Miami Heat: Pat Riley presser; who was he speaking to? | Five on the Floor

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Typically, when Pat Riley has a press conference, particularly if he hasn't had one in roughly a year, which is the case here, he spoke to the media at Family Fest, but wouldn't talk about basketball. Typically, we get like four or five days out of it. Like we are literally, we're sitting there plotting, okay, Pat talked about this guy and that guy and that guy. We were struggling to come up with 20 minutes off of today. And I'm going to get into the reasons why this was so uneventful today. And there are a lot of reasons that come together. But this is the question that Greg, I think, we're going to pose today, because I always pose it with Pat Riley pressers, because he comes in with an agenda, there's usually an opening statement, a closing statement there was today, by the way, we'll get into both of those and why he went those two directions, in my opinion. But also the question that has to be asked is not the question of him, it's a question about the press conference itself, which is who is he speaking to? That's always what I'm trying to take away. So before we get to today, I want to go back in time a little bit on some other press conferences that he's had, okay? If you remember during the big three era, when LeBron James 2014 was making his decision, it was clear that Pat was speaking to LeBron, he just didn't do it particularly artfully, if you recall, and it pissed LeBron off, right? You know, with some of the things that he said, and do you have the guts and a lot of the phrasing that we've taken from that period of time, and of course, sort of accidentally revealing, you know, LeBron was having another child and all the rest of that stuff. He was speaking to LeBron. So he's speaking to a player who was a free agent on his own team. That's who he's speaking to that time. There have been other times that he was speaking directly to media members who irritated him. For instance, some of us and our friend, Barry Jackson, who we love to death, Florida Sports Buzz. I remember this was prior to them getting Jimmy Butler, where Pat was kind of very combative with the media about what they could do and they couldn't do, and there are obstacles, but there are none, and sort of going over the cap sheet in a way that basically saying, you guys don't know what the hell you're talking about. So he was talking to us, okay, to the media, who was criticizing sort of a down period for the Heat at that stage where they had signed a bunch of bad contracts, which he didn't really want to acknowledge were bad contracts because he thought they could be flipped, and ultimately, a lot of them were flipped, as we know. Okay, so sometimes, again, he's speaking to the media. Sometimes he's speaking to pending free agents. You know, he was speaking to Goran Dragic that time. You remember when he was a free agent, you know, no more hidden faces, you know, smiling faces with hidden agendas, which was kind of a shot not at Dragic, but at LeBron previous, right? There are other times that he's speaking to the fans and trying to sort of calm them down or let them know that there's a certain direction that the franchise is going in. I thought he did some of that today, and I'll get into that, and then there's times where he's just simply speaking to other teams, and he's using these forums to do so because he does not do a lot of leaking like other executives do, and neither do many in his front office, and so it's an opportunity for him to get out there and say something which he may not entirely believe, but he wants others to believe it. He did that today, too, in my opinion, so I don't think this was as much speaking to us today. I don't think it was speaking to his own players. He didn't do what he did in the past couple of these where he was kind of a call out to Bam that he wanted him to take more shots or to call out to his own coach, which he's done before, by the way. Today, he called him the best coach in the league, but in previous press conferences, he's kind of called out Spoelstra subtly for various things about how Pat wants to maybe go bigger or maybe Eric's got to find a way to get him more shots. He didn't do any of that today, okay? No call outs to Bam, no real call out to Jimmy, and I'll get to his answer on that, too, because that was to my question about some of Jimmy's struggles later in the postseason, etc. He just said that Denver played him differently or game planned him in a different way than other teams had. So, Greg, as I turn to you here, and then we'll go through some of the specifics, I thought that this was Pat was kind of speaking to himself. He wanted to get stuff out there about the journey of this whole franchise, so he started with talking about the five builds, which I thought this was the fourth build, but I guess he's extending the fourth into the fifth at this stage, and then he wanted to close by sort of saying thank you to you not as has. It felt like those were the things that Pat wanted to do kind of for himself. Those were things he felt were important to talk about the journey, be nostalgic about the franchise, say something nice about the Arisons, talk about how heat culture was established. He said myself and Chris, his wife, and also Mickey and Madeline Arison, he spoke that he said that was heat culture when he came together. These were all prepared statements, so he wanted nostalgia for that stuff, kind of an acknowledgment, I think, to a certain degree of what he's brought to the organization and what the Arisons have brought to the organization. A