love to draw a picture, learn how to draw a picture. So we'll watch Bob Ross or someone else. They like to do art, um, art for kids, hub, stuff like that, where they're sitting and learning how to sketch this painting. Um, so there's just a big difference between that. And then mindlessly like following this little man on his quest in this video game, you know? Yes, exactly. And it's hard. It's hard as the kids get older, cause we do have to change and reevaluate, you know, what's going on. And when our kids were very little, they had basically zero screen time. I'd maybe turn on PBS kids once a day just to give myself a break. And that was it. And it was wonderful. And it was so easy. So I would say that parenting is a lot easier without screens. And if you can do that while your kids are young, it's definitely the way to go because you just eliminate all of the struggles about how much and when and what can we do and all of that. But you know, at some point they grow up and they see what their friends are doing and we have to learn how to manage it responsibly. Yeah. And I know for our older kids too, in some ways we want them to be using screens to learn how to do skills. Just like, like our one daughter who loves to bake, she is always looking up recipes and ideas of how to make her creations better. And those are advantages we do have as screens and those are skills she is learning for a purpose. So yeah, it is. I agree with you. It is harder as they get older because you, you just want them to be using them wisely and being productive with them. And it really takes some self-discipline, you know, it takes, it takes that for us as adults. It can be something that can be hard for us to control as adults. So yeah, we're just helping our older kids navigate that the older they get. Yeah, that's tricky. And like you said, we have to kind of set the example ourselves. Cause if they see us scrolling mindlessly on our phones all day, and then we're telling them that they can't do the same, that's not going to go over very well. Right. Well, thank you so much, Emily. This was a really encouraging conversation and makes me just want to go outside with our kids. It's actually a beautiful day here, a little chilly, so it's the perfect time and weather to go outside. Can you tell everyone one more time where they can find you? Yeah. So my blog is thecuriousschoolhouse.com and I'm also on Instagram and Facebook and TikTok under the same name. So you can search any of those places and I'd love to see you in any of those spots. Well, thanks again. Yeah. Thank you so much. All right. Thank you for joining us. I hope you were encouraged to put down your phone, go outside with your kids and go see something new. Observe something right in your own backyard, bring it in, find out more about it. I know that's what I wanted to do after I was finished talking with Emily. I hope this encouraged you as much as it has me. I'll see you next time on the Our Life Homeschooling podcast.