SpydeRS! Porsche 718 Spyder vs Spyder RS vs DeMan 4.5L Spyder! - TheSmokingTire

Well, well, well, what a day on the hill. We have three amazing cars for you, and it's up to you to choose which one did it best. You see, I have a hypothesis that I am in fact the journalist with the most miles behind the wheel of Porsche 718 Spyders, which makes me perhaps uniquely qualified to present this video. In door number one, we have the stock 718 Spyder, a 2023 example with low miles and a manual. Behind door number two, Porsche's $240,000 Spyder RS Viseok with the GT3 engine, the PDK, all kinds of lightweighting goodies, bucket seats, and a price tag to match. Behind door number three, however, we have my version, the California hot rod version, the 718 Spyder with a Demand Motorsport four and a half liter engine, making 600 horsepower and shortened manual transmission gear ratios. What I suspect is the perfect California canyon carving Spyder. So today we're gonna drive all three and find out if the best Spyder can be had for 125, 240, or $180,000. Let's hit the road. But before we drive anything, I have to thank today's sponsor, Fantic, without whom this video wouldn't be possible. You know, when we're out on the mountain filming, these cars get very dirty. And the Fantic V8 Apex Portable Vacuum is a rockstar. This thing fits in your trunk, behind your seat, anywhere. It's USB chargeable. It has so much power to both suck and blow. It has many, many attachments and is generally an incredibly handy thing to keep around with a cleanable filter, all these different ways to get in the nooks and crannies of your car. It's got a ton of power, two speeds. Best of all, for Prime Day right now, today, October 7th, 2024, you can get not only the V8 Apex for 37% off, but Fantic's other vacuum, the V10 Apex for 21% off. You hit the link in our video description, use my code, follow the directions. You get this V8 Apex for $62 with all the attachments ready to go. Get one for yourself, get one for your mom, your dad, your friends, your gearhead people, your film production people, anyone with kids would love this thing. So hit that description, get it for Prime Day and thank you to Fantic for sponsoring today's video. This is a real treat today. I mean, one of the things that I've learned from my job at Road & Track as editor at large is there is absolutely no substitute for a back-to-back same day comparison test. And so being able to get these three cars on the same road at the same time to really feel the nuances and the difference is such a special treat. Shout out to Marco from TLG Auto in North Hollywood for bringing out his stock 2023 718 Spyder. This car is, as it left the showroom in guards red with 3,700 miles on it, nicely broken in and it is a real delight. You know, I haven't driven a stock 718 Spyder in about five years since I drove the press car and getting back in it today, I've not really noticed how different my car is from where they started. This car is so smooth and effortless and light. It feels very much like the continuation of the first gen Acura NSX. All of the inputs, the shifter, the clutch, they're super light and just right at your fingertips. And even the steering is a little lighter than my car, partially because I've got that diff, partially because I have R compound tires and this has a Pilot Sport 4S on it. Marco has really spec'd this car out nicely. It's got the comfort seats, it's got the red belts. It's just a great, clean package and I don't see guards red on Spyders very often. But all we're doing right now is it's a bit of a palate cleanse, right? You can go watch my review of the 718 Spyder when it came out and everything I said then, I will stand by today. But if you don't wanna go back and watch that whole video, here's what I said in a nutshell. I said the 414 horsepower four liter is a fantastic engine but it's not as special as what you get from a GT product, which is true as we will see. And I said the gearing is too long, particularly in second and third, which I stand by and have fixed in my own car. But to revisit this car now, I can say with confidence that this is a phenomenal car on its own and does not need tuning in order to be a fabulous driver's car that you could drive every weekend for 10 or 15 years and never get sick of. Listen to this too. What a great sound. It's just enough. And what's funny is, although in my car, I can do errands, I can use it as a regular car, I never really forget that I'm driving a monster. Whereas this car is a pussycat in that very sort of perfect Porsche way. Everything is so fluid and so easy and you can use it as a car all the time every day and it won't tire you out. My car and the RS are a little bit of a different story. There it is, 718 RS. Let's hop in it and see what Porsche's idea of an improvement is before we see what my idea of an improvement is. Woo! The RS is a pure distilled fizz machine. All it does is assault you with sound and sensation. And the fact that the roof comes off and is really only ever meant to be off just further emphasizes that fact. Andy Preutinger said that this is the first and only RS product ever that is not designed to set a better lap time. It is designed purely for driver sensation and enjoyment. And to that degree, you cannot drive this car without going, yeah, that's that. I mean, listen. Woo! Obviously, this is the top-down version of the GT4 RS. But this car has also managed to fix my two biggest complaints about the GT4 RS. The harsh ride. This has a much better ride than the 4 RS. It's firmer than the stock Spyder, but not so firm that you can't use it as a car if you want. It's not punishing. And the sound. The 4 RS has that very brilliant and innovative airbox