great send-off at the end, an emotional send-off for UD in which he actually choked up a little bit and was teary-eyed as the press conference ended, but other than that, to me, today was a whole lot of nothing with the exception of one case where I think he was speaking to another team and another case where he was speaking to the fans. Go. I think you're spot-on, but I would also extend it to, he's speaking to the league at large and to any league observer, aggregator at large, because I think there were some comments that you could see where he was going. Some of the things that stood out to me directly was how quickly Tyler Hero was inserted directly next to Bam out of bio in terms of the core group, kind of the pillars, I think, something to that degree is what he called them. Obviously, what he said about Jimmy, he can't say enough about him. He did kind of—and Ethan, let me stop and just say that they should let you get more questions because you get great answers out of Pat always. And here was another one. When he talked, he basically said, right now he acknowledges it's kind of on Jimmy. But he also said that he wants to get him help. And I think he kind of addressed some of the stuff. You got him to talk about some of the things we all are wondering about. And so shout out to you for that. I think that it was interesting there because I also thought in him highlighting Tyler, calling him lethal, late in games, what he is as a building block for this team. He's building equity with soundbites in those moments. And so we'll see how much equity he's built. But he's definitely making it clear that Tyler Hero is not just some person. He's a player that he's willing to give up for nothing. The other big takeaway for me was, as he acknowledged the financial stuff, he did say, we're at a place now in this league where first-round picks need to be valued and their salary slots. And he even referenced the fixed rates of the salaries of those players and all of that. And I thought that that was an acknowledgment that if they indeed don't find a deal prior to this Thursday, they're going to invest in a player that they plan on having around and that they think can be a part of this mix and contribute. So those were the major takeaways. But other than that, he was waxing poetic on June 20th. What else is he supposed to do on June 20th? The most historic beloved day in Heat history, I'd have to say, because they've won two titles. We're going to do a fun thing on Playback about it. Well, Ethan, I'll let you tee that up better than I. But it's June 20th. He was trying to be sentimental and he almost got out unscathed. And it was a great shout out to you at the end. And other than that, let's get on with the offseason. Yeah, it almost felt today like he did this because he kind of felt he hadn't done it in a while. Like it is weird timing where, you know, you're just coming off of the bill thing. You don't want to talk about that. You can't talk about certain things. And he acknowledged that from the very beginning. OK, we said there are rules, but there are no rules, kind of like there are obstacles, but there are none like sort of the same thing. He so he wasn't going to talk about other free agents. He can't. It's tampering. But he also didn't talk about his own. OK, he really only talked about like a handful of players on his roster. Caleb Martin's name didn't come up. Duncan Robinson's name didn't come up. Max Struce's name and Gabe Vincent's names didn't come up. And I was a little unclear on whether or not we could ask about them. I feel like we could have. And he could have answered on them because they're their own guys. The league year hasn't ended to this point. So they're not officially free agents at this stage. So I kind of felt like he could have. But and I was kind of teeing up to ask it, but it never came back around to me. Nobody asked the question about either of them. I don't know exactly what he would have said. The only players on his own team that he spoke about, he was asked specifically by me about Jimmy. He came in and this is where we're going to spend most of our focus. He came in with the idea of talking about BAM, but particularly Tyler, I think, for two different reasons. And then he mentioned Kevin Love and he who is a free agent, by the way, at the same time as Max and Gabe are. So if you could talk about Kevin Love, he could have talked about Max and Gabe. He brought up Kevin Love. But in the context of being a at the trade deadline, he was asked if there was anything in retrospect that he believes he could have done to make the outcome different. And he said no. OK. And went through kind of that they didn't want to give up what others wanted. And we've talked about that here on the podcast and some of what others wanted. A lot of teams wanted Kayla Martin and Max Strews, actually. But he brought it up in the context of being able to get a guy like Kevin Love who changed the locker room. He said that we've talked about that, too. But and then also in the context of this idea of being able to add buyout guys, which is something that he talked about when he got into the whole second apron situation, which with the tax, which is something we talked about with Bobby when we had Bobby Marks on. But otherwise, he didn't talk about any of his own guys. He talked about Smo. I mean, it was really a pretty limited press conference. And at least half of it was more about nostalgia and overall course than it was about any specifics. OK, so it did kind of feel like this one was just put in there because he knows he hasn't talked in a while and they don't know if they're keeping their pick