2023 NBA Draft LATEST INTEL 👀 📚 | The Lowe Post

Welcome to the low post podcast. It's Wednesday at 9 30 a.m. Eastern time. We are, I don't know, 32 hours or some such thing away from the NBA draft. I wanted to do a last minute check in on all the big Intel quickly. Rapid fire. Let's get through it. Jonathan Cavone. How are you? I'm great, Zach. How are you? I'm good. You must be, uh, all hopped up on caffeine and ready to go. I'm fired up. Let's do this. All right. We know who the number one pick is going to be. Congratulations to the Spurs. Um, number two, your latest Intel on the Charlotte Hornets who are in the middle of an ownership change and have kind of an old school regime that doesn't, uh, do as much of the chitter chatter as a lot of front offices do. What do we know? Well, as Woz and I reported, they brought Brandon Miller and Scoot Henderson back for a second workout. It was important for, um, you know, outgoing owner, Michael Jordan to get FaceTime with these guys, have a meal, sit down, get to know them and watch them go through another workout because the sense was Brandon Miller's first workout was kind of, eh, he, you know, kind of went at, you know, half speed. He wasn't super engaged. Um, you know, he, his conditioning level isn't at the level that Scoot Henderson's at. Scoot Henderson has been doing two a days for the past three months. I mean, he's in incredible shape. He's an incredible athlete. And the sense of urgency on his part, it's just been with so much greater in the first workout. And I think prior to that workout, they were, you know, leaning towards Miller. They said, you know, he's a better fit on our roster. We think he's going to be a multi-time all-star. We saw him score 41 points at a SEC game. They were at a couple of G-League night games and Scoot Henderson didn't play hard, you know? And so, but they got the opposite impression from the first workout. So they brought them back for a second workout and the intel that we're getting was that Brendan Miller was much better. He went much harder. He was told, Hey, if you want it to be the number two pick in the draft, which he very much does, you better prove it. And so he made shots. They put him in some, you know, defensive situations where I heard like, you know, he made some very, very impressive plays. Um, the meeting went very well. And, you know, as Adrian, uh, reported yesterday, I mean, all signs are pointing to Brendan Miller being the number two pick in the draft. Could things change between now and then? Sure. You know, but I mean, if I, if I were a betting man, that's how I think it would go by the draft for tonight. And that would be a big deal, not just for the Hornets making a, a pick that is at least somewhat about positional overlap and somewhat of obviously about talent too, but, um, with the metal ball there, but it would be a big deal. The sense that, you know, the, the notion that like there's this gigantic gulf between Scoot Henderson and Brandon Miller from a talent perspective. People that I talked to around the league just don't share that sentiment. A lot of people have Brandon Miller ahead of Scoot, even, you know, ignoring positional fit. So I don't think that it's just a, you know, we have LaMelo. We don't need another point guard. Let's just take Brandon because it's an easier fit. Well, that's good. That's, that's refreshing to hear. And I've heard the same stuff about the, you know, how much of a talent gap, if any. Is there really, it's also a big deal because that means Scoot Henderson would be there at three. And that's where the Portland Trailblazers are drafting with a 32 year old point guard who I think has made no secret that his preference would be that they trade the pick for veteran help. Now it's different. There's a difference between, I think, I think I would, I think they would, his camp would prefer that. But there's difference between prefer. And if you don't do it, all hell is going to break loose. And I think that gray area and that distinction is important. Also Charlotte taking Brandon Miller and leaving Scoot at three would be a big deal because the Pelicans have made no secret of their adoration of Scoot Henderson and the Pelicans have. I think one of the only veteran, a veteran may not even be the right word. One of the only trade ships, current present day players that the Blazers would have to have a pretty tough meeting about trading number three, four. And that's Zion Williamson, obviously. Um, the Hornets, yes. Could they want Zion Williamson? Would they be interested? Sure. Any team would at least have to have a meeting about Zion Williamson, but they're in much less of a win now position or want to be win now position than Portland is. Um, and that is the most interesting pivot point of the draft. We've already talked about it a lot. Um, and, and the two big questions is like, like, so we can, I mean, we can talk about all these players that are theoretically available for number three. Right. Um, the Raptors guys, you know, the thing that Damian Lillard doesn't have to worry about as much as Joe Cronin and whatever the ownership situation there is, who's calling the shots from that perspective, is being a steward of the Trailblazers franchise over the long haul. Damian Lillard does not have to worry about that as much as that brain trust does. And so you look at the Toronto guys, like Siakam, he's, he's going to get paid a lot of money really soon. OG Ananobi, he's going to get paid a lot of money really soon as an expiring contractor. Are they worth a number three pick that I don't know what, what you, I'd actually