California Crime Is Shifting | Here's What's Really Happening

New data is showing violent crime, including murders, are going down in California. Now, certain other types of crime are up. Some people might argue that this data is not correct because a lot of times people don't report the crime, especially with retail theft and other kind of theft, people have given up on getting any results from the investigation so they don't report them. But in cases of the murders, there's always bodies and people tend to report them accurately. Today, we sit down with Magnus Lofstrom, who's with PPIC, who's been studying the crime data in California. He's here to tell us what he's seeing in the data. We don't want to get lost in the numbers. Yes, I'm telling you that we see the lowest number of homicides that we have in at least 40 years. That's still almost 1,700 individuals who were killed. Yes, the data broadly points towards improvements, but there are examples in the data where, yeah, we still have a way to go. I'm Siamak, welcome to California Insider. Magnus, it's great to have you on, welcome. Thank you, it's great to be here. You have been studying crime data in California and for the last 15 years, you've been seeing the trends. Can you tell us what you're seeing right now? What's happening with crime? It's good news. When we look at the most recent data that we have for the entire state of California, so that's 2024, which seems a little bit old at this point, but it takes us through 2024. What we see there is, through all the major crime offense categories, we saw decreases. We saw violent crime down by about 5%, and we saw property crime go down by about 10%. There's some preliminary data for 2025, and it points towards that's a continued trend. It keeps going down. So if you put that into perspective, how does that compare to where we've been in the past? We take property crime and the property crime rate in 2024. That's actually the lowest we have observed going back to 1960, which is as far back as we can go. So that's really fantastic. And again, 2025, these preliminary numbers suggest that it might actually be coming down a little bit more. That's a broad measure, right? That's property crime. That includes a lot of different crime. The categories that we capture with the property crime rate is it's larceny, that's the biggest category, and then it's auto theft and burglary as well. And even within those categories, we can break those down. So even larceny, we can break down into shoplifting. Shoplifting is an example of a crime that's up. It has been going up for the last few years. So we have those kind of examples. Auto theft is also up, and theft of car accessories. That's something that has been trending up since the pandemic, and that's up. So that means that there are some property crime that is going up at the same time. So that's always something important to keep in mind. I mentioned a 5% decrease in the violent crime rate. Violent constitutes of homicides, aggravated assaults, rape, and robbery, which is theft when you either use threat or you use violence. So it came down by 5%, but we're still 10% above what we were before the pandemic. And looking at those preliminary numbers, we might be back there to where we were before the pandemic. And where we were before the pandemic was low numbers. The violent crime rate, especially if we look at homicide, for example, in 2019 was one of the lowest we've seen going back at least 40 years. But then we saw something very interesting and troubling as well during the pandemic. We saw a surge in crime in 2020, and it continued in 2021. And the surge, if we look at homicides, is the one that's the most troubling, and it's the one that stands out most. In 2020, we saw the biggest increase in number of homicides that we have on record. That increase continued, like I said, a little bit in 2021. It has been coming down in the last few years. And in fact, in 2024, we observed the lowest number of homicides in California that we have going back at least 40 years. Even lower than 2019? Even lower than 2019. So here's the interesting part. If I were quoting you the homicide rate, I would say that it's slightly up in 2024 compared to 2019. But one thing that happened in California during the pandemic is we lost people. As someone reporting on California's economy and policies every week, unfortunately, I see the middle class shrinking in California. Some of it has to do with our policies, and there is another side to this that we are facing major inflation here and across the country. Unfortunately, the dollar has lost 10% of its value just this year to date. That's why more and more people are turning to real assets to protect their financial future, like physical gold and silver from American Heart Fold Gold. Unlike paper assets, these tangible investments can't be controlled or devalued by inflation or bad policies. 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And this is, we're not unique when it comes to that homicide trend. The surge that we saw in 2020 and where there was an increase that continued in 2021 is what we've seen throughout the country. Magnus, a lot of the experts, insiders in the criminal justice system have told us that homicide numbers truly represent the crime data because when there's a body, you have to call the police. Sometimes people don't report the other types of crimes. Exactly. What are your thoughts on the reports and data? How accurate are they? Homicide, as you point out, is one where we're pretty close to complete reporting. The circumstances when we don't know about the homicide, if there's no body found, for example. So those are rare circumstances. For all other types of crime, it varies quite a bit. Reporting a lot of crime is notably underreported. Sexual assault is one that we know when we make comparisons of the