Taylor Swift Is Already A Billionaire—Here's How 'The Life Of A Show Girl' Will Increase Her Fortune

Hi everybody, I'm Brittany Lewis, a breaking news reporter here at Forbes. Joining me now is my colleague Justin Conklin, the Deputy Director of Editorial Operations. Justin, thank you so much for joining me. Thanks for having me. It is a huge day if you are a Swiftie. Taylor Swift's latest album just dropped, The Life of a Showgirl. And you've lifted before for Forbes the curtain on the pop mogul. She's a billionaire who continues to be part of the zeitgeist. And even if you were on social media last night, you saw people waiting in anticipation for midnight for this album to drop. People were live streaming their reactions as they were listening to this. People are breaking them down. People have been figuring out what Easter eggs are where for the past months and really for the past years, ever since Taylor Swift became an artist. I mean, why do you think and how is she able to stay so relevant even when she's had a career that has spanned now close to 20 years? Well, I think a lot of things go into it, right? So she's reinvented herself so many times. I think part of that was stemmed in the fear of being replaced by the music industry. So she had to keep being something new with each new album release. At the same time, she's come across as relatable, especially across her social media presence. And she's given people music that's granted them permission to feel their emotions and kind of in the words of Dr. Ramsey from Penn State Berks, who taught a course on Taylor Swift, giving people the vocabulary to know what they were feeling. She's also extremely relatable outside of her music. And I know that's hard to imagine with a billionaire celebrity. But if you think about some of the celebrities that you see in paparazzi photos, they're wearing like $8,000 t-shirts, right? I'm never going to be able to afford that. But if you take a look at Taylor, especially from this past summer, you might see her in a dress that retails for around $200. That's affordable. That's relatable. People could buy that dress if they like it and kind of emulate Taylor Swift's style in that way. And the things that she talks about in her songs are extremely relatable. It doesn't matter if you're a billionaire like Taylor Swift or you're just an everyday person. I mean, you can relate to things like heartbreak, like friendship changes, things like that. And I want to get to that point of reinventing herself because sometimes artists do that and it's not as successful. I mean, when you look at Taylor Swift, she started out in country. Every album has a different flavor to it. How do you think she's able to reinvent herself so well? And why do you think people resonate with that so much? Why do you think people don't get sick of her yet? Because, I mean, every year she's released a new album. In the past couple of years, she went on that massive Eras tour. She is continuously a major cultural touchpoint. I mean, her appearance on the New Heights podcast with her now fiance, Travis Kelsey, and his brother smashed records. Why can't people get enough? I think it goes back to the, you know, relatability. I think that it's not necessarily about the genre of music that she's currently putting her records in or through. It's the words that she's using and the feelings and emotions that she's expressing and the scenarios that she's painting with words, with her songs, with her lyrics, that people are resonating with. They're seeing themselves in pieces of Taylor that she's chosen to share with her audience. And how do you think specifically that reinvention has helped her bottom line? Because she's a billionaire. She is. I mean, it doesn't hurt, right? Like, you know that with each new album, you're going to get something completely different and something completely unexpected. And I think that Life of the Showgirl is no different. We just had a double album anthology release with the Torture Poets department, which was kind of depressing, you know, if we're being completely honest. And this one is the antithesis of that. It's poppy, it's bright, it's fun, and it's quick. So I think people are going to be able to listen to this one repeat and not get bored of it anytime soon. I want to touch on her fan base a little bit. The Swifties are extremely loyal. If you were scrolling on social media last night or even this morning and beyond, people were waiting up for the album release. They're listening to it right at midnight. They're recording their reactions. Some videos, people were recording themselves crying, talking about the album as they were listening to it in real time. I mean, she generates this fierce allegiance with her fans. They consistently shell out a large amount of money for merch, for the album. The art tour tickets were not cheap. They're constantly looking out for Easter eggs that could or could not be in her music, in her social media, in other marketing, and seeing what that means, trying to predict the future for Taylor Swift. How lucrative do you think this really rabid fan base is for her bottom line? I mean, very, right? If people weren't going to her shows, weren't buying whatever merchandise she's dropping, weren't buying the records and all the variants, she wouldn't be a billionaire. I would point out that her billionaire status really came about because