for 18 and 18 on Thursday night. And if they do, he probably will talk after it's over. I know Adam Simon is going to talk no matter what. So we don't know if we'll hear from Pat at that stage. But it just didn't feel like there was anything momentous here. So let's get into the two things that he did talk about that I thought were mean. And you mentioned one. He came in planning to talk about Tyler here. OK, like there's no question. And it's in complete contrast to a couple of years ago where he talked about Jimmy and Bam being the core and then didn't mention Tyler and then was asked about Tyler. I probably I think it was by Will Mansell at that point. And then he added Tyler. Today was the opposite. He made sure to talk about Tyler at the beginning, and he talked about Tyler more than he talked about anybody else. And this is all I want to say about this. And this is not because I want Tyler to be traded because I don't value Tyler. None of that. I value Tyler as a player here. He's been he's been a great find for them. He's done a lot of the right things since he's been here. He's gotten better as a player. This is not personal preference. I'm just saying, based on my experience of covering Pat Riley for the past 27 years, what that means. OK, you seem good, fellas. You seem good, fellas. Greg. Absolutely. OK, I rewatched it the other day. OK, I don't know how I had time to realize. What am I, a clown? Do you like funny? Do you? Well, right character, but wrong scene. I know. OK, just as the first line that I could think of. Cash's character, Tommy. Jimmy's really excited. De Niro's character, right? Ray Liotta, may he rest in peace. They're excited because their guy, Tommy, is going to be a made man. Yeah, this is about three quarters of the way into a very long movie. OK, and Tommy goes and he's at his mother's and he gets all done up and he's got the he looks professional and they're all so excited. Right. And Jimmy and look, and they can't be in the Henry and Jimmy and Liotta's character, De Niro's character. They can't be in the ceremony because they're not Italian. Right. They're not. They can't be made. But but Tommy Pesci's character can be made. Right. And they're all waiting for him to be made. And then he goes in and we know that Tommy doesn't come out. OK, and then basically Jimmy gets the call. De Niro's character gets the call says there's nothing we can do. That was rolling through my head today as he was talking about Tyler here. Not to that effect, obviously. So please don't quote me on that. People are going to come back. But I appreciate because I know conceptually what you're saying. It's like, sorry, we had to make this sacrifice. We love you. But. But when he talks someone up, OK, just like when you're the guy's going to get made, but it hasn't happened yet. And I just I just got that feeling today. Like I got the same feeling I got when he talked up Hassan Whiteside and he was gone two days later and the same feeling I got. And I've talked about this before when he said he wasn't going to train anybody at the trade deadline way back in 1996. OK, February 22nd or whatever it was, we're not making any trades. And I went out to dinner and then I had a beeper at the time. That's how long ago this was. OK. And all of a sudden I got a beep to call the Herald office because Pat Riley's just traded five guys for five guys. And one of the guys he brought in was Tim Hardaway. It just it felt to me like he was doing too much. You ever heard that? Like he was he was going too far out. Not that not that the things he was saying about Tyler weren't true, because they are many of them true. He's been a great fourth quarter player and all the rest of it. But it's just he's devoting all his attention, all his talk to one guy. And meanwhile, when I asked him about Jimmy, he kind of diminished Jimmy a little bit. He didn't gush about Jimmy the way he gushed about Tyler because he's not trade. He's not trading Jimmy. That's true. But he did. He did. He did. He did gush about Superstar at the very beginning. But I understand where you're going with that for sure. But he gushed about Jimmy at the beginning. But to your point, he went way heavy on Tyler. But only those of us who watch him year over year, I think are really going to pick up on that, to your point. So like the listeners of the local podcast and such, I think will catch on. But the league at large is going to listen more to it as for what it is, not necessarily for what it's positioned as. And that's what I think will be fascinating as to as those soundbites travel, how they are absorbed by the parties they are intended for. Well, I already know how they are absorbed by the fans, because as soon as I tweeted his comments, NBA Central credited us and tweeted. I mean, they they just tweeted that that he said that Tyler was an anchor along with them, which is actually what he said. It's the exact quote. He said he was an anchor along with them on a bio and Jimmy Butler. And as soon as that got aggregated and tweeted out there, everybody, of course, who is not has not followed 27 years of Pat Riley press conferences in Miami, jumped to the conclusion that they're not trading Tyler, which is, I think, what the conclusion he wants out there, that we're not just giving this guy away. And Bobby Mark said that yesterday with us. Right. He said the same thing. He says he's not throwing. Yeah, right. He's not throwing like people are forgetting he's a good player. So, again, this is not me characterizing what Tyler is or isn't or anything else. This is just, again, from experience, I'm watching him come in with what was clearly, clearly an agenda to