just pose this to you most. Cause you're a draft guy. I'm not most executives I talked to say this number three pick is worth more than the average number three pick in an average draft. Some, some drafts, you have incredible top three or four, some drafts you don't. Have you heard that same kind of sentiment? Like this is almost like a, a 1.5 kind of pick. Yeah. I think, you know, a lot of people feel like this is a three player draft. There's three number one picks in, in, in some regards and that they're sitting at three and Ray, the choice is going to be made for them, you know? So the idea that they're going to trade this pick for 60 cents on the dollar and you know, for an overpaid over the hill guy that, you know, helps them in the very short term, I don't, I just, I just don't buy it, you know? I mean, I just, I don't, I don't see it happening personally, but you know, anything can happen on draft night, but I don't sense that they're under the impression that, you know, that if they make this pick on draft night, all hell is going to break loose and, and, and literally is going to storm into the office the next day and say, you guys lied to me, you have to trade me right now. You know what I mean? They are going to explore what the value of this pick is and if they can make a trade, that's an, that's an obvious no brainer for them, they're going to do that, but I just don't sense that that trade is out there right now. And so, um, you know, if the draft were being held right now, I mean, I think they're making that pick. So let's just go through the guys real fast. Ananobi on an expiring, I just don't think you can trade the number three pick for him. I, I, it's, it's an interesting debate. He's a good player that we keep waiting for him to be great and healthy at the same time, and it just hasn't happened. Um, Siakam would be a fantastic fit, but, and he's on Dame's age timetable, but that's going to be a huge financial commitment. And again, for a pick that some would value as like a number two, number 1.5 pick in a draft, the chance to, to, to, to pick a potentially transcendent player you could have for 15 years. It came out yesterday that they would like to take a run at BAM out of bio. Um, that was met with laughter from the front offices of the Miami heat who, uh, are not going to trade a step back kind of trade, let alone one involving BAM out of bio, who they consider a franchise pillar, who has proven himself a playoff winner for a team that has made two finals in four years and has a superstar entering the back end of his prime. Let's say, so that's not happening. McHale Bridges, Dame has made no secret of his affection for McHale Bridges. Um, I don't that I just, the Nets aren't going to do that. I continue to hear the Nets are not going to do that. Simons in three is not going to get McHale Bridges to Portland. Um, even if Portland would do that, the Nets aren't. And when I push back on that, I've asked a lot of people like, are the Nets being a little too haughty about what McHale Bridges is and versus what Simons in the number three pick are, um, would you have that kind of discussion? What do you, what do you hear about the reasoning? I mean, some, some executives say, yeah, I think maybe they're turning up their noses a little bit, but I would say most that I've pulled think the Nets are being rational. What do you think? I honestly haven't heard a ton about this, you know, bridges for number three conversation. Maybe because like you said, it's just a non-starter for the Nets. And you know, it probably might not be someone that Portland wants to do either. So I just haven't really heard a lot about it. And I mean, I just, part of it has to do probably with the fact that the Nets don't own their picks. And so for them to go into this, you know, prolonged teardown when you don't own your own draft picks that this doesn't make a lot of sense, you're just helping the Houston Rockets more than you're helping yourself. I hear that. And I hear McHale bridges is going to be an all-star from, from the optimists. And he's on a dynamite contract for three more seasons. Like he's just too valuable. He's a, he's an incredible character guy. He's someone you want on your team long-term, even though he's a little older than people think. I think he wouldn't see 27 or 28 already. Um, I think he's a little, but, but I, and I can't really quibble with that. And I think what you said is, is hit the nail on the head. The Nets own so many picks from Phoenix and one from Philly and one from Dallas that I think you can trick yourself into the idea that they can do what some other teams have done where, Oh, we own so many picks from so many other places that we don't even have to worry about the fact that we don't control our own picks. We can, we can do whatever we think is optimal, even if it's a teardown because we're betting against all these other teams. And maybe at some point, even if you know, our picks are out of our control, we can luck into a high pick one of those teams, but those picks, the majority of them are 2027 and later 2023. Suns has already conveyed 2025. Suns looks like a pretty good bet right now to be like a low first round pick that obviously the Suns thing can get a little volatile post meal and the rest are 27, 28, 29. Like that's a long time to wait for that wager to pay off. So I agree with you that that's a big part of the Nets considerations here. Um, Vinnie Smith, you know, Royce O'Neal, I mean, those are the names that you hear more around the Nets, you know, like would the Lakers or the Nets, you know, look at a deal with like 