Alia Bhatt interview on Gangubai Kathiawadi at Berlin Film Festival: Rise to power

Hi, I'm Sarah from The Upcoming. An absolute pleasure to be able to speak to you here at the Burnham Film Festival. Maybe you can just kick off with a brief introduction to this incredible film. What can people expect if they come and watch it? So the film is called Gangubai Kathiawadi. So obviously it's about Gangubai. She was, it's a true story based on whatever we know about her life, which is a couple of major plot points about how she came to India, I mean to Bombay. She's from Kathiawad, which is in Gujarat. How she comes to Bombay, why she comes to Bombay, what happens. She gets sold by her lover into prostitution. Post that, how she rises to become extremely impactful and powerful. How she sort of creates waves with her personality, becomes the voice of reason for the women of Kamatipura. Goes on to meet the Prime Minister of the country, give this huge speech and really puts out her perspective on how she feels these women are treated in society. She made a lot of difference to these women's, to their lives. And she made so much of an impact that for 50 years, her photo was on all their walls in Kamatipura. So what we know is these points. What we don't know is the in-between. How and why was she so impactful? She was also very politically connected. She was called the mafia queen. Why was she the mafia queen? Why was she so intoxicating and arresting as a personality? So that's what we don't know. And that's what the film is about. So basically, you see the journey of this character and this person at a very young age and the impact that she had on the women's lives in society and just her struggles and her vulnerability. So what was the initial appeal? Because I guess there can be challenges, but also something amazing about playing someone who really exists rather than a fictional character. Also working with Sanjay, who is such an experienced director. And I guess in this day and age, just being able to play such fascinating female characters, which in the past maybe we didn't get to see enough or celebrate these women that not everyone always knows about, kind of get written out of the history books sometimes. So what was the appeal for you? Well, the appeal for me was working with Sanjay Leela Bansali to be directed by him, to be a part of his vision. And as you rightfully said, it's not very often that characters like this are written for anyone. Forget just women. Just in general, it's so layered. And it's all about the character. The film is the character. It's episodic, which is why the character is taking the film forward. If you feel for the character, then you feel for all the episodes that she goes through. And hence you feel for the film. It's not like, oh, good versus bad versus this versus that. It's not that. It doesn't have a safe construct. The construct is led by this character, which is why it was so important to get the character right. And which is why it gave me such an interesting, very challenging opportunity to really collaborate with the director that I've been wanting to work with for such a long time. So, yeah, I think it's a combination of a challenge and sort of a surreal opportunity come together. And we've made this film. Perhaps, rightly or wrongly, is the perception that, you know, Indian cinema can be quite conservative, let's say. So do you feel that this is quite a kind of punchy role, if you like, if that's the right way to put it? And there's definitely, it's cut through with a lot of humour. Yeah. It's not taking itself too seriously either. There's something quite bold about it, Yes, absolutely. And I also feel the reason is bold and it's humorous is because we're not trying to be preachy here. The idea is to give you a story and make it entertaining. It's not about, it's not textbook information. It's something that you can take in and enjoy while you're watching, but you go away with a feeling. And that's the power of cinema, that you sort of immersed in this world that you're not aware of, but at the same time, you're feeling what the characters and the people on this journey are feeling. And then you walk away and maybe learning something. That's basically what it is. And yes, like what you said, it is conservative, but it isn't conservative if you give them a character to connect with. It's not about the topic. It's about the character. It's not about the backdrop. It's about the character. The world is the backdrop. The film is the character and the person within the character. So if you give them a person to love, then it doesn't matter where, which profession or where they're standing or where they're sitting. It's about the person. It's also a very beautiful film to look at and it's full of life and color and music. Was it really a lot of fun to actually shoot the film or were there some challenging moments as well? Well, it was challenging through and through because of the part, but also it was, it was also technically challenging in terms of production because, you know, we had delays due to COVID. We had to sit at home for so many months. The set went through two cyclones, believe it or not. We had to build in, you know, the production had to build an industrial shed to cover up the set because it was an outdoor set. So yeah, there were like various challenges whilst making the movie. But I think everybody's goal and purpose was just to get the film there and get the film right and get it done nicely, you know, then hand it over to the audience. And there's a transgender character in the film and it feels like, you know, one of these topics that keeps rearing its head about, you know, who can play these characters. Do you have a strong view about that or did you have an expectation that things like that might come out of the film, you know, that end up being the talking points? So I understand where that conversation is coming from. It's basically, we're talking about inclusivity, right? We're talking about not having a place for a transgender character to be a part of a film and have him play, whether it's even a character with disabilities, like it's something that we should make more obvious and common and natural. But I believe that's something that should be done in every industry, not just the film industry. It should be done in the banking industry, in the engineering industry and in every industry. So that's a bigger conversation. If you're talking to me, what do I feel about inclusivity? I'm all for it. That's something that I felt all my life. But I feel that there's a point at which we should let the director and the creators make a choice of what they want to do. I don't think anyone is trying to offend anyone here. The idea is to make a film and maybe, just maybe, the director of the film thought it would be more interesting for a male person in real life to transform into a transgender character and feel for the character and play that character convincingly. I think that's also a very interesting light, you know, and that's looking at it differently. So I like to look at it as more of a creative opportunity to see a transformation. We can have this conversation the other way around as well, that why aren't transgender characters playing male characters? That's a fight that we can have constantly. So while I understand the point of inclusivity and I'm all for that, maybe in this situation, it was not about that. It was just a creative call. And you've touched on many points already, but you know, ultimately, what do you hope people take away from watching it? I mean, it feels like there's a very inspiring kind of feminist message behind it. Just, you know, that you can get out in there and be a leader and you can come from whatever background and really make an impact on people's lives and make a difference. Yeah, I think it touches upon many, like the social conversation in this film is extremely varied, from women empowerment to not being discriminative based on your profession, based on where you come from. I think in so many different ways, it makes so many points. But at the end of the day, I think it's a story about, I think the way I look at it is that this woman is still trying to be sunshine in this dark world. Like for her, the world is dark, but she tries to be the sunshine. So you walk away even though very emotional, I believe, with sunshine and with like a positive sort of feeling in your heart. I'm hoping that's what people take away from the film. And it's not your first time here at the Berlin Alley. How does it feel to be back? And particularly, you know, people being able to watch the film on the big screen, because a film like this has to be seen. Absolutely. Not on a laptop, not on your telly at home. So what does it mean to you to be here? Honestly, it's been so amazing. Every time I've been here, the response has been so overwhelming and so exciting. And it's such a nice opportunity to come out there and show your labour of love that you've spent so much time on. I'm hoping and expecting people to, you know, just come out there, come in, watch the film. I'm so curious to hear where they're laughing, where they're clapping, where they're whistling, where they're responding, where they're quiet. It'll really give me a nice sense as to what's going to happen when I go back to India and the film is going to release pretty soon. So I'm really looking forward to that experience. And just finally, you know, what have you got coming up next? Are you conquering Hollywood next? You know, what have you got setting your sights? One step at a time. But yeah, I hope the conquering is not too far. I'm sure it isn't. It's been an absolute pleasure to speak to you. Thank you so much for sharing with us. Enjoy your time here in Berlin. Soak it all up. Thank you so much. Thank you.