in the cabin, which at the high end of the rev range, it sounds almost like a McLaren F1. No problems there. But at the low end of the rev range, you have a very boomy resonance that gets in your brain and sort of sticks there and gives you headaches. I'm not really about it as an everyday car. In the Spyder, that airbox is under the top storage, and all you get are these over-the-shoulder scoop openings leading to what is perhaps one of the most aggressive intake sounds in the history of cars. Now, there are arguments to be made that the Spyder RS is the perfect Porsche. It is the RS-ified version of what I already figured was the perfect Porsche. It's the right size. It's the right interior space. It's got the right amount of tech versus simplicity. It's got a key and pull straps and buttons and two trunks and a good ride and so many things that I want out of my weekend car. Unfortunately, they come at a cost because you can only get this car in PDK. Some will argue further that it is worth the PDK to get this engine. Listen, I don't entirely disagree. PDK is the best automatic gearbox on the planet. It does exactly what you tell it to when you tell it to. And it is perfectly mated to this transmission. Plus, this engine, which as we all know, comes from the GT3, makes all of its power above 5,500 RPM. And having the PDK makes you more likely as a driver to keep the engine in that power band. It's just the way our brains work. The car is very fluid. It's very effortless. It's definitely got more front-end grip than the regular Spyder and the steering is a little more precise. But it is really a fantastic example of the Spyder formula turned up to 11 the Porsche way, using motorsport to create enjoyment and fizz. But it's not the California hot rodder way. And that is what I wanna do next. But first, we have to have a race. Marco, we're gonna have a race. What? These cars have two completely different roof mechanisms. Okay? They have taken out all mechanical stuff from the RS1 in order to make it fit above the bigger engine and to save weight. And a lot has been made of the fact that this roof is more annoying to put up than that roof, which is already pretty annoying. So, we're gonna find out how much more annoying. Ready? It's gonna rain in three, two, one, go. So, I've gotta put this on here. Now, I have to unroll it. I'm building a tent. Put the little sticks in the holes, drape this over. Now, I have to ease the tensioner here. Connect this little loop. Connect. Now, I close that. Need some help? Maybe. Pull this tab, slide it in. I don't know how to do this. Too complicated. So, this is the Bimini top. So, I think it took me about, what, an extra 30 seconds or so? So, it was about 45 seconds for you, maybe a minute and a half for me. With an asterisk, because I have, this is the Bimini top. So, this is not watertight, and if you close the windows, this is open, fully open, which actually is quite interesting, because it turns the cabin into an airbox when you're driving like that, and it is quite loud. It's an amplifier. Right, and then, if you want to, would you pop the rear hatch, please, Marco? If you're taking it to the car wash, let's say, or if you're washing it at home, or if it's like, you know, proper monsoon driving, you take out, you got this nice little pouch here, and you take out this bit, okay? And so, the way this, oh no, you leave that up, sorry. The way this works is, please hold, take this. So, you've got the pop rivets in the middle. So, you start in the middle, and you pop rivet. 10X. What is that? 10X. Is that what these are called? 10X? 10X. Okay, so you put those three, and then you wrap this around, and you see your little clip here? That goes at the very end of this rod. Oh yeah, there you go, okay. And then you slide the tab into the slot there, right? The bottom, slide the tab into the slot, okay? Yeah. Yeah, there it is, right? And then you put this down, and then you flip this back over, and you pop that, the end one, the outer one. Yeah, that one. That one, and now you press. And so, now you've got your watertight roof. You can wash your car. And you can wash your car. But, it's actually not, you know, this bimini bit, or this watertight bit, it does add some quietness. When you're, like, when I drove eight hours back from Thunder Hill the other day, I did put this in. I did not need to be a hero. And you have to put it in to wash the car, for sure. But Preuninger was very particular about the fact that he wanted this car to have no roof at all. And this was the compromise that they came up with, we have to have some kind of roof, but it can be really designed to be mostly open all the time, even when it's up. And it's okay if it's annoying. I would say that it's easier than the 981 version. Yeah, yeah, and it's better than the Mercy. It's better than the early Vipers. It's well designed. It's a good compromise. And, I mean, it only took a minute and a half. It's not like it took 10 minutes. But, it's definitely more annoying, and louder, and less insulated, in general, than this roof, which is already pretty thin. So, should we race to take them back down now? That's what you want. Down, let's go. Three, two, one, the sun's out again. Oh, my God. Quick. Get rid of your roof. And, I thought, I tried to be slick. Thought I could do them both. The problem with doing this by yourself is the roll. The roll is very easy with two people. But, with one, it ends up kind of sloppy, because you have to roll it, and then rest it here. Now, this is pretty trick. When I release the clip here, when I release this clamp, it still sits. Well, look, you never really have to put this down in a hurry. You only ever have to put it up in a hurry. Because it wasn't