numbers of rapes, for example, that have been reported to law enforcement agencies to victim surveys. There's a big discrepancy there. So that's one where it's far from complete reporting. Some theft doesn't get reported either. And when it comes to theft, I think part of that is, well, what's the point? It's time and energy that goes into reporting a crime as well. So there, it's known to be underreported as well. The exception there is auto theft. And auto theft, we believe, is quite completely recorded and reported. And that's because insurance. If your car is stolen, what do you have to do? If you wanna get insurance to pay out, you have to report it to law enforcement. So is the auto theft going down? You mentioned it's going down, right? So auto theft did come down in 2024, but it's still above what it was before the pandemic. This is one of the other striking increases during the pandemic. Auto theft, it went up very notably in the first couple of years during the pandemic. It is coming down, and I'm guessing that when we have the official 2025 numbers, we're probably gonna be pretty close to what it was before the pandemic. That's interesting. And when you look at it, car accessory thefts, remember catalytic converters? You probably, most of us know of someone who's had their catalytic converter stolen. So yeah, those were increases that we experienced for a number of years. And that is also not quite down to where it was before. And part of that was the precious metals that are in catalytic converters. They surged during the pandemic. They were dealing with the supply chain and shortages. So the precious metals that were part of that became tremendously more valuable. And also used cars became more valuable during the pandemic because there was difficulty producing new cars. So that contributed to some of those trends, I think. And then there are other factors as well. One was basically sharing information on social media, how to steal certain cars and taking them for joyrides. Kia and Hyundai were hit very badly with those kinds of videos where you had basically instructions of how you could steal one of those cars. And that created a lot of problems. Based on what you're saying, the trustable data is really the murders and the auto theft to actually judge the data. And based on both of these, you're seeing kind of the numbers going back down to the pandemic. I think so. I think that's right. I think the other thing that we want to keep in mind is, yes, if we take something like car break-ins or shoplifting for that matter, what is clear is that far from all of those incidents get reported to law enforcement. What is important when we're tracking these changes and the trends, what we have to ask ourself, yeah, we know that they're underreported, but is the reporting changing as well? Is underreporting increasing or decreasing? And I think that's typically a lot of times we feel like that's probably pretty stable that the underreporting may stay relatively stable. There might be some changes, but as long as that stays stable, then we still have information from these crimes that are underreported when we see a decrease, for example. As long as it's not that people are changing the reporting, then we can attribute it to a real decrease. But it certainly is a caveat that we have to keep in mind when we're talking about these changes. And shoplifting is actually a really good example of when we might've had some changes in the reporting as well. Because people were not reporting them, they'd just given up on them. I think that there was, we can go back and we can look at 2014 when California passed Proposition 47. One of the things that Prop 47 did was it reclassified a number of drug and property offenses from felonies or wobblers. A wobbler means that the prosecutor can charge it as a felony or misdemeanors. They were now misdemeanors. So less serious, the maximum jail time you can receive for one of those is a year, right? So reclassify them. And that included theft offenses and shoplifting was created as a category that prosecutors could only charge as a misdemeanor. And what we saw when we looked at the data, largely, as I mentioned, includes shoplifting. In the immediate wake of Prop 47, we saw a decrease that indicated that, an increase that indicated an increase in shoplifting from this change in the classification. But after about a year, the numbers came back to what they were before Prop 47. So it made it really difficult to determine then, is that decrease in the number because shop owners are not reporting them anymore? And that's possible. We certainly heard anecdotal evidence from shop owners saying, yeah, there's no point doing that. So that might've contributed to what we saw in terms of the shoplifting numbers. Reverse that now, come back and we had Prop 36 in 2024 and what Prop 36 was doing was reversing some of their Prop 47 reform changes. And for one, it included opportunities for prosecutors to charge individuals for circumstances when the theft value was even below the felony threshold because they can aggregate these things. It targeted repeat offenders of these types of crimes. And there was a lot of discussion. We all remember like hearing about retail theft. We've covered it on the show. I'm sure, right? I mean, especially in 23, 24. Because people were walking out with things without any consequences. Exactly, exactly. I mean, we saw the videos and Prop 36 passed, but even before that, keep in mind that it got a lot of attention. And there was, I think also conversations about trying to tell retailers, please report all of these incidents because that will help law enforcement to figure out what to target in order to reduce this problem. And then we had the election itself. So that brought more attention to this. So we're seeing increases as I'm mentioning here. We see it