make sure. OK, I'm not saying smiling faces with hidden agendas. This was an open agenda to make sure everybody understood how much the Miami Heat value Tyler Hero and whether that's a message to the Portland Trailblazers like you're not going to get a player better than this. OK, back for Dame or whether it's a message for other teams around the league who have maybe tried to think, OK, well, you know, maybe Tyler has been involved in some of these trade talks so we can get a twenty three year old to guard who averages 20 plus on decent efficiency for cheap. I think this was a message. I think it was absolutely targeted to get it out there. And again, I don't think he necessarily wants the likes of us all parsing it because the whole idea is it's supposed to be taken at face value. But we just I just been through too many of these like, you know, exactly. It's just I mean, they're not trading anybody until they are. And then and they're going to talk up certain guys. But he did not talk up BAM in the same way. And I don't think it's because he values BAM less than Tyler. It's because there's no chance in hell of BAM out about him being traded. Yeah. No matter what the Portland Trailblazers might throw out there. So what a joke. Right. Exactly. All right. When we come back, we're going to talk about what I thought was a message to the fans. OK, so here's a message to other teams and what I thought was a message to the fans to kind of cool their jets here a little bit. And he didn't do it this time necessarily by calling them spoiled, which is something he's done in the past when he talked about big three heat fans and all that. But he kind of tried to make it clear why it is they may not do certain things that the fans want them to do immediately. Kept using the word patience. And we'll get into that here in a second. We do want to mention a great sponsor of the five reason sports. Here's the great thing about this one. You don't need to be patient. Like literally, if you go to Ocean's Finest dot com like right now, OK, and you can get the best variety of premium seafoods from jumbo shrimp and large snow crab legs to individually vacuum packed beautiful portions of Atlantic salmon, mahi mahi tuna and more. If you go to Ocean's Finest dot com right now, you're literally going to have seafood, premium seafood delivered to your door in the next couple of days. That's how fast it's going to get there to you. Forty years of experience here in Miami Ocean's Finest. But now the exact same seafoods that are delivered to the high end cruise line industry and five star dining establishments down here in South Florida and beyond, you can get them to your door. So check them out. Ocean's Finest dot com. You know, July 4th is coming around the corner. You want to have the best food for that. Get it from Ocean's Finest. Go to Ocean's Finest dot com. Next day delivery is available on most orders. So it's Ocean's Finest dot com. That's oceans with an S minus dot com. Live that healthier lifestyle. Great. Get food. And because you can eat it as you go, it remains fresher for lunch. Check them out at Ocean's Finest dot com. All right, Greg, here's what I thought was the message for the fans. OK, I thought Pat did a really skillful job today explaining the second apron situation and very consistent with what Bobby Marks had said to us. But again, not everybody listens to our podcast, so he needs to get it out to when you should. Not everybody does. So he got it out to a broader audience today to explain and to take some of the heat, I think, off the Harrison family on this stuff, because there is a perception. And we were on Twitter all day long that they don't want to spend. And so he made a few things clear today. One, there are in the tax. They're going to be in the tax. OK, so no matter what kind of magic Andy works and he talked about that, there's only so far you can avoid that once you have some of these contracts that stack up. Right. So that's the first thing is, look, that message was everybody's complaining that we don't spend. I mean, we're literally in the tax. OK. And then he said again that we basically said they're itching to win a championship. Not those exact words, but that it's been too long that Mickey has a commitment to this thing. OK, to give us the best chance to win. So those are all the kind of words that he fans want to hear, but they don't entirely 100 percent believe at this stage. And again, I'm just the messenger. OK, that's what's out there. But then he explained why the second apron is an issue going forward, particularly as Bobby Marks described as starting next season, because it's not just about the punitive tax that you get there and the additional money you need to spend, but it's the lack of resources that you're going to have in terms of vehicles to acquire additional players, whether it's not having exceptions, whether it's not being able to add a buyout player. And I thought Pat did a pretty good job of sort of explaining what that means when he talked about Kevin Love. He didn't talk about specific exceptions and players that require in the past, but he did mention. And it's a good point. I'd have to look back at what the rules actually were at that point, that if this was the big three or they wouldn't have been able to add guys like Ray Allen and Shane Battier. Right. Well, you said conceptually. And he's right, because what they're trying to negate right now is what the Heat did back then. So whatever form of it would have been taken away back then if these rules were instituted is what he was trying to convey. And I thought it was a masterclass. And you know why? Because it puts