17, you know, 17 for 21 and Royce O'Neal, it probably makes more sense for the Lakers than it does the Nets. I think those are the kinds of trades that you might see potentially on draft name more so than in the Cal Bridges trade. Yeah. I've heard the Nets are asking pretty steep prices for both of those wings from teams that have inquired about them. I know Cleveland is going to kind of be desperately searching around for, for wings and the Nets do need to save a little money. That's one thing the Nets, once they, once they have Cam Johnson back, A, they have a million wings and B, if they retain Cam Johnson, they're going to be right at the tax for a team that isn't worth being at the tax for. So I could see like a, one of those guys moving in, in a, in a cost cutting move that also brings back the draft asset. But from what other teams have told me, they are asking a ton for both of those guys, a real first round pick equity. That's probably bigger, as you say, than moving up four picks in the, in the draft. But things don't get really serious until honestly, this afternoon, today and tomorrow. You know, everybody's kind of posturing right now, these past few days, you know, in terms of asking for the moon and then the prices are going to come down, I think, you know, leading up to draft night. There's also the possibility, and I'm not sure how much I buy this, that the Nets look at the Portland situation and say, well, why can't we position ourselves to get Damian Lillard and keep Mikhail Bridges and not, not go for number three and Simons with all the picks I just, I just talked about. As I've said before, I think that would be a pretty, a pretty interesting debate within Nets ownership and front office altogether, making that decision. Whether Dame at his age and at that salary, which is huge and worth it, Damian Lillard, first team, second team, all NBA level players still coming off the best season of his career. Whether that's the guy to cash in the chips for, depend a little bit on how many chips you're cashing in, right? Like you hear people around the league now saying, well, did the Bradley Beal trade kind of renormalize the market for some of these mega contracts? I'm not, I'm not sure that's the case considering the no trade clause and just that's a one, one off, but it's an interesting, interesting thought process, if the price were right, I think you'd have to consider it. If it ends up being like all the chips, that's a tougher, that's a tougher question for the Nets, knowing that at least a couple of teams like Miami are going to be sitting there saying, well, we're, we're ready now with a team that's ready to win now, and we're, we're ready to up the ante a little bit. Yeah. I also just, I'm not sure that there's a huge appetite on Portland's side to trade Damian Lillard. You know, I just think that, you know, they're going to build a statue of this guy when he retires and he started his career there, they want him to end his career there, they really value, you know, everything that he does, having him around their young players, they think he's in his prime, they think they can win now, they want to make another run at, at being competitive here, making the playoffs and saying, Hey, if we have the best player on the floor, we have a chance in any series against anybody in the West, maybe excluding the Denver Nuggets. Well, the Nuggets exist and are going to be really, really good. Well, I just keep coming back then to Zion, not because I necessarily think any of this is really, really real and really, really imminent. I agree with, I mean, the teams that have called Portland about three have been shoved away pretty aggressively. Have you heard that same thing? Like it's just, it's just not realistically attainable. Have you heard that? Not for what's being offered. Um, so, so I, I, you know, them making the pick, I don't think is just posturing. I don't think it's just a negotiating posture and, and they really are looking to trade it to please Dame and they're just trying to up the ante. I think as stewards of the organization, I really do think they would like to make the pick and try to tweak the team around Dame and at least get Dame to give them to the trade deadline to figure out how good they are with that construction of the team of Lillard, Simons, Sharpe, Grant, Nerkic, Scoot, bring back Theibel or Reddish and Drew Eubanks and Trendon Watford, use the MLE, the big mid-level to fill out the bench. Not sure that's good enough. But the other question is, is like the other iteration of this, where they go and get a big time player, is that team good enough where they, where they trade the number three pick and Simons for a big time player, are you throwing sort of good money after bad and ending up in like a slightly better place, but ultimately the same place that that's the debate worth having, I think. Yeah. If a big time player is out there, which I'm just not sure he is, the problem is that like, there's not a lot of teams that, you know, are looking to take that big step backwards and, you know, enter like into a rebuilding situation and trade one of their, you know, maybe their best player for the number three pick. And that's where I think this is where the hurdles are in terms of like getting fair value for that pick. What are you hearing on Zion? Like, is this, is this, are we just spinning our wheels for no reason? I mean, I said it a week ago that I would be very, very surprised if Zion got traded and, and nothing hasn't changed. Nothing has changed. Yeah. I mean, I, I don't see Zion getting traded. Um, you know, they were