continuing through 2024. What we don't know now is, is that a continued increase in actual retail theft or is it that the retailers are actually following these directives and reporting these incidents? So that's an example of where we really have to think about the underreporting. And you can think of possible kind of situations where the underreporting will change. And that makes it difficult for someone who studies crime trend to say whether it went up or down. From what we are hearing from average Californians, most people are really concerned that crime is still there. Even if we show the data, and from what you're seeing, we kind of know that murders and auto theft based on the insurance, the data is accurate. If we say to average Californians that crime is back to 2019 level, they may not believe that. What are your thoughts on that? Yeah, I mean, it's understandable. And there are a lot of things that we need to kind of keep in mind here as well. And that is, we're talking about pretty broad trends here. So even when I'm giving you like this great news about property crime being at the lowest level we've observed since at least 1960, I can still point out some crime that actually the data points towards some increases as well, right? So there are some crime that's up. And I think, again, coming back to retail theft as a good example of how we're reminded of challenges to public safety, right? We went into, you go into a CVS store, a pharmacy, a lot of stores. What happened in and during that period of time is a lot of these items were locked up now that were not locked up before. And then you wonder why would retailers lock things up? It's a costly thing to do, right? It's a headache to open up. And then it's, yes, exactly. So you don't do that lightheartedly as a shop owner, right? So I think that that was kind of like convincing to people that yeah, retail theft is up. And the data did show that, yeah, it was. It was pointing towards increases as well. So I think part of the story is that, yeah, we have seen increases in some crime. Auto theft, I mentioned that as well. If someone in our friend family group has a car stolen, we all know about it. And when that went up, we knew of a lot of situations like that as well. So there are some of those kind of things that we need to keep in mind as well. We have seen increases in some violent crime as well. While homicide is down, what we've seen is aggravated assaults increased during the pandemic as well. And it came down as well last year, but still not at the level where we were before the pandemic. So people wouldn't be wrong by pointing out, yeah, there are some safety issues here. And the other part is crime is local, that it differs. Some of these areas that we see somewhere, there's decreases. In others, we're seeing increases or that the decreases are not quite as great as they are in other area. And one example of that is Alameda, for example. Alameda County, Oakland has had very challenging times where we saw increases in violent crime and crime in general in 2023. And even though that there are efforts in place and it's coming down notably, it is still, even by 2024, if we look at overall numbers in 2024 for violent crime, it was still well above what it was before the pandemic. We look at 2025 numbers, they point towards continued decreases, but it's still, it's elevated compared to where it was before. And then you have, of course, within any particular city, there's some areas where you see more crime than other areas as well. So, you have all of these other things that are going on. And we are, of course, reminded of crime in media and social media as well. So I think that there is, yes, the data broadly points towards improvements, but there are examples in the data where, yeah, we still have a way to go. And then there are areas where we also can point to, geographic areas where we can point towards, yeah, they're still, you know, elevated compared to what they were before. There are videos, we see street takeovers, and then sometimes these people that are taking the streets, they go to a gas station or 7-Eleven and ransack and take. We've also seen jewelry stores getting robbed by people with guns. And also other examples where in the middle of the daylight, people get approached in nice shopping centers, or even Beverly Hills, there's videos of that. Do you think that crime has become more brazen, or do you think these are just examples because we see the video, something like that existed before? I think that's hard to tell if it's more brazen today than before. But certainly when you look at these videos, it appears that yes, it is in some instances, very brazen. I think that the challenge is that we didn't have that information 15 years ago. We didn't know how these various robberies happened broadly. Of course, the victims know exactly what happened during these robberies, for example. But yeah, I think the information becomes more shared, and we're all aware of these situations, and we see the brazenness as well. And of course, it's what makes headlines as well. So it's attractive from a media perspective to show these instances, and they did happen. And again, though, we can go to the data, if we looked at robberies, for example. Robberies also, we saw increases during the pandemic as well. So there was some of that going on. And then some of these circumstances, we're not sure if law enforcement would report it as a robbery. So there's a difference then if it's a robbery, if there was use of force or threat of force, right? In some of these videos that we've seen, it's a number of people who just storm in. They might smash some windows, some displays just to grab things. That might or might not be reported and charged as a robbery. That could be reported more as a retail theft, either commercial burglary, depending on the magnitude of