it in simple terms for fans and they understand. Oh, wait, I remember when the Heat looked like they needed a bunch of infusion of talent and they got Ray Allen and they got Shane Battier and they got Birdman, Birdman. And then like I think that was very, very smart of him to put it in those terms because it is precisely what that team would have had to go through had those rules been instituted back then, you know, just in relation to the salary cap in in that period of time. And that's such a good point, because it's to make it clear for Heat fans, particularly more casual Heat fans, to name two players like Ray Allen and Shane Battier who Heat fans watched play a direct role in championships makes that point clear. And so if you're a Heat fan who doesn't follow this thing so closely or isn't watching the cap sheet or hasn't studied the new CBA, OK, wait a second. We don't want to be in that position where we can't add players like that. So I get it. So it felt a little bit preemptive in some ways, like, OK, if we don't end up getting somebody, here's one of the reasons that we're and he kept saying he used. Well, he quoted a Springsteen song. He always does. I don't know if he mentioned he said he was going to do it. I don't know if he meant that. But he mentioned taking a wrecking ball to this thing, which is a Springsteen phrase. And he says, we're not going to do that. And I think, again, that means more Jimmy and Bam than anything else. But I also think it means to their cap sheet going forward and to their flexibility. And he kept talking about being patient. You know, he talked about being persistent. And there was another word he used, which was kind of pushing forward. But then he said, we're going to be patient. I thought he answered Beale to me. That's how he answered, not answered without. I agree with you without saying Beale's name. That's what he said. And I think it was a message to the fans. But I think it's also a message to Portland or to any of these other teams, which is, look, we'll wait it out. Like, we're not going to make a panic move here right now. And if you don't think, OK, that Portland, Cronin, whoever is running the show there in Portland right now, making the decisions, if they were that, they weren't paying some attention to what Perry said today. You're crazy. Everybody follows what others do in the league. Now, some of them will see it first on NBA Central or Central or one of these other places. But eventually they'll get video to get your context on it. And so I did think that there was something to him kind of putting a message out there to the fans, but also to outsiders. We are not we are. Look, we're not going to rush headlong into this thing and just do whatever the hell it is you want to do because our fans are pounding the table for a star. OK, so to me, that was for the other teams. That's the way he handled it. Also, for fans, it was a nicer way of saying what he said a couple of years ago when he basically said, all you and I'm paraphrasing here, all you MFs are spoiled. Because that's what I say. Leave that to me, Pat. I'll leave it to you. He didn't say that. Don't aggregate that. I'm just saying like, OK, so I'm just saying like what he made the whole he made the split between the the big three heat fans and the heat fans who were a little bit more patient. And I think that was also the purpose of talking about these bills. OK, and I remember three years ago, come back and doing a podcast after talking to some of the heat executives in Las Vegas where they had kind of explained to me and this was before they got Jimmy. OK, right before they got Jimmy, you know, kind of how this build process works, right? That you sort of accumulate assets, then you go get the guy who wants to come play for you. And then it's sort of, OK, now it's sort of a reset. And now we add to that. And Pat was making the point today, again, going back to Tyler with them and Tyler, he has two younger assets than he typically has in these kind of situations, again, making the point that we're not in a rush here. That's why I asked the Jimmy Butler question. And that's why he answered with, I wish I could hand pick the guy that could we could do it, but it's not that easy. So he understands that that that running mate needs to be acquired. I feel like he acknowledged it to you. He did. But he also he started with it. Jimmy doesn't need a pat on the head, just like I don't need a pat on the head. And we're similar in that regard. I don't know. I got the sense and I just total disclosure here. I don't know if he thought I was asking that for Jimmy or for Jimmy's camp. But I can tell you right now, full disclosure, I was not. It's just it's honestly, it's just a question that's come up with the fans, as I was saying. Do you feel an obligation to try to help me? Butler Bill? Yeah, right. It's the Jimmy Butler Bill. And I said he's been in the finals twice and one shot from the finals another time. And maybe I didn't skillfully ask it this time, but I basically said, you know, do you feel an obligation more so with your relationship with him and how that's evolved to get him a championship? I said, obviously, you want to win for yourself and for the organization and for others here, but specifically for Jimmy. And like I said, his response to that was that Jimmy doesn't need a pat on the head any more than I do. And then he kind of, you know, he talked about some of the things that Jimmy encountered as he went forward. So to sum all of this up, OK, number one, I think he's trying to get a message across to fans to be somewhat patient here and to other executives not to rush him. OK, we're going