the number one team in the West when he, when he got hurt, um, you know, if he's healthy, he's a top five player in the NBA. I mean, when he's played, he's been incredible. You know, like everybody's searching for that type of player. I'm just flashing back in my mind to the Zion Williamson draft, the amount of hype that there was around this guy. I mean, the season that he had at Duke was so incredibly impressive. I mean, he might be the best athlete in the league. He can handle, he can pass, he can shoot. You can play him in any position. And I don't, I just don't, you know, like it's going to be so hard. They haven't to, to really cash in their chip and like, and trade Zion Williamson at this point with all the noise around him now, I just, you know, I, I don't, I don't see it, but you know, anything can happen, I guess tomorrow. Yeah. You know, it's just such a, it's just such a tough question on multiple fronts, like from both perspectives, the risk of, of if it, if he hits for another team and he's just starting a five-year contract, he's just starting it now, like, it's not like new Orleans is under any time pressure at all. He's 22 years old and it's not even a bad contract, even given his health issues, like it's, it's the, it's the mini young guy, max, you can totally live with that and live with the risk. And it's got all the stipulations in the way that it works. Um, from Portland's perspective, if this were, if I, and again, I'm with you, like, I, it's hard to know what to believe at this time of year, there's a ton of posturing, the reason I keep this discussion alive is because although I've heard the same stuff on both ends of this, that you've heard, the unlikeliness of Zion being traded, Portland taking number three and using it on a young player being more than just a posturing stance, this feels like the one where, as you said, when things get on the clock, a lot can happen in the next 48 hours. It's the one where there's like enough smoke that I'm not extinguishing it completely. And from Portland's perspective, you think, well, you know, he was at his healthiest and most committed when he was here working with, working out in Portland around Nike, right. In, in the off season. And I think he's a guy that Dame would be interested in trading that pick for. And if it hits, it's a once in a lifetime chance. It's a once in a lifetime chance. The if is obviously bigger with Zion than almost any player in the league. And this is an organization that, by the way, I don't know how much this matters to their franchise psyche, but a lot of the injury ifs for them have gone the very worst possible ways in the most high profile spots for a long, long time. Like there are some injury scars in Portland, metaphorical scars and literal ones that have really hurt that franchise over the years. The other thing is like, let's line up the team just for fun. This is just fun, just fun. We're having fun. And then we're going to get to draft stuff. If your team is, let's say you trade Simons and three for Williamson, it may be more, maybe you got to trade even more. I don't know what the hell, I don't know. I don't know you. Okay. So your starting five is Lillard. I guess sharp. Let's say they re-signed Jeremy Grant, Zion and Nurkic for now, for now, that's your starting five, probably. Off the bench, you have all the guys that I just mentioned. It's not a great bench. There's not a lot of proven guys off that bench. Shadyn Sharp was the best guy off their bench toward the end of last year. You got all the guys I mentioned. You got Jabari Walker, who I thought was pretty solid. Re-signed Theibel, whatever you end up doing. That team's good. It's a good team. It should be an unbelievable offensive team. You have two of the 10 best offensive players in the league if they're healthy in Dame and Zion. Defensively, I just don't know how they survive well enough to be even a credible defense if you're playing Sharp, Lillard, and Zion together. That's where I think Nurkic, not quite being the same guy, comes back to hurt them a little bit, and that's a position that they probably need to upgrade, and I can hear people saying, well, you can't compete with Denver, so what are you even doing, but the rest of the West is in a state of flux, and you can't always live in a, well, we can't compete with the number one team state of mind. That's the one that would keep me up at night. Ultimately, it would depend what I thought about Scoot as a franchise-level building block, and if I were bullish on Scoot, I probably can't do it, I just can't do, I can't absorb the injury slash whatever else risk is going on, but it's a tough one. Yeah, I mean, I just, I keep going back to 2019, that incredible season that Duke, shooting 75% for two, you know, just, Zion was must-watch TV. You know, Zion was the victor of that draft. People were saying, this is a generational prospect. This is the best prospect we've seen since LeBron James. That was four years ago. When Zion has played 26 points a game in 32 minutes, the guy is- You're talking me into it now. You're talking me into a trade that's probably not even on the table. You're talking me into it. He's unstoppable offensively, you know, so it was just like, if you're going to trade it for anybody, I mean, here's the thing, I'm not a doctor, so like, I'd have to get my doctors on the line with New Orleans doctors, exchange the medicals, say, you know, what is the likelihood of him staying healthy, and then I'd probably want to have like a face-to-face meeting with Zion and say, Zion, where is your head at, you know, like, are you, do you want