tight enough, it doesn't close properly. See, it's no problem at all. You gotta honk when you're done. Oh. Yeah. Time. I already said it, but it is a real privilege to be able to go back to back to back, and feel out the very different characters of these cars. Because, now that I get back in my car, after the RS, that's all intake and high-end. I'm all exhaust and mid-range. So, if I hit it from four, the torque is just way different. Comes on way earlier, and there's more of it. The Spyder RS makes its power with revs. It goes to nine. My car only goes to eight. But my car makes its power the old-school hot-rodding way, with displacement and compression. So, we increase the compression to 13 and a half to one, and it's a 4.5 liter displacement. The engine is both bored and stroked, and has forged rotating assembly. And then we've also done, I mean, whatever else Demand does with their motor, it's a lot. And then we've also got the gear ratios shortened two through five, leaving one and sixth alone for usability. And I think that's the right choice. Then we've got the light flywheel, the motorsport clutch, excuse me, and light R101 HRE wheels. And the whole package is just so ideally set up for canyon driving, as well as road tripping. Because, look, it's loud, but I can make it quiet. And when it's quiet, it is basically the same sounding as the stock car. It's only slightly louder. I like it on loud, though. It is a little softer than the RS. That's okay. I am very happy to have my comfort 18-way heated touring seats. I'm very happy to have a manual transmission. And I'm very happy to have a slightly softer ride. I'm not taking this car to the track. I'm not setting lap times, but I am going on road trips with my wife. And so a softer ride for bumpy canyon roads and for highway road tripping is good, as are these seats. One thing you can really feel that's different dynamically is how my car is really clawing at the road for traction. Like Marco said, when he drove it, he came back and he said, I can feel it clawing. And that's probably why you're going through tires like that. Yeah, that's probably true. But in order to access the RS's meat of its power band, you've gotta be going really pretty fast. You've gotta have that engine really spun up, six to 9,000. And that's why it's well-mated to that gearbox. Whereas my engine, with that big, punchy mid-range, it's suitable for squirting out of a corner in the canyon when you're at 4,000 or 5,000 RPM instead of 6,000 or 8,000 RPM. It's a muscle Porsche. And they just sound so different. I mean, they're different approaches to the same formula. But they're such different approaches to go after displacement for power versus revs. One is that sort of motorsport angle and one is that hot rod angle. And the sound, enormously different. My car has much more of an exhaust sound. It's a sort of baritone, early 20th century aircraft spitfire type sound. You get it from those big soup can pistons, right? Whereas the Spyder RS, it's all about that intake sound that comes from right behind your ear. My car doesn't have those scoops. So you don't get that sucking noise that you get with the Spyder RS. A couple of people at Road and Track commented that they might like a little less intake and a little more exhaust. I suspect at Porsche that if you wanna make a car louder that still meets the European sound standards, focusing on intake is a wise move. It doesn't carry in the same way a loud exhaust does. I feel like this car echoes off the canyon walls more. And ever since Mitch from M Engineering tuned this car, we did a video on that, go watch it. It's making 527 at the tire on 91 octane on a Mustang dyno. But perhaps more importantly, it's running super fast. Super smooth, super linear. The power curves don't have as many peaks and valleys in them. It's really improved the character of the car. The original tune was fine. This one's just better. So I suppose what you wanna know is if I made the right choice. Do I regret not getting a Spyder RS, waiting for that? Or do I regret not leaving my car stock? Well, you're not gonna like this. I don't. I don't regret it. And I feel like people want me to regret it. And I don't. This car drives in a way that I want my weekend car to drive. I want comfort seats. I want a manual gearbox. I want an insane and unique exhaust note. I want a top that if I put it up, it does actually keep the outside out a little bit. I want a good ride. And I'm not totally made of money. And this total package is anywhere between 30 and $50,000 cheaper than getting a Spyder RS. Yes, there are some other considerations, but I love this car. Funny thing is, I love all of them. I love the Spyder RS for what it's like in those perfect circumstances. On the right road, on the right day, that car is just ace. And I love the stock Spyder for what it gives you for a, in Porsche world, reasonable amount of money for great inputs, a beautiful styling, a great sound, tons of usability. Nothing at all wrong with that car. That's a great car. These are three great cars that for $125, $185, and $235.40, they all deliver on their promises just in totally different ways. And that's why at the end of this video, I can say there isn't a winner. There isn't a best. There's only a best for you. Do you want something that asks nothing in return? Or do you want a more focused product that either makes you work for the speed and deal with the roof? Or that never lets you forget you've got a hot rod car with a heavy clutch and a loud exhaust note? Your choice. But I've made mine and I'm sticking to it. And remember, always fight your tickets on the Off the Record app available in the Android and iOS store or go to offtherecord.com slash TST.