Michael Shannon - "Waco: The Aftermath" | The Daily Show

Excited Michael welcome to the show thanks for having me now this series today's the 30th anniversary of the Waco siege Yeah, and I know this series you did a series that looked at the Waco siege and now this is revisiting It's the aftermath what what is it about Waco that made you want to return to this story? Well, yeah, I mean a lot of people When I told him I was making a sequel to Waco they said didn't you do it all I mean that was the whole thing right and you know granted that was the event. Yes, but obviously an event like that. It's like Like a meteor crashing into the earth, you know, it's gonna have seismic consequences and And I really think it's worth exploring, you know these these incidents they don't just exist in a vacuum and they Everything is connected and everything leads to the next thing and that's what was so worthwhile to explore Yeah, I mean you look at Waco and Waco it's sort of in many ways If not the birth of the modern militia movement definitely a part of the trajectory for it, right? Yeah, and just sewing, you know this This distrust in the government, you know, I a lot of times when I think about anarchy I think What is it that really frightens people about anarchy what is the thing that you would lose in an State of anarchy that is so significant and then and the answer that I keep coming up with as well the government Keeps you safe like the government exists in order to keep the population safe taken care of and And if the government isn't doing that it's really kind of worthless like there there is no reason for it to exist and it does that in a variety of ways, you know, whether it's You know, the most obvious way is just keeping us safe from harm, but also Helping us to take care of ourselves and be able to take care of ourselves and live Somewhere where we don't have to worry about our own well-being all the time Like that's as far as I can tell why it's there. Yeah Yes, right now I I spent a lot of time out in the road I talked to a lot of folks who have this inherent distrust in the government, right? They don't see it as something that serves a role to support and to protect. It's something you should be distrustful of I think Waco is An experience that was complicating for a lot of folks Yeah, it was the government didn't handle it perhaps the way they could have or should have You even make the series at a time that was pre what happened in January 6 The series originally looks at sort of this extremism and now since then we've seen what is extremism In a series like that now make its way on to the front pages on to the steps of the Capitol January 6th has now happened. How does that affect approaching telling the story again? Well, geez, I mean it just makes me wonder like Because things keep happening that you think there's no way this could ever happen And then it happens and so I'm like, well, what's the next? What's the next thing after January 6 and it what's fascinating is is it the fellow? I'm playing Gary Nesner who's an actual real person. It has an incredible book I highly recommend everybody read called stalling for time But Waco is one chapter in his book as Like I said as cataclysmic an event as it was It's only he's got all these incidents that he's dealt with over the years on micro and macro levels and and He is very reluctant. He's not He's not looking to vilify Anybody or say oh, you know and he would agree that that that situation in Waco was an incredibly complicated situation and And he has doubts himself about how he handled it He certainly has doubts about how other people handled it but he doesn't think there's like a big bad wolf or anything like that, but I think it's just It's extraordinarily compelling I think this story and I think it's extraordinarily valuable to realize that no matter how outlandish an event is That there is something even more outlandish just around the corner. And I think that that's I think that's why the story is worth keeping in the forefront of our minds I also think it's you're telling that because you're a storyteller and you're like Next scene like you want you've made you got you gotten two things out of this already You're like and you think you've seen this so far the after aftermath. Are we pitching it now? Well, there are actually I you know Gary and I cuz Gary and I have actually become very good friends you bought the IP I see Well Gary, I think it's important to point out to that. I'm absolutely nothing like Gary like I don't look like Gary I don't sound like Gary. We like the second third fourth choice It was Danny DeVito Fisher Stevens and then me. Yeah Yeah, well, I'm like a catch-based I get what nobody else wants but but He's like, yeah, we've got to make all the chapters in the There's there there is a great potential for season three, but I'm not gonna ruin it I'll tell you if you read the book, you'll figure it out But anyway, and the only other point I wanted to make is it and I've heard other people friends of mine say this Particularly the Dowdles