to get out of this rut that you're in with this crazy woman that's tweeting at you nonstop, you know? Like, come, so like, that would be the only type of trade that I would entertain. I don't really see it happening, you know, but man, Zion is a hell of a talent. Yeah, it's a tough one. That's the toughest one, and like I said, Portland, you got a lot of holes to fill. They don't have a lot, any holes offensively. You got a lot of holes to fill defensively and roster-wise. That team could be good enough to at least catch Denver's eye, and, you know, again, I keep saying this, like, who else in the West do you feel like has a stable two-year roadmap to greatness? And the obvious answer is Phoenix, and I do think, like, I did the Beal thing the other day. Like, I am probably a little bit on the optimistic side of both that trade and how that team projects, and by the way, from what I'm hearing, that trade is not done yet, but from what I'm hearing, the plan is tentatively, I think Washington's getting all the seconds and all, with some of the mechanics to be worked out, because there's a third team involved, all or almost all the first-round pick swaps that Phoenix can do. And the Jordan Goodwin coming to Phoenix thing was kind of a small little prize for Phoenix, so I think Washington's getting almost everything there, but, you know, like, at the same time, is that team so much better than the keeping Simons a number three team, that it's worth the upgrade given Zion's health risk? That's a really tough question. The one, the other one, Mark Stein reported last night that, and I want to read it exactly, because he phrased it the way he wanted it phrased. League sources tell the Stein line that the Clippers have left various rival teams with the impression, through their draft week conversations, that they are at a minimum attempting to gauge Paul George's trade value, and to hear some describe it, giving real consideration to the idea of disassembling the Kawhi Leonard-Paul George tandem. So, like, what that means is teams have talked to the Clippers and maybe kind of come out of the conversations thinking, huh, are they sniffing around, like, what they might be able to get for Paul George? We're not sure. And then some of those teams have been like, but are they maybe just busting up the whole thing? Like, there's nothing definitive there. But immediately that started speculation of like, well, Paul George for number three? Is that a thing that the Blazers would do? What is your reaction to that? My sense is that people are looking at some of the candidates that are, that the Clippers are looking at with the 30th pick and saying, you know, these aren't players that you're looking to, you know, maximize your winning window with right now. We're talking about guys like Derrick Whitehead, 18 years old. Ryan Rupert just turned 19. Gigi Jackson, youngest player in the draft. Tristan Vukcevic. You know, these are young, talented players who are not by any means ready to help a team right now. And so they're saying, oh, maybe the Clippers are getting ready for a rebuild. Percy, I don't really subscribe to that theory. I just think that the Clippers are looking at the roster and say, like, we need to have fine talent, man. This is a very, very deep draft. There are some really interesting young guys who are falling, you know, for one reason or another, you know, whether it's medical concerns or just, you know, they're just, they're just not physically ready, you know, to bad interviews, you know, or whatever Gigi Jackson's case. And so I think that that, that might be, I don't want to speak on Stein's behalf, but I think that might be where some of that is, is coming from. And so, yeah, I just, I don't, I would be very surprised if, you know, the Clippers just hit reset on this thing right now. It doesn't seem to be where they're at, but I haven't explored that enough. If I'm, if I'm Portland, like number three for Paul George, who's been injured a lot is nothing I can entertain. And I'm a, I'm a, remember I'm hashtag Paul George is a boss. Like Paul George is amazing. You know that I'm blocked by Paul George on Twitter. What'd you do? I have no idea. I actually asked him once like, Oh, why am I blocked on Twitter? He's like, I don't know. I don't remember. I must've said something that he didn't like when he was in the draft or whatever a million years ago. And even though he doesn't know he, he, he doubled, you're still blocked. I'm sorry. I didn't. Obviously he probably after that interaction, he was like, yeah, I'm going to keep that that blocked like through him. So I like it. I let you look, commit to it. Um, here's what I've heard about the Clippers about two days ago, the buzz I started to hear was not trade related, but that the Clippers were at least considering in the event that Kawhi Leonard, who's eligible for an extension in July and Paul George, who's eligible for an extension of September. I might have those two flipped around, but I think those are the correct dates for them in the event that they ask for an ironclad four-year max extension, a piece that the Clippers were actually prepared to put up a fight. I'm not a hundred percent sure this is true. This is just the buzz I've been getting that they're prepared to have a discussion about. Listen, guys, like you don't play, you play, you've played like half the games together. We can't give you going into your late thirties. Ironclad guaranteed all the years extensions. Would you have a reasonable discussion? This is what I've been saying since the end of the season about a two plus one, about a two