the value that was stolen of those items, or a shoplifting situation as well. But I do think, yeah, there is some indication. We're certainly, that is being shared among us that there's a brazenness there. No doubt about that. But overall things are getting better. I think so, yeah. I think so. If we had this conversation a few years ago, I wouldn't be as optimistic because I would have been reminded of those increases at that time. And I would have shared that with you. And I've written about this and I pointed out that there are some troubling things that we saw in the data that we should pay attention to. But when I look at it today, I would say that, yeah, it's mostly encouraging news. But for any of these crimes, there's a victim as well that's experienced this incident, this whole thing. And it can be very traumatic. Just a robbery can be obviously very traumatic. We can think of other types of crimes as well, that there's not just the individual who's there, but how it affects the family and the communities as well. So there are those victims as well. So we don't wanna get lost in the numbers. Like, yes, I'm telling you that we see the lowest number of homicides that we have in at least 40 years. That's still almost 1,700 individuals who were killed. That's a lot of victims. So we don't wanna lose that perspective either. There's room for further improvement too, I think. Why do you think this is happening? This has been, at times, we hear about the great crime decline, right? And that's kind of like, you could see where that's coming from what I'm telling you. And I think that, yeah, we are. I mean, the data is pointing towards these things, but we also need to keep in mind, it's returning to where things were before the pandemic. So when we go back and we look at 2020 and 2021, that's when we see these increases. We see it across California. When you look at homicide, for example, that was across the state we saw these increases, but it wasn't just California. We saw it across the country. And when we're talking about now the decreases, we're seeing it across California as well. But it's the whole country too. It's the whole country as well. So we're talking about broad changes that we have observed over the five, six years that we're talking about here. And I think then, so if you're gonna be explaining why it's coming down, you need to understand why did it go up in the first place? And there were so many things that happened during the pandemic. So it's going to be very difficult to pinpoint any one factor. But I think that there's starting to be a consensus at least about some plausible factors. And I think from my perspective, the starting place is to recognize there were disruptions everywhere that happened with the pandemic. And it happened very quickly. And if you start with the criminal justice system, you see that across the board, there were impacts. You take law enforcement, pretty quickly there were local directives to our police officers to reduce and minimize arrests and bookings. Because they didn't want to put people in jail because they didn't want them to get there. Exactly, exactly. Yeah, you want to stop that flow of people coming in and out of jail. Jails are to start with a very difficult kind of environment to prevent the spread of this deadly COVID virus as well. And then you have the interactions with community members as well that you have to remember, we're walking around with masks or homemade masks and all of those things. If you're engaged in making stops and possible arrests, that's out the door. So that presents a public health challenge to both the individuals who are engaging with the officer and vice versa, right? So we had all of that. We had the zero bail orders that the judicial council issued as well, basically saying you can't hold people on bail for most misdemeanors and a number of felonies as well. Again, trying to reduce that flow of people in and out of jail as well. But that presented challenges for law enforcement to do job the way that they did before, right? And all of that was trying to prevent the spread of COVID. So we had that happening. And we're just talking about law enforcement now. Other thing that happened in 2020 was the murder of George Floyd. And there were protests across the state and across the nation. And there was the call for defund the police. There was basically an increased mistrust in policing. That makes policing more difficult to do as well, right? If your community doesn't trust you, it's gonna be very difficult to be effective police in that area. And then it affected law enforcement from the perspective of recruitment and retention. We lost police officers. They either retired or the recruitment to try and get new officer in there was very difficult as well. So just looking at policing, we see big changes that made policing difficult. We mentioned jail, very difficult environment to prevent the spread of COVID. Prisons are no different. These are crowded environments. So both jails and prisons released inmates as well. The courts, emergency measures that slow down the courts as well. So the entire, you can take any part of the criminal justice system. It was affected and prevented them from operating the way that they were before the pandemic. Equally, maybe more importantly, we had the social big disruptions. What we were doing, we were sheltering in place, right? So we were not out in our communities as much. To some extent, business is closed for example. Some extent that will like drive down crime. Like when stores are closed, can't really steal from them. But on the other hand, for some types of crimes, when there are fewer people around, there are fewer witnesses. We're wearing masks. Those are things that makes it difficult to solve crimes. We had school closures. That means a lot of young people are not in schools as