to do this on our time, on our terms when we find the situation to be right. And you're not going to drive us into a panic trade either because of Jimmy's age or our fans impatience or any of that stuff. At the same time, as I think he was conditioning the fans somewhat to say, OK, we're dealing with this apron situation. You don't really want us to lack the flexibility in the future that you think you want to select just because you want to go for it now. We're not going to blow this thing up just to appease everybody right now and put ourselves in handcuffs for the next few years, like, say, and he didn't say this, but like, say, Phoenix just did. Right. And I think your point here and you just we just were chatting on the side here is I do think he wanted to reiterate that they're in control. I agree with you. And I think that was part of the purpose of like, we are in control of the situation. I'm not asleep. He said at one point he was sleep deprived. And I know that's a meme that goes out there on Twitter. And Brady and I were joking about that after he's already probably got it out there. I don't think he intended that. But I just think just trying to make it clear to people they're in control. OK, they're working to get something done. They're impatient because they want to taste that champagne again. But again, they're not going to be rushed. But also we've got this really good 23 year old shooting guard who's made a lot of shots for the fourth quarter. We're not going to give him away, but. Well, we know Jimmy needs a sidekick. Right. So I think it was a little I think there was some stuff that was scripted, but he only talked for 29 minutes today. They cut it off after that. Typically, he'll say it up there and say, no, keep going. I remember a couple of times he said, no, no, no. Like even when Tim Donovan, the PR staff, is like, OK, last one going on a room, he'll be an all staffer. He was good to get out of there in 30. I think he want to say what he wanted to say. I think particularly the biggest thing he wanted to say was, I helped build this thing. Look at all the builds, all the rest of this. And also, we love you, D. OK, he wanted to show proper respect for you. I think those were two of his missions. Once he got those things done, told the fans to be patient, pumped up Tyler's value a little bit, at least in the way he was talking about him. I think he was good. I think it was. And again, you don't want to say too much. You got the draft coming up in two days. And you've also as we speak here and then you got free agency right after that. And so it's like you want to control the message that you give away without giving up too much. All right. We got one more great sponsor here, and then we're going to come back on the other side with a spy report. And now it's time for the spy report here on five on the floor, sponsored by Closure Investigative Agency, your trusted private investigative company, experienced professionals with over 25 years of private investigations experience. Their headquarters right here in South Florida, in West Palm Beach, where they proudly provide their investigative services nationwide. Their team is so good, so dedicated, so thorough, so professional, so aggressive that other private investigators use them to help solve their own cases. They got a proven track record of going above and beyond. And again, they're a full service nationwide private investigative firm. 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And that's kind of where we're at. And today, Chris Haynes on his podcast with Mark Stein. Okay. And again, they do a podcast together. And again, Chris has worked for a bunch of different outlets. He's with Turner Now. He's with Yahoo, et cetera. Read what he said today. Well, this was nine hours ago, and it's from the same show. And there's multiple clips flying around. But I want to give you this one first. Miami must sense that this could be the off-season Dame requests out. Dame doesn't want to rebuild or continue to play with younger guys. All indications are Portland keeps that pick. Then Dame will have a decision to make. I think that's why the Heat reversed course on Beal. That's a direct quote from Chris Haynes. And then the other big one that came out later on, and let me shift gears to our friends at NBA Central to find this one. And this was a lengthy one, but I'll do it quickly. Dame has made it clear that he wants to compete for a championship. He wants to continue, and he wants a roster that can get him there. He wants that now. He does not want to wait. He does not want to go to a rebuild, doesn't want to continue to play with younger guys to help them grow and get to that point. He wants to win. That's the two quotes from Chris Haynes that raise my eyebrows. Because it moves it down the road. And we've talked about, okay, how is this going to start moving down the road? So it starts with the hints, right? Okay. So those hints started a couple of months ago, but then there was the Showtime interview, which we talked to Sean Hyken about, right? Where Dame throws Miami out there, right? So he's openly flirting with another team, which is not something that he's typically done. Even when he had conversations with LeBron in a recent off season, he didn't talk about the Lakers publicly. Okay. So here we are. That's the next thing. So we said, okay, what's next after that? Well, then there was the weird Haynes report, which went on during the Beal stuff when the Beal stuff was closing out, where Haynes came out and said essentially that Portland may be more open to moving him, which I thought the point of view there was strange because