plus partial, about just something to acknowledge the reality of what has happened in the last four years when yes, you got us to a place we've never been before as a franchise, the conference finals, but also you're just, both of you are hurt all the time. And the minute we ramped up Kawhi to postseason intensity this year after a pretty careful load management plan, he got hurt again. And I think maybe that buzzing around the league has created the secondary ripple of other teams thinking, oh, well, those are pretty imminent decisions. Are there, are there next level decisions after that? That's what I, that's what I think. You want to go back to the draft? Sure. Rapid fire. Precious little talk at, wait, is there any more Portland stuff? Have we done all of it? I think we've done all of it, right? There's no, as of now, if both you and I were betting money on it and we are not, I think you and I would bet on stability that Portland makes the third pick and Zion stays in New Orleans. But obviously I would, I would be barfing in my toilet if I bet a lot of money on it, like in the hours leading up to the draft. This is the NBA. Anything can happen. Precious little buzz about Houston at four and Detroit at five. You released a new mock yesterday with Jeremy Wu. Are they just making those picks at this point? I mean, teams are still trying to jostle around, but what do we hear about those two teams? All indications are that, you know, from around the league, people I trust is that people were just are, are penciling in a man Thompson into that spot. He had a fantastic workout there. Apparently probably his best one. I know that, you know, so I, I just, I don't, I think that a man Thompson is probably going to be the pick there. There's still a lot of question marks about around Harden, you know, is that window closing there? And so they just, it's going to be very hard for them to is, is the Harden to you, you mean what, what, what are the Houston? You know, I mean, it's like, I don't, you know, a month ago or three weeks ago, it was like, Oh, Harden to Houston done deal. You know, like it's the, the story has completely flipped since then. And so I just think Houston is going to go into tomorrow with the assumption that we don't know what's going to happen. Harden. We're going to take the best player we can at four. And I love a man Thompson, man. This guy is a mega, mega town. I just actually working on a kind of an OTE thing. So I've been rewatching a lot of OTE stuff. Holy cow. Is this guy talented? I mean, if I'm a Houston Rockets fan, I'm very, very excited to have him on my roster. So I think a man Thompson at four and then five to me is where the draft really starts with Detroit. You know, the, we all kind of had, had, had, had Kim Whitmore there at five. Initially a lot of teams have moved off that, you know, we're hearing different things now, you know, a Jaris Walker, potentially a lot of them, a SAR Thompson buzz there at fives of the Thompson twins could go back to back four to five. I mean, you hear teams like Utah would love to trade up with nine and 16, but I don't think that ownership is going to be very, you know, is going to be very excited about trading down. They had some opportunities to trade down last year at number five with Jaden Ivey and ownership said, no, no. So I don't think that I think they're going to be standing. Pat is my understanding. And it feels like, you know, a SAR Thompson right now, but that's very tentative at this stage. The two teams that other teams tell me they've heard either from the most or just the most, just no, not noise, just like activity from our Atlanta and Dallas. And that may be not the most, but among the kind of busiest Atlanta is picking at 15. Dallas is picking at 10. Obviously they've been linked in sort of fake trades in which they swap those picks with, with stuff going to Dallas. What if pick, pick one of those teams, like where we're both home, like what, what is, what is actually going on with those teams? Yeah. I mean, you've just heard this jostling going on between Atlanta, 15 Dallas to 10. I'm sure, you know, Atlanta, you know, people say would like Dallas to take John Collins. Dallas would much prefer Clint Capella. Sorry, I get it. I now get an electric shock. Anytime a guest on the podcast mentions a John Collins trade rumor. So I apologize if I appeared stunned for a second, I've designed my, I've designed a contraption to stop that from happening. And the question is, you know, where did the picks end up? You know, who has 15, who has 10? I think that, um, you know, Atlanta, uh, if they trade Capella, they would like to, to keep the number 15 pick where Dallas says, no, we need 15 and Capella, you know, we're not giving you 10. And so like, that seems to be where, where it's breaking down. Um, you know, a lot of chatter around Atlanta also regarding Deandre Hunter. Um, you know, could he be a guy that that's on the move potentially? I mean, we're all, everybody's looking at their cap situation. Exactly. They've got these extensions on the horizon. You know, they're going to be pushing up against that second apron and how good of a team are they, you know, like with all those extensions. And so that's where, you know, there's a sense that like Atlanta needs to do something either on draft night or in free agency to clear up their books. And, you know, but I, I think they'd like to keep that 15th pick at the same time. And so like, are they going to be able to accomplish both? Um, a lot of agents have said that that's a situation that they've actively avoided because they feel like their