well. So we had all of these things. We had the economic uncertainty on top of it. I mean, in the first few months, unemployment was very high. So we had a lot of these factors that can contribute to some type of crime as well. But there were also, these led to disruptions of local governments and community-based organizations, ability to provide services and programming, anything from behavioral health to violence prevention programs. These are a number of factors that can contribute to the increases that we did see. Fast forward a few years, what we've seen is slowly we're returning to where we were before the pandemic, allowing the various agencies, whether it's within the criminal justice system, behavioral health, community-based organization to provide the kind of services and programming that they were doing before the pandemic. And I think that that's kind of the narrative that describes what we've seen over the last five, six years. There has been another element to this also that the public opinion changed from the criminal justice system reform to actually we need to watch crime. And we went from Prop 47 to Prop 36. At the same time, some district attorneys were more relaxed. They didn't wanna enforce certain kind of crime, but then those district attorneys are gone and new ones are elected in some areas like LA and San Francisco. Do you think that also has an element in this? Oh, I think so. I think that what we have seen are some changes in the perceptions and the willingness to implement the kinds of reforms that we had been implementing before. And Prop 47 is an example of something that started before that because California really embarked on this path of criminal justice reforms. Already around 2009, you can see some evidence of some changes that were implemented with this overall aim of reducing incarceration. This country incarcerates more people per 100,000 residents of any Western country by a margin as well. But what happened in California specifically was the state prison system was sued for not providing adequate services to the inmate population. The services that we're talking about are services that are protected by the Constitution and that's adequate health and mental health care as well. It was by the federal government. Exactly, exactly. They looked at the conditions, they said it's not good conditions. Exactly. So there were all these lawsuits that led up to three judge panel being appointed in 2007. And in 2009, that three judge panel ruled that the fundamental problem that prevents the state of California to provide these adequate health and mental health services to its inmate population is overcrowding. So it ruled that the state had to reduce its prison population. By the time it would have been a decrease of about 40,000 inmates, that's 25% give or take, that's a big, big change. The state did make some changes to reduce the prison population immediately, but it also decided to take this to the Supreme Court. But in 2011, the Supreme Court, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled that the federal court was correct in that. So California, you have to actually reduce its prison population. So we had a big reform in 2011 called realignment, AB109, and it shifted correctional responsibilities from the state prison and the state parole systems to county jails and county probation department. It drove down the prison population by about 27,000 in less than a year. It pushed up the jail population somewhat, but that wasn't what the Supreme Court ruling was about. That still wasn't enough. Like all the efforts that have taken, that was still not enough to meet the federal mandate. So when Prop 47 was being debated, we were still above that. And I think that that has put pressure on California to move towards decreases in incarceration. And there's been a number of other changes that we've implemented during this period of time. We've done research on impacts on Prop 47 on crime, and we find no evidence that violent crime went up as a result of Prop 47. We found that there's some increases in some property crime from Prop 47. Larceny. Property and drug. Yeah, it was larceny and car break-ins. And then in later work, it's pointing towards, yeah, maybe retail theft as well went up as a result of that. But over that period of time that we're looking at here, both violent and property crime was mostly trending down. So it wasn't really until when we move into the pandemic, when we're starting to see these increases in crime, that I think that a lot of people question, have we gone too far? Should we reverse this to some extent? And that led us to the conversations around Prop 47, and maybe reverse some of those things. I think, keep in mind that Prop 36 in 2024 overwhelmingly passed by voters, suggesting that, yeah, it was very different from Prop 47, the switch, which also passed by a wide margin by voters. But Prop 36, again, overwhelmingly passed. And it's also one of those rare ballot initiatives that passed in every single county in California out of the 58. Even with Prop 47, we did see an increase in property crime in the year following that. But then we came back again, and we started to continue this downward path that we've mostly been on since then. In terms of other things that are visible to people in California, people being on drugs, and the middle of daylight in the middle of the street, and people with mental illness, are they factors that you guys are studying in terms of crime? Because there's an element of crime where it's not clear whether you could get attacked by an individual, what kind of reaction you might get. We are studying this, trying to better understand the trends that we are observing when it comes to homelessness and substance use and substance use treatment as well. I think you're bringing up a really good point here when it comes to coming