typically Haynes comes in from Dame's point of view, not from the Blazers point of view or from the organization's point of view. So that's where I'm like, okay, the timing, we talked about this. The timing is interesting, but I don't, the source on that is not, not Haynes, but whoever he's speaking to is strange because Haynes would more be speaking for Dame typically. Well, now he's speaking for Dame. So, so this has moved. And now I think you can see why the heat have a certain level of confidence here, because I think they saw some of this stuff coming where it it's looking like it's all headed for this train crash on Thursday, which is that Portland does not seem inclined to trade that number three overall pick for a ready to win veteran, or at least they don't seem to be able to get the one that they want. I don't know what's going on in Toronto right now, but there's weird stuff. Trent's opting out, going to resign. It is, but is again, is Siakam enough? Is Ananobi enough? I mean, Hyken told us about conversations they've had. We know Maasai is incredibly difficult to deal with on this stuff. There've been more reports that have come out about that. So are they going to move someone? And is that person, whether it's Siakam or Ananobi going to be enough for him? There's the situation in New Orleans. All the reporting, Windhorse, others seem to be indicating that Zion is out of there. And then there's more reporting that Portland would prefer Zion to Brandon Ingram. I will say again, I mean, is Dame going to stay because of Zion? Like, can you trust Zion to play 50 games next season? I mean, yeah, on paper, you're talking about a young star who can be an absolute all NBA player. But I mean, he's played a third of the team's games over the past four years. Are you counting on that? So this is all headed for a collision. And this feels to me, Greg, and I don't know which one we said this on, but both sides need to save face. This is like a relationship breakup where neither one wants to be the one. Look, I wanted you, but you really didn't want me. This is passive aggressive BS that happens in a lot of different relationships in your life. OK, not yours specifically, but I'm saying where it's like, you know, I tried everything, but you didn't show me what you know. And I feel right now like both sides are trying to save face like Dame is trying to save face. He doesn't want to be the bad guy. He doesn't want to any more than Dwayne. And I go back to Dwayne. Dwayne didn't want to be. I dealt with all that. OK, late night conversation, 2016, 2015 before you were Dwayne's Chris Haynes. Well, I was getting texted to 30 at three in the morning at the time I was married. And I'll just say it was like, who is that? That's Dwayne. But but but I mean, this was going on during 2015 before Mickey came in and saved again. And that was more about money and contract and respect. It wasn't about who who I mean, Dwayne was, you know, wasn't who Dwayne was going to play with right at that time, I guess, because Chris was Chris's situation, you know, was still playing out. But it was 2015, 2016, where it's just Dwayne didn't want to be the bad guy like he didn't want and he didn't want to be the bad guy with Dwayne, because what are you going to do to your franchise icon? And they ended up losing the public relations battle to Dwayne. In this case, I don't think either side wants to lose it. But I'll say this. I mean, this Portland coming out and this report today that they they they want BAM, which is a complete everybody knows that's a complete idiotic nonstarter. The heat are not trading BAM there. Dame is not coming to and it was for Dame. Dame is not coming to Miami unless BAM is here. So none of that. It's the same thing as the Mitchell situation. So that doesn't make any sense. So I think just going back through all of it, you're like, OK, it seems to me like Portland is just and others are. I'm not the only one speculating. There's plenty are now. They want to save face like they want to say, look, we tried. We couldn't get you anybody. OK, and this is their message to the fans to Dame wanted out. And now we're going to do right by Dame. And on the other side, Dame doesn't want to just flat out do what Bobby Mark said on our party should do, just walk in there and say, please trade me. You know, he wants it to say, look, I gave them an opportunity. I tried. They couldn't make the trade to give me a chance to win immediately. And I just come back to this final thing and I'll let you close. Look, you cannot add two players to Dame in Portland. And I like their young core, but I'm talking about ready to play guys now like you cannot add two players to Dame in Portland to make them a top four seed right now. You cannot. OK, I in the West. But if Dame comes to Miami, there are favorites or co-favorites in the East immediately. I don't care what they add to Jimmy Dame and Bam. I don't care who else is here. Spole gets six guys at the JCC, literally like that's, you know, I'm saying. And they'll figure out a way. Run the point night. Right. Point. Right. Exactly. Except it's play the full play the four night or something. Well, that's pretty much what they did last season. Right. Like, so I mean, that's just they'll just do it again. But if you look at even if you go back to the first year with Shaq and Dwayne, they still had Eddie Jones, who was still on a Max type contract. But beyond that, they plugged it. I mean, you D had never been a starter before. OK. And then Damon Jones was a starter that year. And he thought so little of Damon that they basically let him walk over a little bit of money and years the next the next