roster is very deep. You know, there's no, what is the pathway to playing time? You know, like they had AJ Griffin who probably was a top 10 rookie, you know, in terms of performance, you know, and he's got, you know, very high upside to basically, you know, like put on the bench and, you know, didn't play, you know, like the latter part of the season. And so, um, I think people are looking down there and say, like, there's probably other teams, other situations in that range, that 10 to 20 range would rather be at, because there's more of an opportunity for playing time there. You know, uh, you know, I don't want to send my guard there, Nick Smith, Cason Wallace, Hood Shafino. And then he's stashed in the G-League for two years. You know, I mean, that's, that's not what these guys are hoping for. They want to hit the runway right away and start playing, you know, as it was, that's realistic or not, I don't know. But that's, you know, some of what you're hearing out of the Atlanta front. Yeah, the cost-cutting thing is going to be interesting, not just for the Hawks, but with the new CBA looming across the board. And I've heard, I've heard everything with Dallas, for instance, from, I mean, obviously they're all, all these paths are possible. They could just draft 10. They could try to trade 10 for a player who helps them now with the Luka and probably Kyrie tandem and fits with those two, assuming that Kyrie goes back. And I've said all along, I think that's easily the likeliest outcome for now. I've heard, could they try to trade back if they can't find that kind of deal on the clock? If they can't find a player for 10, that really helps them win. Could they try to trade back in a cost-cutting move? Just to kind of clear a little bit of flexibility. I think those kinds of cost moves are going to be interesting to monitor. Utah, 9, 16, and 28, and a whole boatload of cap room. Maybe the team with the most immediate optionality in the NBA, not only do they have a whole boatload of cap room, they have unprotected Minnesota picks up the wazoo, unprotected Cleveland picks up the wazoo, extra other picks in the wazoo. They could do, I mean, if they actually wanted to make a run at 3, which I don't think they do because the price is so prohibitive, they could do what we always thought the Thunder might do and what the Thunder have done kind of in piecemeal mode over the years of like, here's some extra picks, a lot of them. Can we get from 9 to wherever? I haven't heard much chatter about that. Have you? They just have so much stuff. Oh, I've heard that they've reached out about 5. They reached out about 6. They've reached out about 7. The sense among teams is that they feel like they need to get ahead of Washington if they want to draft Anthony Black. The coaching staff, from what I've heard, is very high on Anthony Black. They've got a big gaping hole there in the backcourt. He could come in and start right away, be their starting point guard. Him and Collin Sexton would be kind of an interesting backcourt there. But I don't think that any of those teams are doing that. It's kind of viewed right now as the tiers of the draft. There's Victor. And then it's Scoot and Brandon. And then from 4 through 9, that's a big tier. I would kind of split it up in half there. But after 9 is where it really falls off. We're talking about Taylor Hendricks and Jarris Walker and Cam Whitmore and Anthony Black. One of those guys is going to be there at 9. The question is, are they going to settle for the 9th best player in that tier? Could they trade out? I don't know. Like you said, they have a lot of flexibility. They can go a lot of different ways. But I think 9 is also a pretty interesting spot to be in the draft if a Whitmore or a Taylor Hendricks is there. One thing I'm pretty confident Utah is not going to do is splurge on a free agent who really doesn't fit their timeline. They have all this cap space. But the free agency class is pretty weak. I like the idea of Van Vliet for them just to get a floor general there. But I don't think that's a thing that is going to happen based on what I've heard. Just an interesting team. Ditto for Indiana who has, what, 7-26-28 or something like that. And 32, which was a lottery night, sort of flipped the right way for them to get 32. That's a Houston pick, is it not? I can't even remember whose pick that is. I know a lot of teams have called Indiana to get to 7. They're another team that has a bunch of picks and cap space this summer. What are you hearing about them? I think there's a lot of options on the table for them. They could trade down. They could trade out. My sense is that there's a lot of talent in this group. It's going to be hard for them to move off that pick. You see this every year. Teams get these players in for workouts. They do all this research on them. And they fall in love with the talent. In this case, I think it's very much justified. You look at a guy like Asar Thompson, for example. If he's there at 7, I'm not sure he is. That's going to be hard for them to move off that. Or Jairus Walker or someone like that who could actually really fit their roster right now. My sense is that ownership is being very patient in Indiana. Which is kind of a far cry from how they were 5 or whatever plus 10 years ago. They are looking at what happened in Denver. The way that they built their championship team. And they're saying, guys, let's not cut any corners. For us to trade the number 7 pick for DeAndre Hunter or someone like that doesn't make a lot of sense. Let's get the most talented player we can get here regardless of position. Let's