of the Airbus tour. It grossed over $2 billion in ticket sales alone. And fans were spending an average of around $900 to travel to these shows and dropping around $50 on average for merchandise. And a lot of people did that multiple times. And I mean, I saw things on social media of fans going around the world, leaving the country, making an international trip out of seeing Taylor Swift. Forbes pegged her as a billionaire in October of 2023, so just two years ago. How was she able to reach that status just through her music? Because when you think about ultra wealthy artists, I'm thinking of Selena Gomez. I'm thinking of Rihanna. They all, they have different companies like Fenty, like Rare Beauty. Taylor Swift, it seems, has just made this on her music alone. Yeah, she became a billionaire with a combination of cash earned through touring. And selling merch, movie tickets, things like that. And the value of her music catalog that she now owns. When it comes to Taylor Swift, I think it's really important to remember that the product that she's selling is Taylor Swift. I don't really see her creating something that isn't music or arts related. Do I need a Taylor Swift branded tequila? No. Would I buy it? Probably. I mean, it would be very aesthetically pleasing. To that point though, I think a lot of celebrities from what you see, do we need an ex branded this product? The answer is no, but they'll still put their face all over it. And Taylor Swift doesn't do that. Do you think that's really helpful to her brand? I think so, 100%. I think any merchandise that she releases, I'm thinking specifically about like the cardigans that she released along with her albums. It's more about the aesthetic. It's more about the vibe. It's more about the feeling. And it's not so much about putting her image on that thing. It's about making that thing a part of her world. And I think something that you said about Taylor Swift at the beginning of this conversation is her relatability. And people relate to these lyrics. I mean, once again, if you scroll on social media, you're seeing people dissect those lyrics and kind of put them and compare them to their own lives. And it seems like whenever Taylor Swift releases an album, you almost get a window into her life. Like you said, the tortured poets department, that was a different vibe than this one. You can tell that she's in a really fun era of her life. It might not be as serious as Folklore or another album like that. This seems really fun, really light. What do you think the life of a showgirl will ultimately do for her fortune? I think it's only going to increase it. I mean, she's already released around nine different vinyl variants. The Cardigan comes along with the CD and that's going to bump her unit sales as well. And so I think we're just going to see her continue her trajectory of more. I think that the majority of her earnings in the future is going to come from her music that she now owns. She owns all of her masters. And I think if she goes on tour again, that's going to hit big numbers. Taylor Swift has been really part of the national dialogue for almost 20 years. People love her. People have criticized her music. We have a really interesting perch at Forbes looking at the money component of Taylor Swift as well as Taylor Swift the celebrity. As a fan of her music, what do you think from the position you're in at Forbes knowing the money component behind it, what do you think's missing from the national and really international conversation when it comes to Taylor Swift? I think we need to focus less on whether we like her or hate her. And really appreciate the businesswoman that she is and the acumen that she brings to her business. Because at the end of the day, Taylor Swift is a incredibly smart businesswoman. She went after her masters. She re-recorded all of the masters that she was missing to essentially devalue the ones that were sold off from underneath her. And so at the end of the day, she decided she was going to win and she did. To that point, what type of businesswoman do you think Taylor Swift is? I think she's incredibly savvy. I think she has given us a masterclass time and time again on not accepting the answer that's given to her if she doesn't like it. She was not afraid to pull her music off Spotify when she felt that artists weren't being paid an appropriate amount of money for streaming. She re-recorded her masters when they were sold out from underneath her and essentially devalued someone else's investment. And so I think she's very protective of what is hers and I think rightly so. And I know that she just went on that massive ERA's tour recently. Do you think we're going to see any type of stadium tour, perhaps in ERA's another round with the Life of a Showgirl? I'm not sure what to expect. I mean, if you pay attention to what's happening on the internet and TikTok, creators are definitely speculating about what's next for her. I've seen rumors that she's going to have a Vegas residency or perhaps a show at the Sphere. I don't think we're going to see a tour until after she's married. I think the ERA's tour was incredibly long and incredibly well done. And she herself has said in interviews that she doesn't want to go on tour again unless she can do it incredibly well. Justin Conklin, I appreciate your insight here. Thank you so much for joining me. Thanks so much for having me.