offseason. Christian Leighton are off the bench. I mean, right. So the point is, like, they've done that thing before. You can put pretty much anybody around those three guys, because here's the thing about it that's different than Durant, which is why they need to add depth in Phoenix, Durant, Beale and Booker. There's duplication. Jimmy Bam and Dame. It's like if you could take three guys and say, put the perfect big three together in terms of mix of experience, toughness out, at least two alphas. OK, two big time alphas in that time situation. And Bam's getting there to elite defenders to protect the other guy. Personality wise, professionally, basketball wise, it is perfect. To be honest, it's more perfect. I'm not saying it's better, but it's more perfect than LeBron, Dwayne and Chris, because LeBron and Dwayne had to play in same damn spot on the floor and it took them like a year and a half to figure that ---- out, even though they were two of the highest IQ players in NBA history. Jimmy Dame and Bam are going to need to figure anything out. And that's why the thing I'm more looking for is who's the dark horse Phoenix Suns like team who emerged in the in the KD and Beale sweepstakes and just came in out of nowhere. Who's that ready made contender where he goes there and he is, like you say, the favorite to win in the conference he plays in? Because like when people talk Brooklyn and they say, oh, well, they could have bridges and they'll trade for Siakam. You're still building a team that may take a couple of years to gel. There's lots of stuff. How's the coaching going to work? All that comes into play. I don't think Dame wants to leave Portland to go figure that stuff out. I think he wants it all figured out. He's the final piece of the puzzle and is acknowledged as such. And so where's the dark horse other contender that's going to come in and put their name in the hat to make this interesting? And is there one that's the other part? Well, this one's going to make you puke. And I would have to look at the financials of this to see if it actually be possible. But the one in the back of my mind is Philly. And I know I see we're not on video right now, but I'm looking at you. And I was trying to think of that today. I'm like, what's the Phoenix in this situation? And I'd have to look at the money and it probably isn't even feasible. But if you're looking for the guy to play with them, be OK to kind of take them over the top. It's Dame. It's Dame. I mean, it's Dame to do the things that harden Milwaukee, maybe. Right. Well, see, I know financially that's not feasible. I don't. I mean, unless I mean, what are you taking back, Drew? Yeah, I mean, I guess the point for Portland, I guess. I mean, unless it's a three way trade like I don't but I don't know what the point would be with Philadelphia either. So I don't again, I'd have to look at what Maury's assets are and the rest of that. But but but but I'm just I'm just saying, like, I was just thinking, OK, who can he play with right now? And you'd be like, the list is short because I can't think of many. And I'm sure after the show, we'll think of a couple. But to that point, that's why I think this is so instrumental in the heat, being patient. And that's why the big takeaway from this is that they got this show. I don't know if that's my big takeaway, but I will say it is. And we thank our friends are a closure investigative agency which can help us investigate this for us. I'm closer today than I was yesterday. I'll just say that I don't want to go that far, but I just I all of the tea leaves are literally drifting the same direction that we said they would, where it's like, OK, who does this benefit? Who does this benefit? Who does this benefit? And now we're at the point where Chris Haynes, who is Dame Lillard's number one guy in the media, there's no one close is now saying it on both sides. He's saying that Portland was willing to move him in certain scenario, and he's saying that Dame is tired of this ----. Right. So that's where we are two days before the And so it does feel more real than I believed before. But look, I don't. And what we saw with real deal deal, you know, I'm not counting on anything in this. We'll just see what it will plays out. But he also and as we close the other little sidebar, maybe we should make a T-shirt was they talked about subtle moves. Yeah. And we'll see if the subtle moves pay off, if we're if we're have some playoff moments from some subtle move players that may end up on a T-shirt. Possibly. Yeah, I was trying to figure out what the catchphrase was from Pat today, but I'm not sure he started talking about Garfield and Springsteen. I was trying to say that was the best I could do. Sorry. Yeah, I mean, I really feel like at this stage, 27 years of it, that he and Ira should be like a sitcom. Like, I feel like I feel like Pat and Ira, like the odd couple, like living in a two bedroom flat in Queens. Like, I just I don't know. I feel like people would watch that. Ira is like the Skip Bayless in that situation. No, no, no. I think there's respect there. It's just. Oh, for sure. There's just admiration. It's just like abusing Adam. It's just it's just the music. I will. I will say it. I will always give him credit for this to be able to sneak in a question about Omer Yurtsevin's on the grind qualifying offer at the end of the fat rally presser is I I'm sure Omer appreciated that. Anyway, check out our sponsors. Ocean's Finest dot com. That's Ocean's Finest dot com. Closure Investigative Agency. Price fix. Use that code five F.I.B. Thank you for listening to the five on the floor on the five regional sports network.