the Dowdle brothers who made the show who are just John and drew are just beautiful beautiful people and they really Really care like it's not easy to make a show like this. There's gonna be a lot of resistance It's like really is kind of a drag you want to you know, like yeah, we need to do this and like resistance because it's Inherently a political story. Yeah, that's part of it. It's also Unpleasant, you know, it's it's pretty pretty darn up It's Texas but I Think one of the things is valuable also about it is that it proves that no matter what side of it of this debate? Or issue that you're on Everyone is capable of Having a flawed perspective everyone is and that that's also an important thing to remember And a lot of people pay lip service to that. It's like well It's not until we reach across the aisle or whatever find a common ground But I think it's really interesting in this in this situation in this story to see how that really it is not Easy to do for either side and how complicated that that truly can be in in practice not just as like a Catchy slogan that's something that you actually do. Yeah. Well, it's vulnerable to secede any kind of ground, right? So yeah the admitting that your point of view might be flawed Could put you in a position where you suddenly now lose ground to this other side I feel like we're constantly fighting those battles today one particularly when you know They're there are actually lives on the line Like it's not just Thanksgiving and you're not threatening to throw sweet potatoes at your uncle, you know it's like there are people in a very life-and-death situation and and Decisions have to get made very quickly now Switching gears a little bit here. I'm from Chicago. I Know your reputation. I saw you in Chicago perform Not only are you? Wonderful on the big screen, but also live in theater and I know not only do you do live theater I I know you also perform music you cover Historic bands and their their historic albums. I know you also do improv Is there is there something we had a what what? Yeah, it's sort of I'm assuming it's like a whose line is anyway type situation a lot of props and a lot of I'm kidding. I wouldn't insult long for me. I just I ride the pacifier. It's just funny to see a grown man with the past Are you drawn to that types of things I feel like you're known for more for your your heavy heavier more dramatic performances Do you sort of have to indulge the other side? Oh I don't know. I feel like I don't do enough like there's things like I should try other things and keep diversifying my portfolio as it were but but then I think well You hear a lot of times just stay in your lane, you know Whether that's with your work or your opinions or whatever, you know, just stay in your lane So I'm kind of conscious of that too like the music stuff people are always like what happened to your band or what's going on with that and I was like It just started to feel well I just started to feel like like cuz I mean who wants to actor bands are like I'm embarrassed by them and I'm an actor So I don't I don't want to Participate in that like I remember when I and I freaking love Kevin Bacon Like the Bacon Brothers on Jay Leno, I was like Joe Scarborough talk about his band and you're like god bless go go go with God there Joe go with God Or certain people that I won't mention who? Come into the makeup trailer in the morning and they say hey Have you heard my album and then they put it on while everybody's getting their hair done and make you listen to the record You haven't done that, but I said I wasn't gonna Want to incriminate myself me this Michael Shannon tell me there has been a moment where you have walked up Very seriously and asked somebody to come to your improv show Well, you I never know. I don't know No, well, I'm usually writing someone else's coattails. Oh, as you know, I'm performing Oftentimes with two of the legendary. Yes improvisers of all time. Dave Pesquasey TJ Jagadowski. Yep. Yeah Yes, so I mean you could basically just stand on stage next to them drool on your shoes and it'll be like bravo Nobody's watching you. Anyway, I think though you're not truly an improviser until you beg somebody to come to one of your show Yeah, yeah, that's true. Yeah. Uh-huh. Well and you because you did I Oh, right. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, they would have like 500 shows a day Yeah, it was like one after the other at the other. Did you ever come and see any of my shows? No, no, not a one not interested and I also did Second City, which was literally two blocks from your theater I'm sure you came to see some of that too. Well, that's it. There's a little corporate. Isn't it? It's got a little It's not corporate it's just owned by a venture capitalist now If that's important, yeah, maybe It's corporate. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'm glad you could come on here and help me burn down any bridges I have Everyone's favorite arsonist On the anniversary of a siege you came here and you took it to the ground Michael Shannon everyone