just build for the future. Because we have something very promising we're building here. Tyrese Halliburton, maybe the best passer in the NBA. Ben Mathurin had a good rookie year. Miles Turner had a rejuvenated season. They've got some very interesting young guys on top of that. So I think my guess is Indiana stands pat. But if people keep adding on more and more to these trade offers, maybe it just gets to the point where they have to make a deal. It's going to be an interesting night. I just keep coming back to Portland at 3. And the fascination that everyone has about what they're going to do there. And even if there's just a 2%, 5%, whatever, chance of a 3 for Zion Swap being actually in play, that's got to be awfully tempting. It's got to be awfully tempting. Even though Scoot is also awfully tempting. If you take Scoot and Dame gets mad, you've got to be prepared to live with that. We talked about it. But don't you know that's coming? If this guy's in your building every single day, watching Scoot Henderson work out, watching Scoot Henderson film, sitting in on their draft meetings, talking strategy, don't you think they've had this conversation with him? I would assume so. And also, all these people are human beings. I'm sure people are torn in multiple directions and have multiple things that they'd like to see happen or things that they're debating between and feel strongly about on both sides. And we saw with Beal, and Beal and Dame have been connected for so long as these giant contracts in the will they, won't they kind of thing. We saw with Beal that Washington was basically able to... Everybody washed their hands of it looking more or less okay. Washington went to Beal and was like, I know you want to win and you want to win here. I don't think we can do that on your timetable. Let's take care of this in a way that makes you happy and us happy and tells the world we knew all along that your priority was to win in Washington and we just couldn't make that happen. And so this was the situation. Optically, I think that was a good move for Washington, good move for Beal. And I don't know what's going to happen with Dame, but like you said, you think they would know the answers to these questions with 40 hours left before the draft. Anything else you want to hit before you get out of here? You want to talk about Toronto? What do they do on draft night? I don't know. We talked about Siakam and Ananobi. Gary Trent opting in and presumably getting an extension was kind of interesting. Interesting for both sides. You look at Masai Ujiri's history. This guy is not afraid to take a swing. He did it with Kawhi. Kawhi was hurt. He didn't want to be... There were question marks about whether he wanted to commit to Toronto long-term. They took him on a rental for one year. I think the Raptors are a fascinating team because they could go in so many different directions on draft night. What do they want to do? Do they want to trade up? Do they want to go get a star? Do they want to tear it down? I don't know. Masai seems like the kind of guy who does not give a... He will take a swing. He came into a press conference at Brooklyn. Who knows what they're going to do on draft night? That's kind of an interesting storyline because they have a lot of talent like Pascal Siakam. 24-8, six assists last year. OG Anunobi, one of the best two-way players in the league. Gary Trent opting in. Scotty Barnes is Rookie of the Year. Their situation is still very attractive. I think if you're ranking the futures of NBA teams, they have to be in the top 10. You're talking about ownership and their fan base and the city that they're in. I think Toronto is going to be a really interesting team to follow on draft night. Yeah, for sure. For sure. The interesting thing about Siakam is... I think the jury's out. He's not a number one option on a great team. That's not what he's going to be. But he's played like that now for several seasons in terms of how much the ball is in his hands and how much he commands all the attention and runs the offense. It would be interesting to see him transition back if they ever were to move off of him. The team getting him would presumably want to do so to transition him back into a secondary, number two option kind of role. It'd be interesting to see how he would adapt to that. I think fine, but it would be... There is just such a duplication of not just skills but sort of style between Andunobi and in particular Barnes and Siakam that at some point, unless somebody makes a leap as an outside shooter between Pascal and Scottie, at some point, one of those guys is going to have to move and it's not going to be Scottie because he's going to be the future of the team. But to your point, that doesn't have to be now. It doesn't have to be now despite the salary pressure and the contract time till pressure. There's a lot going on, Jonathan Gavone. We have a lot of work to do. I'm heading into the city for a whole bunch of meetings. You got to just get into your bunker with nine phones like Joe Dumars and get to landline work and get a landline just in case somebody's got to reach you and cell reception is down. Do you have a landline? I like the idea of you having like a red phone on your desk just in case. No, maybe I need one. I haven't had one ever, honestly. So maybe that's something I need to look into. Pay $30 a month for nothing. For the security of the call could come to the landline if need be. Jonathan Gavone, your coverage is second to none. Buckle up. Try to take like a 20-minute power nap. Get ready. Thank you, sir. Thanks, Zach. Have a good one.