back to this issue of a sense that crime is on the rise. The scenarios that you're describing are kind of environments where we don't feel safe. If we are in an environment where we're seeing drug use, where we're seeing individuals being unhoused or challenging with their behavioral health issues, whether it's substance use or mental health, it's obvious to us. And I think that those things can then contribute to, do we feel like crime is going up or down? So when we look at that and we look at homelessness, that is something that we've seen being on the increase in California for the last decade. So it's gone up by more than 60%. And we're reminded of that social problem because we do observe unhoused individual struggle. So I think that that contributes. And when you look at drug use, in terms of you can look at overdose deaths or overdose hospitalization, but death in particular, especially in the last five, six, seven years, it's been coming up notably as well. So there's like the data is pointing towards, especially over the last few, I'd say since the pandemic, increases in that as well. And that's something that we might observe at times. And that certainly has an impact on how we view our own safety and public safety as well. And some parents have told us that in urban areas, they're concerned of having their kids being alone or going to parks or walk around because of this, because of what they could get exposed to. Yeah, they're volatile, potentially volatile situations. So, you think of the areas of homeless and unhoused individuals, these are volatile environments and dynamic and they can change very quickly. So it is, when you look at the unhoused population, they might also be likely to be targets of the volatility that's in their community. Because there's another crime inside this area. Yeah, I mean, this is like the most vulnerable people in our communities, they're struggling. They don't even have housing, so they're struggling clearly. So yes, they become volatile and potentially, they become potentially victims of crimes themselves. So I think, when we think about, I mentioned the aggravated assaults going up, one of the things that we would like to know, but the data unfortunately doesn't allow us to answer that, is to what extent is this happening in the homeless communities? And because we have seen the homelessness increase, that that's part of the story that's contributing to the increase that we saw over a decade in aggravated assaults as well. It was not like these very sudden surges. We did see aggravated assault increase during the pandemic, but before that, we saw it tick up as well. But there's a possibility that that's capturing something that is part of the homeless challenge that we're dealing with in California. That's another area that probably crime hasn't been reported because from what we have gathered, people that we have had on the show, there are gangs in certain areas that control these homeless encampments. And there's a lot of crime within that community. And to be able to have a tent or be able to have a space, you have to follow what these gang leaders are doing. Absolutely, and that comes back to kind of where we started early on here talking about the reporting. Many of these incidents will not be reported. Some will be reported, but there's definitely under-reporting of those instances. So Magnus, you have been studying this data and you're close to it. Do you have any thoughts for Californians that are concerned because they have seen the videos, they are seeing these takeovers, G takeovers? It's encouraging what we see in the data. It appears that we're heading in the right direction, but I do think that there's still room for more improvement, right? It's encouraging that we're seeing these decreases. It's encouraging that what it looks like is that we're returning to the trends that we saw before the pandemic, and those were downward trends predominantly. But we were reminded in these last few years of how things can change quickly. And we were reminded that yes, crime can go up and crime did go up, but it's pointing us in the direction of decreases. And I think what we need to do moving forward is try to understand a little bit better of what are some of the efforts and strategies that we've taken in the last few years to bring us back to these low crime levels so we can replicate that. We should try to identify what doesn't work. What is it that we keep doing that isn't really helping? So efforts around those things. And one of the things that has been happening that's changing law enforcement and policing in the last, in the criminal justice system in the last few years is the use of technology as well, and AI. So we are seeing increased use of drones and license plate readers, cameras, all of these things that may be tools to reduce crime. And so I think efforts to also understand how it's being implemented, is it having those impacts that law enforcement hopes and believes that it does? And then also we do wanna keep in mind, are there some unintended consequences when we are utilizing this new technology? Having too much data on the citizens. Do you have too much data? It's all kinds of things. We're having technology. Where are we concentrating these efforts? All of these kind of things are things that we need to think about as we move forward. But I do think, you know, things are looking up for California. Magnus Lofstrom with PPIC. It was great to have you on California Insider. Great, it was great being here. So thank you for having me. Tell us what you think about this conversation with Magnus. What are your thoughts on the data and crime in California and the trends? You can always email us at ciamacacaliforniansider.com or comment. We read all of your emails and comments. I'm Ciamak Korami, this is California Insider. We'll see you next time.